FB: Duke 41, KU 3

[loran16]

A word on the schedule. Keep in mind that when the Kansas game was scheduled, no one knew that Kansas would be this weak. This was the return game from a 2009 game in Lawrence, won by Kansas 44-16. So, that's a 66-point turnaround in four seasons.

Kansas was 12-1 as recently as 2007. Mangino unraveled shortly after that and Turner Gill was a disaster. But Duke's last 12 win season was never. Duke won 13 games combined in the nine seasons before Cutcliffe game on board. So Weis had a major rebuilding project to be sure but nowhere near the one faced by Cutcliffe.

And not a single person I talked to in the press box thought that Kansas looked like a well-coached or well-prepared football team.

Yeah, no one is saying that this stretch was intentionally this weak - if i recall correctly, Troy was also a last minute add on to the schedule the last two years when the ACC moved from planning 9 conference games back to the original 8, forcing a needed OOC game to be found.

That said, it's undoubtedly the weakest stretch we've had in a LONG time. Sagarin has us at 188th in terms of schedule including D1-AA teams in its rankings, and easily the worst in the ACC. Tulane isn't that much better per Sagarin.

[killerleft]

I have season tickets in the upper part of section 9 (one of the employee ticket sections, aka the blue seats).

While definitely not as well attended as the opener against Elon, turnout, from my vantage point was decent, especially in the first half, before the sun started cooking us on the "visitors'" side. (From where I sat, the student sections were not nearly as full as I'd like.)

I'm curious to see what it looked like, from the TV perspective.

I also wonder if the horribly uncomfortable seats contributed to the apparently low turnout on the blue side -- if you're over 5'8", the seat in front of you will be digging into your knees/shins (and it's worse if someone's actually sitting in the seat in-front of you, not to mention the lack of clearance when someone wants to walk in/out from the middle of the row).

I've been afraid of this. Perhaps I'll be able to wander over there from my Cutcliffe's Corner seat (a nice, attractive upgrade from Family Plan, by the way) during the Tulane game and give them a try. Better yet, maybe folks can fill that side up so I won't be able to find an empty seat!

[uh_no]

fwiw:

we're up to 27th in the AP poll, behind unc at 26

[CameronBornAndBred]

We had to make an obligatory stop by the True Blue Cue Crew tent to say hello to CameronBornAndBred, Devildeac, and other cohorts involved in making their gameday gastronomical orgies such a success. Maybe next time we'll actually have time to eat some food! We had good seats; for the first time ever after going to countless games in Wallace Wade, I sat in the Duke alumni box at the closed end of the horseshoe. Fortunately for others "more exposed", the somewhat threatening clouds never opened up.

I truly enjoyed meeting your dad. It was great to see you both be able to make it out to the game.
For those lamenting the attendance, consider these factors. The forecast called for rain, the game was on TV, and the line was a healthy Duke victory. That isn't the best recipe for making it out to see a blowout in person. I've been in Cameron many times to experience a proportionally similar atmosphere during a bad weather / not standout opponent combo. Those that stayed home missed out, however; it was truly a great day to be on campus.
I think with the ACC season just a couple games away, we'll see WW well filled with the true blue colors that we love.
One last thought...what was up with Will Monday's punts? At least two in a row went sailing into the benches, way short. Ugh. I loved our defense yesterday, but it would have been nice to not present such field position before they even snap the ball.

[uh_no]

One last thought...what was up with Will Monday's punts? At least two in a row went sailing into the benches, way short. Ugh. I loved our defense yesterday, but it would have been nice to not present such field position before they even snap the ball.

the only thing i could think was that maybe the ball was damp...but he's been very reliable...so long as this doesn't become a pattern, I'm not too worried.

and even with that we still only gave up 3 points

[Son of Jarhead]

I have season tickets in the upper part of section 9 (one of the employee ticket sections, aka the blue seats).

While definitely not as well attended as the opener against Elon, turnout, from my vantage point was decent, especially in the first half, before the sun started cooking us on the "visitors'" side. (From where I sat, the student sections were not nearly as full as I'd like.)

I'm curious to see what it looked like, from the TV perspective.

I also wonder if the horribly uncomfortable seats contributed to the apparently low turnout on the blue side -- if you're over 5'8", the seat in front of you will be digging into your knees/shins (and it's worse if someone's actually sitting in the seat in-front of you, not to mention the lack of clearance when someone wants to walk in/out from the middle of the row).

IDK, Jarhead & I found we liked the seats. Of course, we leased those installed cushions Duke was advertising, which did make them much more comfortable. I do think your 5'8" limit is a little off, I'm 6'0" and sitting normally, I had a an inch to spare for knee room. Still not great, I know, but often when someone was sitting in front of us in past years on the bleachers, their back was often hitting my knees, so in that regard, I don't see much difference in knee room. And as Duke_92 pointed out, it is not so bad getting out by people if they stand. The thing that made us actually like the seats was that our backs didn't hurt after the game like they usually did in the past. The sun is brutal on that side, and I worry the dark seats will make it even hotter. I for one would love it if the new press tower were 50 stories tall and stretched from the back of the end-zone to the back of the end-zone!! All in all, I don't see how they could do any better than these seats with the way the stadium is built, just no way to place the rows any father apart. Leaving the whole stadium with bleachers would not be a good idea. It does appear that only 8 sections per side will have seats, with the rest still bleachers, which I think is smart.

I do hope more people will start to come to the games. There is just so much competition out there for peoples Saturday afternoon/evening entertainment attention. Winning helps, as will the renovations when complete. Jarhead & I talked about all this last week and he recalls that when we used to fill the stadium all the time, it was due to support from the Durham community. There aren't enough students to make much of a dent, we need more alumni and employees, and more Durhamites.

[jimsumner]

A word on the schedule. Keep in mind that when the Kansas game was scheduled, no one knew that Kansas would be this weak. This was the return game from a 2009 game in Lawrence, won by Kansas 44-16. So, that's a 66-point turnaround in four seasons.

Kansas was 12-1 as recently as 2007. Mangino unraveled shortly after that and Turner Gill was a disaster. But Duke's last 12 win season was never. Duke won 13 games combined in the nine seasons before Cutcliffe game on board. So Weis had a major rebuilding project to be sure but nowhere near the one faced by Cutcliffe.

And not a single person I talked to in the press box thought that Kansas looked like a well-coached or well-prepared football team.

For those of you keeping score at home, 2009 was five years ago.

Back to your regular programming.

[Wander]

A word on the schedule. Keep in mind that when the Kansas game was scheduled, no one knew that Kansas would be this weak. This was the return game from a 2009 game in Lawrence, won by Kansas 44-16. So, that's a 66-point turnaround in four seasons.

Kansas was 12-1 as recently as 2007. Mangino unraveled shortly after that and Turner Gill was a disaster. But Duke's last 12 win season was never. Duke won 13 games combined in the nine seasons before Cutcliffe game on board. So Weis had a major rebuilding project to be sure but nowhere near the one faced by Cutcliffe.

Well OK, but the series was set in 2006, before Kansas' great season. Still, true that Kansas pre-2006 was (much) better than Duke pre-Cutcliffe. More relevantly is: didn't Duke ask for the game to be delayed from 2010? Or was it mutually agreed upon?

[J.Blink]

IDK, Jarhead & I found we liked the seats. Of course, we leased those installed cushions Duke was advertising, which did make them much more comfortable. I do think your 5'8" limit is a little off, I'm 6'0" and sitting normally, I had a an inch to spare for knee room. Still not great, I know, but often when someone was sitting in front of us in past years on the bleachers, their back was often hitting my knees, so in that regard, I don't see much difference in knee room. And as Duke_92 pointed out, it is not so bad getting out by people if they stand. The thing that made us actually like the seats was that our backs didn't hurt after the game like they usually did in the past. The sun is brutal on that side, and I worry the dark seats will make it even hotter. I for one would love it if the new press tower were 50 stories tall and stretched from the back of the end-zone to the back of the end-zone!! All in all, I don't see how they could do any better than these seats with the way the stadium is built, just no way to place the rows any father apart. Leaving the whole stadium with bleachers would not be a good idea. It does appear that only 8 sections per side will have seats, with the rest still bleachers, which I think is smart.

I do hope more people will start to come to the games. There is just so much competition out there for peoples Saturday afternoon/evening entertainment attention. Winning helps, as will the renovations when complete. Jarhead & I talked about all this last week and he recalls that when we used to fill the stadium all the time, it was due to support from the Durham community. There aren't enough students to make much of a dent, we need more alumni and employees, and more Durhamites.

I'm really not looking forward to when the seats with backs come to the other side of the stadium, and I hope my experience matches yours! I'm 6'1 / 170, and I literally cannot sit in the stadium if I'm sitting behind those silly strapped on rented seats. Reminds me of being in Kenan (awful stadium). We'll see.

Regarding attendance, I didn't think it was terrible this week, but neither was the Troy game anywhere near a sell-out (I'd guess around 3/4 or a bit less full).

Am I the only who finds the number of TV timeouts completely irritating? What do they add to game time--another full hour? I would look no further than that to improving the game day experience, but of course that's the only thing that would be completely off the table!

Between parking, walking, staying for the whole game, and leaving, even if you partake in absolutely no tailgating or other peripheral activities, you're looking at basically 5 hours minimum. That's a pretty big time commitment if you're only a middling Duke or football fan.

[Newton_14]

I'm really not looking forward to when the seats with backs come to the other side of the stadium, and I hope my experience matches yours! I'm 6'1 / 170, and I literally cannot sit in the stadium if I'm sitting behind those silly strapped on rented seats. Reminds me of being in Kenan (awful stadium). We'll see.

Regarding attendance, I didn't think it was terrible this week, but neither was the Troy game anywhere near a sell-out (I'd guess around 3/4 or a bit less full).

Am I the only who finds the number of TV timeouts completely irritating? What do they add to game time--another full hour? I would look no further than that to improving the game day experience, but of course that's the only thing that would be completely off the table!

Between parking, walking, staying for the whole game, and leaving, even if you partake in absolutely no tailgating or other peripheral activities, you're looking at basically 5 hours minimum. That's a pretty big time commitment if you're only a middling Duke or football fan.

Do you have plenty of room in Cameron Indoor? From a comfort and space point of view, I don't see how the new seats in WW can be worse than Cameron. Have not sit in one yet but plan to next week. Just don't see how it's remotely possible for the new WW seats to be worse than Cameron comfort or tight space. I think people are making too much of it. The worse part about that side of WW by a mile is the sun. I just about died in the Alabama game. I had made a huge mistake in forgetting to bring sun screen, and the sun that day was just brutal. I ended up having to leave early in the 4th, not due to the score but over heating. I honestly thought I was on the verge of passing out. Scary for a few minutes.

It is really hard to endure that sun on very warm days. The difference in sitting on that side and the home side in those conditions is striking. Not saying that's the main reason for lack of attendance or anything but it factors in. Lots of people choose to watch the game standing at the edge on the concourse all the way around the stadium. I think if all of those folks were in seats on the sun side it might look a little bit better at least?

Anyway, I would not fret too much over the new seats. If you can handle Cameron, you should be able to handle the new seats in WW.

[gep]

Every time this comes up... I wonder why the games in Sept and Oct don't start at 5-6 pm. Keep the noon to 3pm games for Nov. I notice this' throughout the nation. Is it the east coast media?

[OldPhiKap]

1. Does Camwron have seats? Never did anything but stand.

2. Football seats need backs. Disagree? You ain't 45+ yet. You'll get there.

3. Just get to the games, worry about the details later!

[J.Blink]

Do you have plenty of room in Cameron Indoor? From a comfort and space point of view, I don't see how the new seats in WW can be worse than Cameron. Have not sit in one yet but plan to next week. Just don't see how it's remotely possible for the new WW seats to be worse than Cameron comfort or tight space. I think people are making too much of it. The worse part about that side of WW by a mile is the sun. I just about died in the Alabama game. I had made a huge mistake in forgetting to bring sun screen, and the sun that day was just brutal. I ended up having to leave early in the 4th, not due to the score but over heating. I honestly thought I was on the verge of passing out. Scary for a few minutes.

It is really hard to endure that sun on very warm days. The difference in sitting on that side and the home side in those conditions is striking. Not saying that's the main reason for lack of attendance or anything but it factors in. Lots of people choose to watch the game standing at the edge on the concourse all the way around the stadium. I think if all of those folks were in seats on the sun side it might look a little bit better at least?

Anyway, I would not fret too much over the new seats. If you can handle Cameron, you should be able to handle the new seats in WW.

I don't have any problem in Cameron, so I'll be hopeful. Maybe I'm just scarred by my experience in Kenan (though Duke won the last time I was there!)...

I know exactly what you mean about that side of the stadium. It's rough. I was in the band for one year when they were moved over to visitor's side for a couple of seasons. One could sweat quite a lot sitting there in full marching band regalia. Fortunately, hydration was key. I even saw some people drinking water.

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

Every time this comes up... I wonder why the games in Sept and Oct don't start at 5-6 pm. Keep the noon to 3pm games for Nov. I notice this' throughout the nation. Is it the east coast media?

It's about TV contracts which enable ESPN and others to schedule games to attract the greatest number of viewers without much regard to time zone other than for all US time zones to be awake to watch. The higher the rank, the greater the chance the game will be later rather than earlier. Nothing factors in related to interaction of weather and time of day or the needs of live audiences.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

fwiw:

we're up to 27th in the AP poll, behind unc at 26

Well, I guess that means there's a pretty good chance we'll be ranked if we beat Tulane. I thought we'd have to at least beat Miami.

[uh_no]

Do you have plenty of room in Cameron Indoor? From a comfort and space point of view, I don't see how the new seats in WW can be worse than Cameron. Have not sit in one yet but plan to next week. Just don't see how it's remotely possible for the new WW seats to be worse than Cameron comfort or tight space. I think people are making too much of it. The worse part about that side of WW by a mile is the sun. I just about died in the Alabama game. I had made a huge mistake in forgetting to bring sun screen, and the sun that day was just brutal. I ended up having to leave early in the 4th, not due to the score but over heating. I honestly thought I was on the verge of passing out. Scary for a few minutes.

It is really hard to endure that sun on very warm days. The difference in sitting on that side and the home side in those conditions is striking. Not saying that's the main reason for lack of attendance or anything but it factors in. Lots of people choose to watch the game standing at the edge on the concourse all the way around the stadium. I think if all of those folks were in seats on the sun side it might look a little bit better at least?

Anyway, I would not fret too much over the new seats. If you can handle Cameron, you should be able to handle the new seats in WW.

I've found the seats in cameron more spacious than the new seats in WW. Though cameron is not hugely spacious, it's FAR from the most cramped...you want cramped? Try sitting in the bleacher seats in gampel pavilion...and the bleachers upstairs in Conte Forum were so bad that i left to go stand in the back.

if i get a chance, i might drop into cameron and see if i can measure the seat pitch as well as in WW. I should mention that it may not JUST be the distance between rows...cameron is also at a greater slope than WW...so that often makes the space seem slightly larger.

[jimsumner]

Well OK, but the series was set in 2006, before Kansas' great season. Still, true that Kansas pre-2006 was (much) better than Duke pre-Cutcliffe. More relevantly is: didn't Duke ask for the game to be delayed from 2010? Or was it mutually agreed upon?

Cut said this was the earliest both teams had an open date in the non-conference portion of their schedules.

Kansas was 7-5 in 2004, 6-6 in 2005. FWIW.

[Henderson]

Well OK, but the series was set in 2006, before Kansas' great season. Still, true that Kansas pre-2006 was (much) better than Duke pre-Cutcliffe. More relevantly is: didn't Duke ask for the game to be delayed from 2010? Or was it mutually agreed upon?

I seem to recall a Cut presser sometime in the past week or so in which he addressed this question by saying it was set up as a home-and-home but that other scheduling (theirs and ours) kept pushing the return game back.

[Lid]

I find the seats comfortable -- granted, I'm not 6' tall, but it is extremely nice to have a back now. I'll be curious to see what uh_no finds about measurements. They feel as or more spacious to me than Cameron, but I think the point about pitch is a good one. eta: I join everyone else who was afraid we'd get Kenan-ed, but I don't think that's the case at all.

We've had employee season tickets for several years, always have plenty of sunscreen and water and know what we're in for, but it still takes my breath away how EXTREMELY uncomfortable it is on the sunny side when it's more than 70 degrees out. We show up anyway and do our best to have a great time, but it's hard to understand the situation over there until you've been in the stands for an afternoon game. I'll take under advisement that we shouldn't let our kids go to the concourse to avail themselves of the misting tents (please God, let them have the misting tents set up on Saturday!), because it makes it appear to people at home in air conditioning that no one cares about Duke football.

We were all cheering almost as lustily for the clouds passing through on Saturday as we were for Wilson. Almost.

[alteran]

I find the seats comfortable -- granted, I'm not 6' tall, but it is extremely nice to have a back now. I'll be curious to see what uh_no finds about measurements. They feel as or more spacious to me than Cameron, but I think the point about pitch is a good one. eta: I join everyone else who was afraid we'd get Kenan-ed, but I don't think that's the case at all.

We've had employee season tickets for several years, always have plenty of sunscreen and water and know what we're in for, but it still takes my breath away how EXTREMELY uncomfortable it is on the sunny side when it's more than 70 degrees out. We show up anyway and do our best to have a great time, but it's hard to understand the situation over there until you've been in the stands for an afternoon game. I'll take under advisement that we shouldn't let our kids go to the concourse to avail themselves of the misting tents (please God, let them have the misting tents set up on Saturday!), because it makes it appear to people at home in air conditioning that no one cares about Duke football.

We were all cheering almost as lustily for the clouds passing through on Saturday as we were for Wilson. Almost.

Every once in a while I forget my hat and/or sunscreen in those seats, and it's always an unmitigated disaster.

I was thrilled when I heard about the seats getting put in, the reality is worse than I expected, but not horrible.

Pluses:
- comfort
- stops "home stadium chair warriors" who basically take their reclining chairs from home and plop it on the bench for all of us to work around.

Minuses:
- heat - dark blue is probably not the best color for seats facing the sun for most of the game. My guess is I'll appreciate this more in a month.
- spacing - maybe an inch or two between my knees and the seat/person in front of me. Must make every single person between you and the exit stand whenever you get out. Challenging for those with old bladders or young kids (or both)

I'm on the fence. I guess I'm okay with it (since I have no choice!).