MBB: Duke 78, Southern 61 Post-Game Thread

[ncexnyc]

A really sluggish game, but I bet nobody turned it off

[CDu]

Bagley has had a double-double in every game except the MSU game where he was hurt.
Carter and Trent also with double-doubles today.

Trent actually fell just short of a double-double with just 8 points.

[DaleDuke7]

Great learning game for the team.

A couple of starters struggled to score but two freshman and nearly a third (ESPN stats) had double-double games. the 3pt shooting was way off (20%) but that was well compensated by points in the paint. Free throw shooting started off abysmally but then got better. Bolden got in and did well.

Hats off to Southern.

I don’t think Bolden did all that well. I thought he was aggressive on offense, but ultimately ineffective. There were several plays on defense where he either looked completely lost or very slow to react. I’m rooting for him big time but I can’t deny what my eyes see. I’m hoping it will “click” for him soon. But as of now, I see little to no difference from last year. Hopefully it’s just a mental issue.

[CDu]

Someone commented about how important fast-breaks and offensive rebounds will be. Well, this is what the offense looks like when we don’t force live-ball turnovers and don’t hit 3s.

Sloppy, choppy game, with a lot of youth on display. The half-court offense still has a ways to go yet.

Kudos to Southern for playing hard and smart (just 8 turnovers) and hitting some big shots.

Love the performance by Carter. Liked the performances by Duval and Bagley. Felt Bolden had some nice moments and showed good effort. DeLaurier had some wow plays. Allen had an off-night.

Ultimately, we won comfortably and nobody got hurt. That is all that I was looking for from this one.

[moonpie23]

Props to Southern. They brought the heat and knocked us back. Those guys hand a fire in them.


Next game.

[camion]

This was absolutely the best time to have a game like this. I’m pretty happy.

Southern played well. They shot some dagger threes and they forced the bigs to score from the free throw line as others will. We were a bit off after the MSU game, but produced a workmanlike win. Sometimes you have to just go out and win the game on uninspired nights.

Done.

[Chard]

I don’t think Bolden did all that well. I thought he was aggressive on offense, but ultimately ineffective. There were several plays on defense where he either looked completely lost or very slow to react. I’m rooting for him big time but I can’t deny what my eyes see. I’m hoping it will “click” for him soon. But as of now, I see little to no difference from last year. Hopefully it’s just a mental issue.

I disagree. He did mostly what I assume the coaches wanted him to do. On defense he hedged a lot up top which resulted in a couple of wide open lanes. The third time that happened the Duke player on the baseline stepped up and stopped the drive unlike the first two times. He did what he was asked.

He also was aggressive down low on offense. 2 rebounds, 4 points and no fouls in 11 minutes. He effected the game when he came in. I'll take that as a plus. Was that comparable, better or worse that DeLaurier's stat line?

[rsvman]

Coach K working on the man D. Letting the guys tough it out.

Too many turnovers, too many missed free throws. Lots of work to do on the man-to-man.

Carter was pretty dominant. Bagley was great, too, but he needs to learn how to finish with the right hand when the situation dictates it.

[OZ]

Someone commented about how important fast-breaks and offensive rebounds will be. Well, this is what the offense looks like when we don’t force live-ball turnovers and don’t hit 3s.

Sloppy, choppy game, with a lot of youth on display. The half-court offense still has a ways to go yet.

Kudos to Southern for playing hard and smart (just 8 turnovers) and hitting some big shots.

Love the performance by Carter. Liked the performances by Duval and Bagley. Felt Bolden had some nice moments and showed good effort. DeLaurier had some wow plays. Allen had an off-night.

Ultimately, we won comfortably and nobody got hurt. That is all that I was looking for from this one.

... and when coming off an important, emotional, stressful, physical national televised travel game just two days prior. Even the best are not up 100% of the time.
... and when Allen has a bad shooting night... particularly from the three. So far, through four games, my memory is, Allen is hitting almost 50% of our threes (17 of 35). Tonight, he was 0-6.
Which means, against tougher opponents, there are going to be nights when someone else is going to have to hit a three other than Allen.

[hsheffield]

Coach K working on the man D. Letting the guys tough it out.

Too many turnovers, too many missed free throws. Lots of work to do on the man-to-man.

Carter was pretty dominant. Bagley was great, too, but he needs to learn how to finish with the right hand when the situation dictates it.

Stats I saw said we had 15 turnovers. Is that true?

[devildeac]

Stats I saw said we had 15 turnovers. Is that true?

No problems as Sean May ate nine of them.

[subzero02]

I don’t think Bolden did all that well. I thought he was aggressive on offense, but ultimately ineffective. There were several plays on defense where he either looked completely lost or very slow to react. I’m rooting for him big time but I can’t deny what my eyes see. I’m hoping it will “click” for him soon. But as of now, I see little to no difference from last year. Hopefully it’s just a mental issue.

I essentially said the same thing during the in-game thread. There were several times tonight where he either reacted too slowly or was a few steps out of position to make a play on defense but failed to move to the more effective position. His ability to anticipate is somewhere between non-existent and minimal. He has plenty of chances to improve during the season since he'll be practicing against 2 of the best big men in the country. I'm not optimistic about a breakout game this year but I remain optimistic that one is somewhere on the horizon.

[uh_no]

Someone commented about how important fast-breaks and offensive rebounds will be. Well, this is what the offense looks like when we don’t force live-ball turnovers and don’t hit 3s.

Sloppy, choppy game, with a lot of youth on display. The half-court offense still has a ways to go yet.

Kudos to Southern for playing hard and smart (just 8 turnovers) and hitting some big shots.

Love the performance by Carter. Liked the performances by Duval and Bagley. Felt Bolden had some nice moments and showed good effort. DeLaurier had some wow plays. Allen had an off-night.

Ultimately, we won comfortably and nobody got hurt. That is all that I was looking for from this one.

I think to some degree, grayson was trying to let other people get involved. He could have attacked far more than he did if he needed to...but better help the other guys improve by forcing them to get it done.

That may be a big misread, but when grayson doesn't score for the first 18 minutes or whatever it is, it isn't because he's simply having a tough night. He doesn't need to light it up against southern to prove anything.

The defense is similar. Clearly we can play a decently effective zone...and if we played the same zone we did the other night, maybe we run out of the building...but we're not getting better by running southern out of the building...we get better by forcing ourselves to do the things we're less good at....because if we NEED to do them, we can.


Anyway, I'm less negative than a lot of people on the game tonight...and while of course I would like to see better play, I don't think the goal was to win by as much as possible.

[Kedsy]

Anyway, I'm less negative than a lot of people on the game tonight...and while of course I would like to see better play, I don't think the goal was to win by as much as possible.

I'm not negative so much as I think Southern may have provided the blueprint for the best way to try to beat Duke this season: limit the number of possessions, protect the ball, send us to the line, hit threes, and hope we miss threes. I'm not sure how many opponents are going to be able to accomplish all those things, but Southern sure did, so it can be done.

Possessions:
vs. Elon: 76.2
vs. UVU: 78.1
vs. MSU: 73.9
vs. Southern: 69.6

opponent TO rate:
vs. Elon: 20.2%
vs. UVU: 24.5%
vs. MSU: 22.5%
vs. Southern: 11.6%

Duke FT Rate:
vs. Elon: 14.9%
vs. UVU: 23.3%
vs. MSU: 38.2%
vs. Southern: 66.1% (!)

The free throw rate numbers show a mounting trend. As poorly as we shoot free throws, it's a trend that might continue.

Fortunately, Southern couldn't keep us off the offensive boards, and I'm not sure too many (if any) teams are going to be able to do that, either:

Duke OR%
vs. Elon: 39.5%
vs. UVU: 39.5%
vs. MSU: 52.1% (!)
vs. Southern: 47.5%

But we didn't do much else particularly well, and we still won by 17. Personally, I'm ready to move past it.

[dukefan_828]

At one point mid to late second half Gman was talking about calipari i was watching the game w a group of friends so i couldn't hear everything but in the same few moments after he said he didn't see the final four being something this team could achieve w such young talent bc they aren't as talented as this one. I'm pretty sure he was saying kentucky wasn't talented enough but would just like a conformation.. other than a cold shooting night witch i will just consider tired legs hangover and maybe a bit of looking past southern what i liked was

Wendell being a man child which i think we can count on with consistency, our best two way big man since the land lord? 6 blocks, 3 in one possession how demoralizing and embarrassing for the opposition! Also has great foot work and showed he's capable of stepping out and hitting from mid to 3 which is highly favored in the NBA but not so good if we where looking for him to stick around a while.. i'll take it!

Bags- Super athletic freak of nature, awesome!!

Was watching game w friends will be locking myself in man cave tomorrow morning to further dissect but i know this wasn't our best performance hence i could only give outstanding reports on two of our guys. A question i asked in previous thread but will here as well was what was the deal with sitting marquees for the first then giving major burn in second? I root very hard for marquees and badly want him to succeed, was K sending a message or just shaking things up meaning he is no longer the secured 1st big man option off the bench?

Forcing myself to watch Duke football tomorrow which may actually make time between furman game drag even more if we keep up our performances over the past 6 weeks, eeeek.

I LOVE THIS TIME OF YEAR!!!!!

[arnie]

At one point mid to late second half Gman was talking about calipari i was watching the game w a group of friends so i couldn't hear everything but in the same few moments after he said he didn't see the final four being something this team could achieve w such young talent bc they aren't as talented as this one. I'm pretty sure he was saying kentucky wasn't talented enough but would just like a conformation.. other than a cold shooting night witch i will just consider tired legs hangover and maybe a bit of looking past southern what i liked was

Wendell being a man child which i think we can count on with consistency, our best two way big man since the land lord? 6 blocks, 3 in one possession how demoralizing and embarrassing for the opposition! Also has great foot work and showed he's capable of stepping out and hitting from mid to 3 which is highly favored in the NBA but not so good if we where looking for him to stick around a while.. i'll take it!

Bags- Super athletic freak of nature, awesome!!

Was watching game w friends will be locking myself in man cave tomorrow morning to further dissect but i know this wasn't our best performance hence i could only give outstanding reports on two of our guys. A question i asked in previous thread but will here as well was what was the deal with sitting marquees for the first then giving major burn in second? I root very hard for marquees and badly want him to succeed, was K sending a message or just shaking things up meaning he is no longer the secured 1st big man option off the bench?

Forcing myself to watch Duke football tomorrow which may actually make time between furman game drag even more if we keep up our performances over the past 6 weeks, eeeek.

I LOVE THIS TIME OF YEAR!!!!!

I also only partially caught G-Mans comments on Final 4. Did a double take, then decided he may have been referring to only Kentucky as young and not enough talent to be there. If someone can rewind their VCR that will help.😎

[Spanarkel]

Duke practiced at 7:30am on Friday.

[tbyers11]

At one point mid to late second half Gman was talking about calipari i was watching the game w a group of friends so i couldn't hear everything but in the same few moments after he said he didn't see the final four being something this team could achieve w such young talent bc they aren't as talented as this one. I'm pretty sure he was saying kentucky wasn't talented enough but would just like a conformation..

Yes, Gminski was taking about Kentucky when he said he didn’t think they were likely to make it to the final four. Said that yes UK has always been really young since Cal focused on the one and dones. But that he thought UK didn’t have as much talent as in previous years in that youth.

[AGDukesky]

I agree with the G-man. This UK team is underwhelming. Kansas was playing short handed and UK has not looked convincing in any of its wins against mid-majors. Oh and if you are worried about Duke’s FT shooting, at least we didn’t go 3-15 like UK did last night. Basically UK has played every game at the level we played last night...

[Troublemaker]

At one point mid to late second half Gman was talking about calipari i was watching the game w a group of friends so i couldn't hear everything but in the same few moments after he said he didn't see the final four being something this team could achieve w such young talent bc they aren't as talented as this one. I'm pretty sure he was saying kentucky wasn't talented enough but would just like a confirmation...

Yep, GMan was talking about Kentucky.

Wendell being a man child which i think we can count on with consistency, our best two way big man since the land lord? 6 blocks, 3 in one possession how demoralizing and embarrassing for the opposition! Also has great foot work and showed he's capable of stepping out and hitting from mid to 3 which is highly favored in the NBA but not so good if we where looking for him to stick around a while.. i'll take it!

I would take it all the way back to Elton Brand. Wendell is bigger than Shelden, more explosive off the ground, more fluid with his post moves, a shooter with more long-distance range, and a much better passer than Shelden. However, I would not object hard with anyone taking a retired jersey great like Shelden over Wendell, who has only played 4 games so far. (But Wendell's certainly better than Shelden as a freshman.)