2018 Basketball Recruiting Thread

[Billy Dat]

This recruiting run is hard to believe. Can someone assure me that we haven't made a true deal with the Devil and the other shoe will drop at some point? I say that considering the Bagley reclassification/frequent school switching and the Reddish lunch with Lebron and Rich Paul. Can we assume K goes nowhere near those kids if there was something that could get the program in hot water? It just feels too good to be true, but one has to assume that if anyone could find any dirt on the program, they'd be happy to share it with the world, and that hasn't happened yet.

Aside from K's stature and the the recruiting prowess of the staff, is it simply K's full embrace of the 1 and done and enough kids being interested in that path that there was demand for programs outside of Kentucky? Obviously, Arizona and Kansas still pull their share. Whatever - it is so exciting, I just want to have my eyes wide open.

[sagegrouse]

This recruiting run is hard to believe. Can someone assure me that we haven't made a true deal with the Devil and the other shoe will drop at some point? I say that considering the Bagley reclassification/frequent school switching and the Reddish lunch with Lebron and Rich Paul. Can we assume K goes nowhere near those kids if there was something that could get the program in hot water? It just feels too good to be true, but one has to assume that if anyone could find any dirt on the program, they'd be happy to share it with the world, and that hasn't happened yet.

Aside from K's stature and the the recruiting prowess of the staff, is it simply K's full embrace of the 1 and done and enough kids being interested in that path that there was demand for programs outside of Kentucky? Obviously, Arizona and Kansas still pull their share. Whatever - it is so exciting, I just want to have my eyes wide open.

WE have done a deal with the Devil, but not the Blue Devil: it's called one-and-done. we get an reasonable number of the top 5-10 players but they rarely stay more than one season.

With respect to dodging the the bullets of recruits with problems or recruit violations, I believe (imagine, but what the hay!) (a) we have a clear cut set of rules and a constant debate about how to stay within the lines. I also believe (b) we are in constant contact with NCAA compliance, are open about our questions, and open about the problems with certain recruits. We then agree on how to proceed. NCAA is our business partner. Together we make a ton of money in basketball. There is every reason to openly work together on troublesome issues. And, of course, lying about something, is often ten times as bad as the violation itself (Bruce Pearl lied about a BBQ that cost a few hundred dollars at most and cost himself millions. Martha Stewart, in a different context, lied to the FBI over a stock trade that never would have resulted in criminal penalties and spent a couple of years in jail as a result.)

Maggette was received unallowed travel money BEFORE Duke was recruiting him and the problem was found out after he had left Duke. Lance Thomas appears to be a bizarre choice by a player without draft possibilities to use his own money, or family money, to make some purchases of jewelry,(which to me looked like polished coal) from a NYC store run an a Ukrainian national in the diamond district. The idea that some future agent coughed up the dough for such an wanted NBA prospect is ludicrous. Sometime later, while Lance was playing in the D league, there was a lawsuit filed to collect $100,000. It was settled -- presumably for much less. Inasmuch as personal money was used (unspent money from his college fund, which he gets legal control of), there was no NCAA issue.

[Indoor66]

Fran franchilla mention something seismic happening in recruiting. Anybody thinking stones,cam,rj and williamson. Think garland is vandy or iu heard maybe package with romeo. I think little and emmit is out. And I don't see David m. A dukie either.

What does this mean in English & who are these names/people you seem to reference?

[budwom]

What does this mean in English & who are these names/people you seem to reference?

just buy an Enigma machine from a museum and it's clear. One of these days it will be K retiring...nothing else is seismic...(I do understand the note, but it's not worth the bother of translating)...

[superdave]

Seems like a good time to re-list our additional targets for this class. I've got ...

RJ Barrett, SF #1
Zion Williamson, SF, #2
Darius Garland, PG, #8
Emmitt Williams, PF, #20
David McCormick, C, #42

Duke is probably out for Immanuel Quickley and Nassir Little, right?

Anyone else missing from that list? Seems like they may target another big guy in case Williams and McCormick look elsewhere.

[budwom]

Seems like a good time to re-list our additional targets for this class. I've got ...

RJ Barrett, SF #1
Zion Williamson, SF, #2
Darius Garland, PG, #8
Emmitt Williams, PF, #20
David McCormick, C, #42

Duke is probably out for Immanuel Quickley and Nassir Little, right?

Anyone else missing from that list? Seems like they may target another big guy in case Williams and McCormick look elsewhere.

Yeah, that's what it looks like...

[richardjackson199]

Seems like a good time to re-list our additional targets for this class. I've got ...

RJ Barrett, SF #1
Zion Williamson, SF, #2
Darius Garland, PG, #8
Emmitt Williams, PF, #20
David McCormick, C, #42

Duke is probably out for Immanuel Quickley and Nassir Little, right?

Anyone else missing from that list? Seems like they may target another big guy in case Williams and McCormick look elsewhere.

Thanks for update. I didn't realize we were out of it with Little. I'll be ecstatic if we can get Barrett and Garland. If we do, I'd guess the prospect of playing with that unselfish, ball-moving super-team would attract a quality big or two. We could not be off to a better start with this class (or finish with the last one).

[Troublemaker]

Duke would love to have both Reddish and Barrett, both of whom are versatile enough to play multiple positions.

Reddish posted "DUKE!" in reply to Barrett's latest instagram (scroll down): https://www.instagram.com/p/BYhFXBsA...n-by=rjbarrett

[richardjackson199]

Reddish posted "DUKE!" in reply to Barrett's latest instagram (scroll down): https://www.instagram.com/p/BYhFXBsA...n-by=rjbarrett

Love it. Cam is all-in for our TEAM and is already recruiting R.J. and telling him he wants to play with him. Jones, Reddish, and Garland have talked about wanting to play together, so safe to assume he's recruiting Darius as well.

I really like this kid already. He's earning his first name. We'll see if R.J. can do the same.

[lotusland]

WE have done a deal with the Devil, but not the Blue Devil: it's called one-and-done. we get an reasonable number of the top 5-10 players but they rarely stay more than one season.

With respect to dodging the the bullets of recruits with problems or recruit violations, I believe (imagine, but what the hay!) (a) we have a clear cut set of rules and a constant debate about how to stay within the lines. I also believe (b) we are in constant contact with NCAA compliance, are open about our questions, and open about the problems with certain recruits. We then agree on how to proceed. NCAA is our business partner. Together we make a ton of money in basketball. There is every reason to openly work together on troublesome issues. And, of course, lying about something, is often ten times as bad as the violation itself (Bruce Pearl lied about a BBQ that cost a few hundred dollars at most and cost himself millions. Martha Stewart, in a different context, lied to the FBI over a stock trade that never would have resulted in criminal penalties and spent a couple of years in jail as a result.)

Maggette was received unallowed travel money BEFORE Duke was recruiting him and the problem was found out after he had left Duke. Lance Thomas appears to be a bizarre choice by a player without draft possibilities to use his own money, or family money, to make some purchases of jewelry,(which to me looked like polished coal) from a NYC store run an a Ukrainian national in the diamond district. The idea that some future agent coughed up the dough for such an wanted NBA prospect is ludicrous. Sometime later, while Lance was playing in the D league, there was a lawsuit filed to collect $100,000. It was settled -- presumably for much less. Inasmuch as personal money was used (unspent money from his college fund, which he gets legal control of), there was no NCAA issue.

When it comes to talented OAD recruits, it appears that the clear cut rule-set is the NCAA eligibility minimum standards with some base assumptions that he can be expected not to commit a violent crime and maintain eligibility for 1 or hopefully 2 semesters. I'm not sure there is any noticeable difference in recruiting for Duke basketball than for SEC football. If elevated standards ever existed I'd say we've strayed far from home. Media currently reporting that other coaches are openly questioning how the latest recruit could possibly graduate in three years of HS at 3 different schools and one with questionable academic credentials. Likewise I read admiration expressed at how Coach Capel orchestrated this coup in such a way that only Duke could get away with. As a well known former daily tar-heel editor once wrote, "O lost".

[richardjackson199]

When it comes to talented OAD recruits, it appears that the clear cut rule-set is the NCAA eligibility minimum standards with some base assumptions that he can be expected not to commit a violent crime and maintain eligibility for 1 or hopefully 2 semesters. I'm not sure there is any noticeable difference in recruiting for Duke basketball than for SEC football. If elevated standards ever existed I'd say we've strayed far from home. Media currently reporting that other coaches are openly questioning how the latest recruit could possibly graduate in three years of HS at 3 different schools and one with questionable academic credentials. Likewise I read admiration expressed at how Coach Capel orchestrated this coup in such a way that only Duke could get away with. As a well known former daily tar-heel editor once wrote, "O lost".

I'm not sure what you're implying, but if you're comparing Duke's standards to the carolina way of having their players do no school work while training, then I take offense.

Of course other coaches are going to whine. They've long been jealous of Duke, K, and our incredible coaching staff. Media are currently "reporting" a lot of things that maybe can't be taken at face value.

K's tenure and integrity have earned a little benefit of the doubt in terms of propriety.

Dude. ?

[Olympic Fan]

Duke is probably out for Immanuel Quickley and Nassir Little, right?

First, we've been "out" for Quickley for some time ... but as far as I know, we're still pursuing Little. Have you got any different news. Or is that comment based on the fact that Little is a small forward and might be scared off by Reddish. Certainly if Duke adds Barrett (a distinct possibility), that might make a big wing think ... but if we don't get Barrett, Reddish and Little would make a nice pair and could play together a lot.

Little is still scheduled to visit Duke, right. Or have you seen that visit cancelled? Obviously, if I were him, I'd wait to see what Barrett does, but I wouldn't rule Duke out.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

I'm not sure what you're implying, but if you're comparing Duke's standards to the carolina way of having their players do no school work while training, then I take offense.

Of course other coaches are going to whine. They've long been jealous of Duke, K, and our incredible coaching staff. Media are currently "reporting" a lot of things that maybe can't be taken at face value.

K's tenure and integrity have earned a little benefit of the doubt in terms of propriety.

Dude. ?

In defense of OP, there was no implicit comparison to the UNC scandal. Additionally, I think it's fair to ask some of these difficult questions of our program. Don't we want to be certain that Duke is doing things the "right way?"

[richardjackson199]

In defense of OP, there was no implicit comparison to the UNC scandal. Additionally, I think it's fair to ask some of these difficult questions of our program. Don't we want to be certain that Duke is doing things the "right way?"

Maybe I'm naive, but I am certain Duke is doing things the right way.

I think it's pretty safe to assume that Bagley graduated from high school yesterday because he did the work necessary to do so. I think it's pretty safe to assume K and Duke are certain of that.

Tarheels were getting A's in college classes for doing absolutely nothing. The OP compared K's program losing it's way to the carolina way being "o lost". Wainstein showed that way was "o lost" for o very long time. In contrast, K has shown steadfast integrity for a very long time.

It's also safe to assume that if there was dirt to find on K and Duke, that in today's environment somebody would find it and it would be viral in minutes. K and Duke know that.

Just my opinion, but I honestly think at this point it's a little unfair to ask some of these difficult questions of our program, because we have no basis to do so. OTOH, K has plenty of track record and basis to assume he has been doing things the right way. I'm sure he expects rival coaches to put this crap out there. But I'd think he'd be a little annoyed at this point if his fanbase was insinuating that he was running a shady program.

K has adapted to the current OAD landscape to keep us on top. I respect that some Duke fans disagree with that approach for good reason. But that is different than insinuating that Duke has lost it's way of doing things ethically. If I read the post wrong, then my sincere apologies.

Just my 2 cents.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Maybe I'm naive, but I am certain Duke is doing things the right way.

I think it's pretty safe to assume that Bagley graduated from high school yesterday because he did the work necessary to do so. I think it's pretty safe to assume K and Duke are certain of that.

It's also safe to assume that if there was dirt to find on K and Duke, that in today's environment somebody would find it and it would be viral in minutes. K and Duke know that.

Just my opinion, but I honestly think at this point it's a little unfair to ask some of these difficult questions of our program, because we have no basis to do so. OTOH, K has plenty of track record and basis to assume he has been doing things the right way. I'm sure he expects rival coaches to put this crap out there. But I'd think he'd be a little annoyed at this point if his fanbase was insinuating that he was running a shady program.

Just my 2 cents.

I guess it is a fine line between "questioning" and "insinuating." That's a fair point. I just get wary when people blindly assume that there's no reason to even ask the important questions. I also am inclined to believe things are done the right way, but I have no issue if someone wants to inquire about particulars.

Blind belief without questions is where fanaticism comes in. And "fan" is short for "fanatic, " so... maybe I am the unreasonable one.

[hallcity]

Maybe I'm naive, but I am certain Duke is doing things the right way.

I think it's pretty safe to assume that Bagley graduated from high school yesterday because he did the work necessary to do so. I think it's pretty safe to assume K and Duke are certain of that.

It's also safe to assume that if there was dirt to find on K and Duke, that in today's environment somebody would find it and it would be viral in minutes. K and Duke know that.

Just my opinion, but I honestly think at this point it's a little unfair to ask some of these difficult questions of our program, because we have no basis to do so. OTOH, K has plenty of track record and basis to assume he has been doing things the right way. I'm sure he expects rival coaches to put this crap out there. But I'd think he'd be a little annoyed at this point if his fanbase was insinuating that he was running a shady program.

Just my 2 cents.

I know that after the UNC scandal emerged then President Brodhead said he had asked for a meeting with the AD and others from the athletic department to make sure nothing like that could happen at Duke. He said he was stunned at the extent of the controls and precautions already in place to make sure things stayed within NCAA and university bounds. He said he was satisfied that Duke was doing all it could. However, where humans are involved, mistakes and worse are always possible.

[richardjackson199]

I guess it is a fine line between "questioning" and "insinuating." That's a fair point. I just get wary when people blindly assume that there's no reason to even ask the important questions. I also am inclined to believe things are done the right way, but I have no issue if someone wants to inquire about particulars.

Blind belief without questions is where fanaticism comes in. And "fan" is short for "fanatic, " so... maybe I am the unreasonable one.

Very good and fair points. We would be foolish to think Duke is immune to make mistakes. The meeting Brodhead called was wise. Continuing to candidly self-examine and ask these questions is wise.

I was pretty giddy and yes, fanatically pleased about how our staff is recruiting this morning. So reading something from our fanbase that I thought compared the Duke way to the Carolina way just caught me off guard - especially after landing a seemingly high-character kid like Cam Reddish.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Very good and fair points. We would be foolish to think Duke is immune to make mistakes. The meeting Brodhead called was wise. Continuing to candidly self-examine and ask these questions is wise.

I was pretty giddy and yes, fanatically pleased about how our staff is recruiting this morning. So reading something from our fanbase that I thought compared the Duke way to the Carolina way just caught me off guard - especially after landing a seemingly high-character kid like Cam Reddish.

Yes, it is a strange way to mark a rather momentous recruiting decision.

Additionally, what might be the biggest difference of all between Duke and UNC fans, is that I believe if a scandal even close to the scope of the UNC one were to happen at Duke, many of us here (most of us?) would be disgusted and disappointed rather than defending the institution for years at a time in the face of thousands of damning pages of evidence.
Personally, I would have to take some time away from college sports and reexamine exactly what I am rooting for.

[sagegrouse]

When it comes to talented OAD recruits, it appears that the clear cut rule-set is the NCAA eligibility minimum standards with some base assumptions that he can be expected not to commit a violent crime and maintain eligibility for 1 or hopefully 2 semesters. I'm not sure there is any noticeable difference in recruiting for Duke basketball than for SEC football. If elevated standards ever existed I'd say we've strayed far from home. Media currently reporting that other coaches are openly questioning how the latest recruit could possibly graduate in three years of HS at 3 different schools and one with questionable academic credentials. Likewise I read admiration expressed at how Coach Capel orchestrated this coup in such a way that only Duke could get away with. As a well known former daily tar-heel editor once wrote, "O lost".

I wouldn't accept your assertion about standards vis a vis SEC footbll. Academic A-A in recent years include Paulus, Marshall Plumlee, Grayson, Chase Jeter. All-ACC academic adds Jabari, Tyus, Justise, and Amile. Three of these are OAD players. You know, when I hear Duke basketball players speak publicly, they sound like intelligent, educated young men. I can't say that for most schools.

With respect to Mr. Bagley, the accelerated pace of his recruitment and entry to college is a bit shocking, isn't it? At the same time, there are widespread reports that he maintained a 4.0 average for much of his HS. And, we don't know his compete academic picture (test scores, etc.) or the other factors beyond basketball that might come into account.

[richardjackson199]

Yes, it is a strange way to mark a rather momentous recruiting decision.

Additionally, what might be the biggest difference of all between Duke and UNC fans, is that I believe if a scandal even close to the scope of the UNC one were to happen at Duke, many of us here (most of us?) would be disgusted and disappointed rather than defending the institution for years at a time in the face of thousands of damning pages of evidence.
Personally, I would have to take some time away from college sports and reexamine exactly what I am rooting for.

Personally, I would be disgusted, devastated, and demanding we take full responsibility. I would expect us to pay the full consequences, even if it decimated our program. I would expect us to do all we could to take the necessary steps to make sure it never happened again. If we did that, and I hope we would, then I'd continue to root hard for Duke.

But as they say, even though it's good to learn from your mistakes, it's better to learn from others' mistakes. Hopefully we'll continue to make sure we never go there.