Taylor King

[CMS2478]

I thought his defense, rebounding, passing, and obviously his shooting last night warrented more minutes.....but hey who am I to judge.

[tweeze]

ya right now I think if King played as much as Singler he would put up a little bigger numbers. Why not try starting him along with Singler while we already have a defensive liability in the paint what teams bigs could guard either on of them and that could force the opposition to go to a zone and with our shooting guys like King, Paulus, and a hot Scheyer could tear a zone apart.

[AKG]

I agree that a frontcourt of singler and king would be nearly impossible to match up with. In addition to the potential for both to hit the three, they would provide driving lines for nelson and henderson by stretching the defense. I'm not going to start the coach k doesn't play enough guys argument, but I do think he is sometimes a little bit too punitive in terms of limiting playing time with freshman. I have seen some defense lapses from King, but I think the effort is definitely there.

[dukeENG2003]

Taylor is really hit or miss. He was TERRIBLE for the brief stretch when he saw action against Cornell. I think K plays him on nights when he's playing well, and not when he isn't, not much else to it IMO.

[CMS2478]

Taylor is really hit or miss. He was TERRIBLE for the brief stretch when he saw action against Cornell. I think K plays him on nights when he's playing well, and not when he isn't, not much else to it IMO.

Then why didn't he play more last night....was he not playing well?

[Classof06]

This is a huge mystery to me as well. I think Taylor, especially with Lance and Brian sidelined, needs to be getting A LOT more playing time. He the most efficient scorer on our team and his post defense is a lot better than I thought it would be coming into the season. Right now he averages 10 points a game in 13 minutes a game.

I think Nolan and Taylor should be playing more and Nolan has justifiably seen his minutes increase lately. I think it's time for Taylor to get his minutes...

[Bluedawg]

Defense probably. Some night it makes sense to limit his minutes, but last night he was shooting quite well, and had that sweet pass to Henderson. In a game when offense is hard to come by, I agree that sitting him was questionable.

And lets add 3 defensive rebounds in 12 minutes.

[DevilCastDownfromDurham]

Quote:

"Taylor is really hit or miss. He was TERRIBLE for the brief stretch when he saw action against Cornell. I think K plays him on nights when he's playing well, and not when he isn't, not much else to it IMO."


But, as other posters just mentioned, King struggled in his first few minutes of the Temple game as well. In the Temple game, however, K left him on the court and he found his way and gave us two absolute daggers as well as rebounding, playing solid (if not great) D, making some good passes, etc.

Look, there's no need to get into this debate again. K trusts some guys more than others based on practice, in-game performance, and a myriad of other factors. It ain't gonna change. Those guys who haven't sufficiently impressed K to make it past their first bad stretch can either work harder (a la Marty P), sulk a lot, or take their games elsewhere (MT, Boat, Boykin, et al).

One thing I love about Taylor is that, so far at least he seems to have taken critique and benching very well. In fact, Taylor has, for my money, had one of the best attitudes on the team. He has been a great lift when he's on the court, of course. But he is also often the first (at times last night the ONLY) guy on the bench to clap for a good on-court play, high-five guys coming to the bench, etc. The jump-and-bump between him and Nolan last night gave me a really positive feeling about the future of our team. We seem to be escaping the program-derailing Class of 2005 with the great attitudes and toughness of this year's class.

[ArtVandelay]

Another reason for Taylor's lack of PT is that he is, well, pretty slow. Watch the fast breaks - Taylor is usually the last guy down the floor. I vaguely remember that there was one break last night where someone took an outlet pass coast-to-coast for the layup (might've been DeMarcus or Nolan). Taylor was actually running that play, but our guard got down the floor so much faster that by the time he got to the basket, Taylor wasn't available to receive a pass. To the extent that we are getting out in transition a lot(which seems to be hit or miss...I think teams are adjusting to our running game and emphasizing getting back on D), Taylor might not fit well in that tempo.

I'm not saying that this should cut down on his PT necessarily. I'm just offering another plausible explanation. I was impressed by his dunk last night - not the greatest elevation ever, but it was nice to see that he can finish strong when needed.

[ArtVandelay]

Oh yeah, I also meant to say that for all the talk of Taylor "not having a conscience" with his shot, to quote the great Jay Bilas, I think lost a bit is the fact that Taylor is a bit of a chucker. It's good for him to shoot when he's open, but I think he's trying to force the offense a little bit at times, especially off the bounce. You almost get the impression that he's so used to scoring in bunches in high school that the idea of being on the floor without shooting a lot and scoring a lot of points kills him. He needs to learn to be a little more patient and do his thing, i.e. shoot the ball when open. He also needs to take a JJ crash course in moving without the ball to get himself open for the 3. With that kind of weapon, you need to find more ways to exploit it, and the head-fake dribble drive that JJ developed is not really in Taylor's arsenal right now.

[Nittany Devil]

Has anyone produced updated stats on the cumulative +/- per 40 minutes for each of our players? The bottom line is that we want players who generate more points than they allow. The +/- stats that Jumbo has kindly generated each game are far from a perfect metric, but I think that the cumulative stats could give some interesting information. For example, if these ideas about Taylor's liabilities such as poor defense or being too aggressive with his shot have merit, then we might expect to see his cumulative +/- per 40 minutes to be much lower than you would expect for someone who has such a high per minute scoring average. (I think we've seen evidence of this with Henderson in some games.) However, Taylor's +/- per 40 minutes were the highest on the team against Temple, and I think they are at or near the top of the team for the season. I think that gives some evidence that whatever liabilities King has, he is overcoming them with his prolific scoring.

I also agree with other posters about judging King's Cornell game. He played a total of what, 6 minutes? Even though he didn't look good at all, that's a pretty small sample. I agree that he made several mistakes, and I have no problem with Coach K taking him out of that game since he had other good options. I just would hesitate to say anyone had a terrible game with only 6 minutes of PT. But maybe that's just my perspective.

[Jumbo]

Has anyone produced updated stats on the cumulative +/- per 40 minutes for each of our players?

Uh, it's stickied up top: http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/...ead.php?t=4862

[Clipsfan]

Not counting Davidson, who doesn't play much, he easily has the best +/- per 40 of anyone on the team. I'm not quite sure what the exact reasons are for him not playing more (although he does make freshmen mistakes and has a tendency to test how "hot" he is if he makes a couple in a row), but I'm sure that K has a reason for what he's doing. Count me as one who wonders what his entire thought process is, but I'm not necessarily advocating that King play more. I'd just like to know more about why he doesn't, beyond the obvious speed/defense issues.

[Nittany Devil]

Uh, it's stickied up top: http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/...ead.php?t=4862

Thanks - I noticed it there the other day, and for some reason it just didn't register today. Guess I'm not thinking too straight today...

[Fish80]

When everyone is healthy, there just aren't that many more minutes for Taylor. Through 13 games, with one game going into overtime, there were 2625 minutes available. Here’s how the minutes were allocated.

DeMarcus Nelson 395
Jon Scheyer 363
Kyle Singler 348
Greg Paulus 346
Gerald Henderson 315
Lance Thomas 208
Nolan Smith 207
Taylor King 175
Brian Zoubek 140
David McClure 83
Marty Pocius 32
Jordan Davidson 13

Realistically, when Lance and Brian are back, Taylor won’t see any significant time at the 4 spot. So we are really talking about allocating time between DeMarcus, Jon, Gerald, David, and Taylor. Who’s minutes does he take?

[Jumbo]

I don't buy the idea that 12 minutes isn't playing much. That's more than a quarter of the game. That's a lot.
Three other things to keep in mind:
1) Does Taylor have the stamina to play extended minutes?
2) Taylor still struggled at times on D -- wouid that have been exposed even more with increased playing time?
3) Did Taylor's strengths/weaknesses mesh with Duke's strategy last night (especially on D, where Duke was applying heavy ball pressure, trying to force turnovers, switch on all screens, etc.)?

[Devilsfan]

The more he plays the better he'll get unlike some of the bigger guys who haven't improved much at all. Last time I checked the team with the most points wins and Taylor can give us points three at a time.

[OrangeDevil]

Having seen Taylor King play several times while he was at Mater Dei, I predicted he would be a solid contributor offensively at Duke. I also questioned his defensive quickness on the perimeter when matched against a shorter, thinner three. Inside, Taylor may be vulnerable against really big and strong fours. I suspect that this quandary accounts at least somewhat for the lack of bump in playing time. K is, rightfully, committed to tight man-to-man that emphasizes each defender's responsibility to contain his man.

That said, I am reminded of Bobby Knight's response when told that Michael Jordan could not be the first draft pick because the teams before Chicago needed centers. Knoght retorted: "So play him at center. He can guard some of them and none of them can guard him." Maybe the answer is to play Taylor against the bigs and allow him to outscore his opponent. I suspect he could hold his own on the boards.

[Jumbo]

The more he plays the better he'll get unlike some of the bigger guys who haven't improved much at all. Last time I checked the team with the most points wins and Taylor can give us points three at a time.

Huh?

[Patrick Yates]

With Taylor, there are certain strengths and weaknesses. Obviously, he can score. He is a game rebounder. He is a willing defender, if not super capable.

But, his athleticism is a problem. And it is not a problem that can be solved with his long arms. I am not talking about his defense. That is what it is. An athletic big or wing will have him for lunch. That may not change during his career. Where his athleticism can hurt Duke is on Offense. Like JJ, he will be susceptable against athletic defenders. Vs JJ, an athletic 6-3 to 6-6 could shut him down. Any shorter and he shot over, any taller and he would escape. Taylor's death zone will be the 6-5 to 6-8 range. A great example is Marcus Ginyard at UNC. He is a superb defender in the Nate James mold. He is an athletic 6-6 ish. If he is dedicated, he can completely shut Taylor down. King will have real trouble even getting the ball, much less getting off a shot. I like Taylor as a player. He can be great for us. But against teams with athletic defenders he will have trouble.

And if he is not hitting 3s, he really isn't doing enough otherwise to justify PT. I know that Cornell is not an example of a team with athletes, but Taylor wasn't hitting. When he isn't, he can't play. I think he should have gotten more of an opportunity than he did, but I wasn't at practice or in the huddle, so I don't know what happened.

Taylor will have to get more active on O, moving arround a la JJ to get more open looks.

In Summation, Taylor will have some great games. He will have some awful days. The one thing I doubt we will see from him is consistency. I really think it will be feast or famine, and there is no way to tell beforehand what it will be. I love debate, but I don't see this roller coaster ending this year.

This horse won't get any deader.

Patrick Yates