UNC Athletics Scandal - NCAA to reopen investigation

[Henderson]

Meanwhile, over at Inside Carolina, folks seem mostly to be taking this news like adults (or adults with an astigmatism anyway). Examples:

"I really don't want to overreact, but I feel like this will be the beginning of the end for Roy. Not because he's done anything wrong, but because he's got to be tired of dealing with crap beyond his control year in and year out. Recruiting is going to suffer until the dust settles on this, and that's his greatest strength as a coach.
I don't imagine he'll leave any of the current kids he recruited high and dry, but if he has problems getting guys for 2015 and 2016 because of this, I can see him starting to tell people he may not be here for the full 4 years."

"They want to talk to Nyang'oro it would seem."

"...and Crowder. The University will regret hanging the two of them out to dry."

Of course there's also the crowd saying it's unfair because the NCAA already investigated:

"the university was already punished and already serve their punishment and could have moved on. why they decided to hire more investigators to dig up more dirt is just beyond comprehension. if the university would have just let it go after our punishment they would have been beyond this already."

And those who blame the N&O and Pack Pride:

"It will not bring closure. If they say we're guilty and punish us, Kane and the rest of the State scum will say it's not enough. If they impose no penalties, the same crew will claim it's a whitewash. Until State gets slammed or UNC's athletic program is eliminated, they won't shut up."

[Duvall]

Curious that NCAA waited until now to want to take a second look. Hard for them to not ignore the heat by media along with a lawsuit they're going to lose for them to get a small (VERY small) dose of religion. IMO they'll find "minor" violations. They knew what UNC was doing years ago. This is just a "Look at us! We're relevant and we're on this!" play. They'll find minor violations and hope Roy doesn't get mad.

The conspiracy angle definitely makes more sense than the simpler explanation that Nyang'oro declined to talk to the NCAA before and is talking to the UNC investigators now.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Ok...so IF the NCAA (finally) finds any wrongdoing this time, do they tack on punishments for UNC lying to them? Because if they do find fault, then they have to say the Heels lied the first time around. Which outta increase any punishments. (Wishful thinking, I know, but still...)

[CameronBornAndBred]

I don't imagine he'll leave any of the current kids he recruited high and dry, but if he has problems getting guys for 2015 and 2016 because of this, I can see him starting to tell people he may not be here for the full 4 years."

Of course he won't. It's only high and dry on top of the bus; they'll be underneath it where it is wet and dark.

[ncexnyc]

Talk about a dysfunctional fan base. I went over to Pack Pride after seeing this thread and thought I would see today being declared a national holiday. That was far from the truth. I’ve never seen such a beaten group of individuals in my life. All I saw was,” This is all a scam, nothing is going to happen,” etc., etc.

For a group that has kept this story in the news and has done so much to expose the lies and cheating that have been going on over at UNC, this was very disappointing. You’d think they would be celebrating the fruits of their labor.

[Henderson]

the ncaa can look at the transcripts,yes?

I think so. Not as a matter of law, but because the NCAA requires student-athletes to waive their FERPA rights to give the NCAA access.

This is a secondary source. A paragraph from a 2009 article in the journal, Inside Higher Ed. I don't have a link to the FERPA waiver the NCAA requires, but this sounds right and is the working assumption of university counsel generally:

"The NCAA requires student athletes to fill out a consent form, saying the students agree to disclose educational records to the association that are covered by FERPA." Here's the full article if you want it. There's some interesting stuff about redisclosure by the NCAA to media.

[howardlander]

Meanwhile, over at Inside Carolina, folks seem mostly to be taking this news like adults (or adults with an astigmatism anyway). Examples:

"I really don't want to overreact, but I feel like this will be the beginning of the end for Roy. Not because he's done anything wrong, but because he's got to be tired of dealing with crap beyond his control year in and year out. Recruiting is going to suffer until the dust settles on this, and that's his greatest strength as a coach.

I agree with this guy. Can you imagine any parent with any real interest in his child's academic progress, or in having their child not play for a school on probation, sending a kid to play for Roy now? Most (all?) of the kids Carolina recruits have got plenty of options. Why bet your future on damaged goods?

Howard

[OldPhiKap]

Talk about a dysfunctional fan base. I went over to Pack Pride after seeing this thread and thought I would see today being declared a national holiday. That was far from the truth. I’ve never seen such a beaten group of individuals in my life. All I saw was,” This is all a scam, nothing is going to happen,” etc., etc.

For a group that has kept this story in the news and has done so much to expose the lies and cheating that have been going on over at UNC, this was very disappointing. You’d think they would be celebrating the fruits of their labor.

FWIW I share their pessimism that this will amount to much. But I am willing to be proven wrong.

[Henderson]

FWIW I share their pessimism that this will amount to much. But I am willing to be proven wrong.

I actually disagree. I think there will be some consequences in the end, if only because of the stink if there are none. I've said before that I think the most likely outcome is that Roy is pushed under the bus. Gracefully. Retiring with full honors. But with the tread marks.

But perhaps more importantly, there already are consequences. The mere fact of this ongoing news item and NCAA investigation has its own consequences. Ask Bubba how his blood pressure is today, and you'll see what I mean.

P.S. Others will be blamed too, but they will be beyond UNC's reach, either because they have tenure or are no longer there anyway.

[pamtar]

From reddit:

According to this 2011 ESPN Article regarding the issue of 'statute of limitations':

The NCAA's four-year statute of limitations doesn't apply when there is a pattern of willful violations that continues into the past four years.

Can someone with a better grip on the investigation(s) timeline please explain how this would apply to UNC? Does it mean if they 'fixed' the problem more than four years ago that they can't be punished?

[FerryFor50]

So if UNC gets busted for this, do they finally start calling NCSU their rivals? If helping reveal a pattern of cheating isn't a rivalry starter, then what is?

[Newton_14]

I guess Roy's not in the daggum tee time spirit.

Actually given the timing, Ol Roy is not in the dadgum 4th of July/Independence Day spirit.

I actually think it may be time to start the Roy Williams Retirement Vigil thread. Forget him getting fired... I don't believe he is mentally tough enough to survive an actual investigation into the hoops program. I assume what the good AFAM Professor had to say was so juicy it became too good to pass up. (Or too bad if you rather)

[ncexnyc]

Ol' Roy can always go hangout at Masonboro this weekend and shotgun a few beers with his good buddy P.J. if he is feeling down.

[CameronBlue]

Ol' Roy can always go hangout at Masonboro this weekend and shotgun a few beers with his good buddy P.J. if he is feeling down.

If nothing else I hope Roy has learned that P.J. and weaponry are a bad mix.

[Reilly]

Roy doesn't shotgun beers ... he BB guns them ... and Roy's *always* in the butt-shooting dadgum spirit, dadgummit ...

[moonpie23]

well, we all said that the ncaa should re-open an investigation,


unfortunately…...

[ncexnyc]

I'd love to see someone with Photo Shop skills get an old photo of Laurel and Hardy, one where Hardy is berating Laurel and is saying, "Well here's another nice mess you've gotten us into." Put McCants' face on Laurel's body and put Ol' Roy's face on Hardy's body.

[roywhite]

Interview with Asheville radio station

From the link, which also contains an audio:

She said she doesn't think an investigation should be that lengthy. She says it would only take a couple of days to pull the transcripts of players to see how many of them took the so-called paper classes run out of the African-American Studies program. She says everyone who runs college sports, or even enjoys them, is to blame for creating a culture of cheating. She says all faculty, including herself, are also to blame for allowing this to happen. Willingham says white administrators, mostly men, with the NCAA and UNC Chapel Hill have made money off the backs of black athletes and denied them a proper education. She also told WWNC that we may see legal action from her this week against the school for creating a hostile work environment after she told the truth publicly.

[SilkyJ]

the ncaa can look at the transcripts,yes?

they can interview players and have the proof right there in front of them when they do…..remember, whatever you do, don't LIE to them….

I think so. Not as a matter of law, but because the NCAA requires student-athletes to waive their FERPA rights to give the NCAA access.

Yes they can look at transcripts, but what are they gonna find--that some basketball players took phony classes? Don't we already know that? They know a bunch of athletes and a bunch of regular students took them, and b/c it was so broad they've decided to call it an academic issue and not their domain, right? (Sorry, its been so long I actually forget exactly what they said...). So I'm just not sure what else we know just b/c McCants released his transcript. Frankly, I'd be surprised if they didn't ask for it the last time they were on campus.

I'm with Bob and OPK until the NCAA shows they have a spine or until some truly new evidence comes out.

The story that will not end. This probably ruined Coach Roy's golf game today. My money is still on nothing new happening to Carolina. The NCAA will reconfirm their earlier decisions.

FWIW I share their pessimism that this will amount to much. But I am willing to be proven wrong.

[blueduke59]

Some are saying that Crowder and Nyangoro are telling Wainstein that the athletic dept had nothing to do with anything. Could be that NCAA is wanting to close the book on the UNC story once and for all. They'll come to NC, interview them both, reiterate their earlier 'findings' that it had nothing to do w/ athletics, and then say that the issue is closed. UNC supposedly is ready to blame somebody else on the academic side while 'cooperating.' Do that, have charges dropped and the flagship goes on it's merry way.

I tend to agree with this