PG Dylan Ennis (Tyler's bro) leaving Villanova

[Kedsy]

^^^^This.

I had read somewhere (not sure where) that Thornton was considering redshirting if he did reclassify. Not sure if that was 100% the truth where I read it from, but can anyone else shed light on that?

From the sounds of Ennis though, he sounds solid. In all seriousness, I just want a PG. Not just last year, but in years past, when we've had a legit PG handling the ball (Scheyer in 2010 and Nolan when Irving was out in 2011 still counts IMO) we flourish. I've always said if Kyrie didn't go down that year, and if he would have been healthy all year long, who knows, might have been back to back. Our Title teams have had a good PG handling the ball.

1991/1992 - Bobby Hurley
2001 - Jason Williams
2010 - Jon Scheyer (He really became one that year, regardless of what anyone says)
2015 - Tyus Jones/Quinn Cook

So really, that PG gives us that extra push.

This is just my opinion though.

Wait, I thought all our title teams have had versatile future NBA small forwards playing great defense and presenting matchup problems for opponents? Or was it that all our title teams have had extraordinary centers? Sorry, I must be a little confused.

Fact is, our title teams have all had really good players at multiple positions, which is one of the main reasons they were title teams. It's unlikely that any one position is either necessary or sufficient to win a title.

Also, we've had teams with great PGs that didn't come close to a title: 1987 (senior Tommy Amaker) and 1993 (senior Bobby Hurley) come to mind. And we've had teams get very close to a title without a star PG giving us "that extra push," for example 1994 (freshman Jeff Capel) and 1988 (junior Quin Snyder). I mean, did Scotty Thurman make that winning three-pointer in 1994 because we lacked a true PG?

Would it be better to have a great PG than not? Sure. But the rest of it doesn't really mean that much.

Also, you possibly heard about Thornton thinking about redshirting right here on DBR. I believe it has been discussed in both the 2015 recruiting thread and the D. Thornton thread.

[MCFinARL]

Wait a minute, we have a chance to have two former Rice players (Sean Obi) on our team at the same time.

"Duke, the Rice of the South!"

I am now convinced this has to happen.

Um, isn't Rice the Rice of the South? Maybe "Duke, the Rice of the southern Mid-Atlantic!"

[neemizzle]

Wait, I thought all our title teams have had versatile future NBA small forwards playing great defense and presenting matchup problems for opponents? Or was it that all our title teams have had extraordinary centers? Sorry, I must be a little confused.

Fact is, our title teams have all had really good players at multiple positions, which is one of the main reasons they were title teams. It's unlikely that any one position is either necessary or sufficient to win a title.

Also, we've had teams with great PGs that didn't come close to a title: 1987 (senior Tommy Amaker) and 1993 (senior Bobby Hurley) come to mind. And we've had teams get very close to a title without a star PG giving us "that extra push," for example 1994 (freshman Jeff Capel) and 1988 (junior Quin Snyder). I mean, did Scotty Thurman make that winning three-pointer in 1994 because we lacked a true PG?

Would it be better to have a great PG than not? Sure. But the rest of it doesn't really mean that much.

Also, you possibly heard about Thornton thinking about redshirting right here on DBR. I believe it has been discussed in both the 2015 recruiting thread and the D. Thornton thread.

Haha, you got me. I was dumb and didn't really pay attention to what I was posting! Hahaha! +1!

[langdonfan]

Just an update, a couple of reports earlier tonight indicated that Ennis has dropped Purdue from his list. Down to seven...

[dukelifer]

Wait, I thought all our title teams have had versatile future NBA small forwards playing great defense and presenting matchup problems for opponents? Or was it that all our title teams have had extraordinary centers? Sorry, I must be a little confused.

Fact is, our title teams have all had really good players at multiple positions, which is one of the main reasons they were title teams. It's unlikely that any one position is either necessary or sufficient to win a title.

Also, we've had teams with great PGs that didn't come close to a title: 1987 (senior Tommy Amaker) and 1993 (senior Bobby Hurley) come to mind. And we've had teams get very close to a title without a star PG giving us "that extra push," for example 1994 (freshman Jeff Capel) and 1988 (junior Quin Snyder). I mean, did Scotty Thurman make that winning three-pointer in 1994 because we lacked a true PG?

Would it be better to have a great PG than not? Sure. But the rest of it doesn't really mean that much.

Also, you possibly heard about Thornton thinking about redshirting right here on DBR. I believe it has been discussed in both the 2015 recruiting thread and the D. Thornton thread.

I am pretty sure we lost in 1994 because Antonio Lang cut his finger nails the night before the finals.

[porkpa]

There is something about a kid who deserts not one, but two programs that places a question mark in my mind. I hope its just a question of circumstances and not character.

[Henderson]

There is something about a kid who deserts not one, but two programs that places a question mark in my mind. I hope its just a question of circumstances and not character.

Maybe it poses the initial question, but if the question is satisfactorily answered, it's not an issue, and in this case I think that question has been answered sufficiently. Good guy, good family, graduating from Villanova this spring, just looking to set himself up better for life after college. If there were a character issue, I don't think Duke would be recruiting him.

If I were hiring for my company, and an applicant had spent 1 year at one job then 3 years at his most recent job, I wouldn't question his or her character for that reason alone.

Plus look at this guy's shoulders. With Justise gone, Coach K could use a replacement player on whose shoulders one could land a fighter jet.

[Duke95]

There is something about a kid who deserts not one, but two programs that places a question mark in my mind. I hope its just a question of circumstances and not character.

So, did you do anything to investigate this "question mark" in your mind?

[tallguy]

There is something about a kid who deserts not one, but two programs that places a question mark in my mind. I hope its just a question of circumstances and not character.

I hate this sort of reasoning. First off, he's not "deserting" Villanova- he graduated. There's literally no reason to stick around at a school after you graduate if they are not going to further your career goals. Villanova is not going to use him as a point guard, the position he has to play in order to make a career out of basketball, so why on earth would he waste a precious year of his (limited) career potential there? Second, regarding his first transfer...he had a chance to go from Rice to freaking Villanova. That's a huge opportunity in terms of exposure and competition level that any potential professional basketball player would be lucky to receive.

People need to stop vilifying transfers...there is absolutely nothing inherently wrong with transferring. Yes, there are serial transferers, but most the time it's simply a fit issue- maybe the coach left/got fired, maybe they don't like being so far from home, a better situation opened up, or a myriad of other reasons. It's their decision (at least, outside of the ridiculous amount of power the school has to block the transfer), and these young ADULTS should be able to decide where they want to play. You wouldn't begrudge a normal student transferring from Villanova to Harvard, would you?

[Duke95]

Maybe it poses the initial question, but if the question is satisfactorily answered, it's not an issue, and in this case I think that question has been answered sufficiently. Good guy, good family, graduating from Villanova this spring, just looking to set himself up better for life after college. If there were a character issue, I don't think Duke would be recruiting him.

Exactly.

[MarkD83]

This discussion is rather comical.

On the one hand we talk about how great college is and that players regardless of talent level should stay as long as possible because getting an education is a good thing and playing for someone like Coach K will further improve their basketball skills.

Then we question the character of players who still want to use all of their eligibility, stay in college to take more classes and improve their basketball skills by playing for a great coach.

I think we should applaud all of the players like Dylan who already have their college degrees and still want to play in college.

Dylan, I like the way you think and you need to attend Duke to be coached by the best BBall coach in the world who has coached two olympic champions, two world champions and Five NCAA National Champions. And by the way I do believe there are plenty of really good graduate departments at Duke so you should be able to find a course or two that are top notch.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Wonder if Thornton's commit takes Ennis out of the picture

[CDu]

This discussion is rather comical.

On the one hand we talk about how great college is and that players regardless of talent level should stay as long as possible because getting an education is a good thing and playing for someone like Coach K will further improve their basketball skills.

Then we question the character of players who still want to use all of their eligibility, stay in college to take more classes and improve their basketball skills by playing for a great coach.

I think we should applaud all of the players like Dylan who already have their college degrees and still want to play in college.

Dylan, I like the way you think and you need to attend Duke to be coached by the best BBall coach in the world who has coached two olympic champions, two world champions and Five NCAA National Champions. And by the way I do believe there are plenty of really good graduate departments at Duke so you should be able to find a course or two that are top notch.

To be fair, nobody is criticizing him for wanting to use all of his eligibility. The criticism (and it certainly appears to be from a limited group, and not overly critical anyway) is that he is choosing to use all of his eligibility at a place other than the place he has spent the last 3 years. No reason he couldn't spend that fourth year of eligibility while continuing his education at Villanova.

That said, I completely agree that one shouldn't necessarily be frowned upon for seeking to maximize one's opportunities given the available within-the-rules options.

Regardless, I suspect that it is a moot point now that we have Thornton on board. I can't imagine he'd want to transfer to another situation with questionable opportunity to start at PG.

[duke blue brewcrew]

Wonder if Thornton's commit takes Ennis out of the picture

I was wondering the same thing. Even with an Ingram committment, I believe Duke have the roster room to work it, if Ennis still wants to come. The Blue Devils could really use the depth at the PG spot IMO.

[Oriole Way]

Wonder if Thornton's commit takes Ennis out of the picture

I don't think there's any chance of Ennis coming to Duke now. He wants to play in the NBA, and to do that, he is best-served showcasing himself at a school where he can start and get maximum minutes. That's no longer likely at Duke with Thornton on board.

In fact, continuing to pursue Ennis will likely contradict the staff's pitch to Thornton. I expect Duke to politely let Ennis know they are no longer interested, although it will be a mutual loss of interest by both the school and the player.

[CDu]

I was wondering the same thing. Even with an Ingram committment, I believe Duke have the roster room to work it, if Ennis still wants to come. The Blue Devils could really use the depth at the PG spot IMO.

With or without Ingram, I would think it is unlikely Ennis would be interested now. He appears to be seeking the opportunity to be the starting PG (something he wasn't going to get at Villanova). With Thornton on board, that opportunity becomes much more questionable at Duke. So while we'd have the space for him, I don't think we'll have the role for him.

[JasonEvans]

Wonder if Thornton's commit takes Ennis out of the picture

While I don't have any official inside info, I believe that Duke wanted either Thornton or Ennis, not both. Plus, Ennis wants a situation where he will be able to play 30 or so minutes per game at PG. That is going to be difficult at Duke with Thornton on board (I expect Thornton to play 20-25 mpg with the rest going to Grayson and/or Kennard).

-Jason "if Ennis and Duke still want each other, that would be fabulous, but I now suspect it will not happen" Evans

[Troublemaker]

This thread is approaching lockable, imo. But might as well wait for Ennis to cut Duke from his list.

From the ESPN article about Derryck's verbal to Duke:

"Last night, Coach K [Mike Krzyzewski] and [assistant] Jeff Capel came in for the visit and they told me how much confidence they have in me to be their point guard next year. They were very prepared about my game and their plan for me.

"They told me they could have went after fifth-year transfers but wanted me instead. I am excited about the opportunity and the challenge."

[mr. synellinden]

So we're sure this is not the reclassify, commit and redshirt plan that was rumored earlier. Meaning if he qualifies by taking the SAT and enrolls, he expects to play next year, not redshirt? That would have been the only scenario where I could see us going after Ennis as well.

Also, I wonder what impact this might have on Dennis Smith's recruitment - he might now want to wait and see if Thornton goes pro after a year (do people think that's possible? For a top 10-20 PG recruit, I think that would be less common but not out of the realm of possibility) -- or he might think that the Cook - Jones backcourt did pretty well, and maybe that's a blueprint for Smith and Thornton to play alongside one another (it also worked out pretty well for Dawkins and Amaker and Williams and Duhon).

[Oriole Way]

So we're sure this is not the reclassify, commit and redshirt plan that was rumored earlier. Meaning if he qualifies by taking the SAT and enrolls, he expects to play next year, not redshirt? That would have been the only scenario where I could see us going after Ennis as well.

Also, I wonder what impact this might have on Dennis Smith's recruitment - he might now want to wait and see if Thornton goes pro after a year (do people think that's possible? For a top 10-20 PG recruit, I think that would be less common but not out of the realm of possibility) -- or he might think that the Cook - Jones backcourt did pretty well, and maybe that's a blueprint for Smith and Thornton to play alongside one another (it also worked out pretty well for Dawkins and Amaker and Williams and Duhon).

The ESPN story on Thornton's commitment clearly states that Thornton will reclassify to play next season. No redshirt.