MLax: 2014 NCAA CHAMPS!!!!

[devildeac]

Nice article in the Raleigh N&O this AM with an interesting sidebar about Dionne:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/05/...ml?sp=/99/103/

"The cost of the victory, though, appears to be the availability of senior attackman Josh Dionne, who scored on all four of his shots in the first half. Dionne was decked by Johns Hopkins midfielder Rob Guida just before halftime and returned to the sideline on crutches after the break.

Dionne, who has 49 goals and seven assists this season, wore a brace on his right knee after the game. Junior Kyle Keenan (two goals and an assist) took his place at attack the rest of the game."

I thought the injury was a "cross check" to the chest that ended up with a stick in his throat?

Maybe the initial blow was not so severe but, when he went down, he sustained the knee injury.

[MCFinARL]

On a positive note, the ESPNU broadcasters indicated yesterday that Luke Duprey was available to play. With one more week to recover, perhaps he will be back next weekend for at least limited playing time.

I'm a little concerned about the goalkeeping-- 4 saves on 15 shots on goal against Hopkins does not seem like a formula for a National Championship. However, I thought Turri looked good and made a couple of critical plays, so I am guessing we may see both goalkeepers next weekend.

Yes, goalkeeping is an issue. Aaron has looked very good at times this year and shaky other times. Turri is a terrific goalie in every aspect other than saves, as much of his play yesterday demonstrated, but he doesn't always see the ball well on opponents' shots. The defense as a whole needs to play well enough so that the goalies don't face a ton of tough shots.

Danowski said in his post-game presser that people get more excited about goalie substitutions than they should, that Duke has several competent goalies and they will play as game needs dictate. Interestingly, he suggested the best goalie on the team may be a redshirt freshman, presumably Danny Fowler--so there is something to look forward to. In the meantime, it will be interesting to see who plays next week.

Denver, as it happens, usually platoons its goalies, playing one in the first half and another in the second. That didn't work out so well for them in last year's final four, as their first half goalie saved a phenomenal 13 shots and let in 2 goals against Syracuse as the Pioneers built a 5-2 lead; in the second half the other goalie had 4 saves to 7 goals allowed and Denver lost by 1.

[MCFinARL]

Nice article in the Raleigh N&O this AM with an interesting sidebar about Dionne:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/05/...ml?sp=/99/103/

"The cost of the victory, though, appears to be the availability of senior attackman Josh Dionne, who scored on all four of his shots in the first half. Dionne was decked by Johns Hopkins midfielder Rob Guida just before halftime and returned to the sideline on crutches after the break.

Dionne, who has 49 goals and seven assists this season, wore a brace on his right knee after the game. Junior Kyle Keenan (two goals and an assist) took his place at attack the rest of the game."

I thought the injury was a "cross check" to the chest that ended up with a stick in his throat?

Maybe the initial blow was not so severe but, when he went down, he sustained the knee injury.

Yes, the injury was more an indirect result of the hit, and probably would have occurred whether or not the hit had been legal (which the commentators, IIRC, thought it was). He was blasting toward the goal and getting ready to shoot, and he did not see the defender coming. The hit was very hard and, because of the angle of Dionne's body at the time, the contact caused him to twist his leg as he fell and wrench the knee. I don't think the defender could have anticipated that his hit might have injured Dionne in this way. it was just bad luck, really.

[devildeac]

Yes, the injury was more an indirect result of the hit, and probably would have occurred whether or not the hit had been legal (which the commentators, IIRC, thought it was). He was blasting toward the goal and getting ready to shoot, and he did not see the defender coming. The hit was very hard and, because of the angle of Dionne's body at the time, the contact caused him to twist his leg as he fell and wrench the knee. I don't think the defender could have anticipated that his hit might have injured Dionne in this way. it was just bad luck, really.

Thanks for the explanation. Makes more sense now. Sadly.

[Herbie]

Seeing Denver dominate the X in their game this past weekend against Drexel's "specialist" Saputo has me a little nervous and got me wondering how we did on faceoffs and GB's in our earlier match with Denver this year. Turns out not too bad. From the previous game recap:

"At the faceoff X, Fowler won 16-of-27 draws and was credited with nine ground balls. Duke won the overall ground ball battle 32-21, including 17-7 in the second half."

http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.db...CLID=209407455

Hopefully, history repeats itself this weekend!

[johnb]

Yes, the injury was more an indirect result of the hit, and probably would have occurred whether or not the hit had been legal (which the commentators, IIRC, thought it was). He was blasting toward the goal and getting ready to shoot, and he did not see the defender coming. The hit was very hard and, because of the angle of Dionne's body at the time, the contact caused him to twist his leg as he fell and wrench the knee. I don't think the defender could have anticipated that his hit might have injured Dionne in this way. it was just bad luck, really.

I agree with everything until the last sentence. The blow to the throat seems to have led to the awkward landing, and so while it perhaps wasn't planned, it struck me as clearly a penalty missed by the refs and commentators, but I'll defer to people who actually know lacrosse...

[Ima Facultiwyfe]

I agree with everything until the last sentence. The blow to the throat seems to have led to the awkward landing, and so while it perhaps wasn't planned, it struck me as clearly a penalty missed by the refs and commentators, but I'll defer to people who actually know lacrosse...

I wish someone who does actually know lacrosse could help me understand why an intentional and very violent stick attack across the throat is considered legal. He nearly took his head off. I still think that was a dirty play by the defender ... bless his heart.
Love, Ima

[Faison1]

I wish someone who does actually know lacrosse could help me understand why an intentional and very violent stick attack across the throat is considered legal. He nearly took his head off. I still think that was a dirty play by the defender ... bless his heart.
Love, Ima

Having played the game as a defenseman, I didn't see anything wrong with the play. However, I have not watched the play in super-slow-mo to see if there was any malicious intent.

Unless someone can show me (not being snarky here) different evidence, I did not see any type of intentional stick or slash across the neck. What might be open for debate is whether the defender performed a cross-check (where he has both hands on his stick, but his hands are separated so that he uses the middle of his stick to create a more forceful hit).

A cross-check is often open for debate, and granted quite a bit of leeway. It's tough to spot. As opposed to a cross check, it is perfectly legal for a defender to have both of his hands together on his stick, and make contact with the opposing player with both his fists.

On this specific play, both players were running at full sprints. It happened so quick, I would bet the defender didn't have time to bring his fists together. Having said that, I don't think the hit is to blame for the injury.

The first thing you're taught at an early age is to keep your head on a swivel, especially if you're an attackman. Dionne's mistake is not being aware of the defender. Rather than continuing to run and shoot, he planted both feet to rip a shot. That gave the defender time to make a play. The defender hit Dionne square in the chest. If part of the defender's stick got in Dionne's throat, it's because Dionne got low in a split second. Ref's will give a defender some latitude as long as the hit is not malicious.

In this case, it was a bang-bang play. I didn't like our guy lying on the ground, but I also didn't think the defender did anything wrong. Really, I thought Dionne just had the wind knocked out of him because it was such a good hit.

Frankly, you can't expect to go into the crease area, or rip a shot without getting hit. It's just the nature of the game. Dionne should have had better awareness of his surroundings. If you look at the replays, I don't think he ever took his eye off the goal.

If it was a dirty hit, I think you would have seen the Duke Bench erupt, but from what I can tell, they didn't.

[BigWayne]

I wish someone who does actually know lacrosse could help me understand why an intentional and very violent stick attack across the throat is considered legal. He nearly took his head off. I still think that was a dirty play by the defender ... bless his heart.
Love, Ima

What you describe is not legal, but is not what happened on this play. I went back and looked at it just now on the DVR. The defender does specifically move his hands together as Faison describes. When he makes contact, both of his gloves make contact with Dionne in the shoulder/chest pad area. At no time does the stick or the defender's hands contact Dionne's throat. The force of the hit itself makes Dionne's head bend sideways which could give the impression of throat contact. It was a clean hit and the knee injury was an unfortunate side effect of the hit.

[Class of '94]

Others can (and probably will) chime in, but my answer is unequivocally "no."

Keenan is the most likely candidate to take Dionne's spot on the starting attack. He's a converted attackman, and was good enough to start for the USA at the 2012 u-19 world championships. His game is different that Dionne's: he's more of a dodger and wing sniper than an inside finisher. We might, in certain situations, see Bruckner bump up from the second midfield to play on the crease; he plays inside on EMO.

Moving either of those guys up from the second midfield to the starting attack creates a hole in the second midfield unit. It's possible that Duke could go with a five-man rotation, with the guys on the first unit taking turns at double-shifting. That's not a great idea if the weather goes sideways, as it often does in Baltimore on Memorial Day weekend. Shaffer and Scott will presumably gets lots of reps with the second unit early in the week, and get a chance to prove that they can step up. It's also possible that Zenker could be moved up to the second midfield from his current spot at d-mid, with Rhodes stepping into that role. My fantasy is that Haus runs first midfield with Jones and Class, and Walsh becomes the stabilizing influence for Cohan and Bruckner, but I'm not holding my breath waiting to see that.

We'll know soon enough.

Thank-you for your thoughts and insight. Your analysis of Duke's possible alternatives was excellent; and it makes me feel a little bit better about the loss of Dionne. I hope somehow he will still be able to play but I'm not holding my breath on that. If he can't go, his loss will hurt us imo; but at least, the team has this week to gameplan and make adjustments as opposed to the injury incurring this upcoming weekend (with no time to plan and make adjustments).

[burnspbesq]

Looked at it several times last night. It's a crosse-check. Guida's hands are apart, and he leads with his stick. The point of impact is as high as it can be without being illegal, i.e., right on the collarbone.

Stuff happens. Next play.

[MCFinARL]

Looked at it several times last night. It's a crosse-check. Guida's hands are apart, and he leads with his stick. The point of impact is as high as it can be without being illegal, i.e., right on the collarbone.

Stuff happens. Next play.

"Stuff happens" is probably the right attitude--and one that, as it happens, Josh Dionne is apparently taking. In the post-game interviews he expressed much more happiness that the team had advanced than concern over his own injury--said he sacrificed his body for the team and any of his teammates would have done the same. Said he was looking forward to having a "coaching internship" during practice this week. It was pretty impressive, really--Danowski, by contrast, said he was "heartbroken" for Dionne, to get injured so near the end of his career. Neither even suggested there was anything wrong with the hit or the way it was called.

One can argue about whether a penalty should have been called, but I don't see any evidence of a "dirty" hit or an intent to injure.

[burnspbesq]

Friends of Duke lacrosse should be looking forward to this year's Under Armour All-American boys game, to be played on July 12 at Towson University's Johnny Unitas Stadium. The game will be televised on ESPNU.

Duke tops all NCAA D1 schools with six of its commits being selected to play.

Midfielder Matthew Giampetroni (Bloomfield Hills, MI/Cranbrook) and defender James Riley (Apple Valley, MN/St. Thomas) will play for the North.

Defender Greg Pelton (Chester Springs, PA/Malvern Prep), attackman Mitch Russell (Tega Cay, SC/Fort Mill), midfielder Jake Seau (San Diego, CA/Bishop's), and LSM Peter Welch (Bernardsville, NJ/Delbarton) will play for the South.

Riley is the first player from Minnesota ever selected to play in the game.

The Duke women's program will have four recruits playing in the girls' game.

[Faison1]

Friends of Duke lacrosse should be looking forward to this year's Under Armour All-American boys game, to be played on July 12 at Towson University's Johnny Unitas Stadium. The game will be televised on ESPNU.

Duke tops all NCAA D1 schools with six of its commits being selected to play.

Midfielder Matthew Giampetroni (Bloomfield Hills, MI/Cranbrook) and defender James Riley (Apple Valley, MN/St. Thomas) will play for the North.

Defender Greg Pelton (Chester Springs, PA/Malvern Prep), attackman Mitch Russell (Tega Cay, SC/Fort Mill), midfielder Jake Seau (San Diego, CA/Bishop's), and LSM Peter Welch (Bernardsville, NJ/Delbarton) will play for the South.

Riley is the first player from Minnesota ever selected to play in the game.

The Duke women's program will have four recruits playing in the girls' game.

Dumb question: If we have the most recruits playing, shouldn't we have the best recruiting class? Have I heard UNC's class is considered best?

[roywhite]

Friends of Duke lacrosse should be looking forward to this year's Under Armour All-American boys game, to be played on July 12 at Towson University's Johnny Unitas Stadium. The game will be televised on ESPNU.

Duke tops all NCAA D1 schools with six of its commits being selected to play.

Midfielder Matthew Giampetroni (Bloomfield Hills, MI/Cranbrook) and defender James Riley (Apple Valley, MN/St. Thomas) will play for the North.

Defender Greg Pelton (Chester Springs, PA/Malvern Prep), attackman Mitch Russell (Tega Cay, SC/Fort Mill), midfielder Jake Seau (San Diego, CA/Bishop's), and LSM Peter Welch (Bernardsville, NJ/Delbarton) will play for the South.

Riley is the first player from Minnesota ever selected to play in the game.

The Duke women's program will have four recruits playing in the girls' game.

Good to see the recruiting momentum continues.

I'm especially looking forward to seeing Junior Seau's son Jake; if he has athletic ability comparable to his dad's, the Duke Midfield will be downright scary with Deemer Class and Myles Jones having two more years.

[burnspbesq]

Good to see the recruiting momentum continues.

I'm especially looking forward to seeing Junior Seau's son Jake; if he has athletic ability comparable to his dad's, the Duke Midfield will be downright scary with Deemer Class and Myles Jones having two more years.

You might want to manage your expectations just a little bit where Jake is concerned. He came to the game a bit late (seventh or eighth grade), and hasn't played against the same level of competition in high school as some other elite recruits. He's probably going to have a learning curve. My expectation is that he'll play at least a year at SSDM. Which, come to think of it, gives us some pretty off-the-charts athleticism at that position if he is running alongside Will Haus next year.

http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/...u-duke-commit/

[johnb]

... defender James Riley (Apple Valley, MN/St. Thomas) will play for the North...
Riley is the first player from Minnesota ever selected to play in the game.
.

but Riley's not the only Apple Valley athlete coming to Duke-- the other one has gotten a bit more national press.

[TKG]

Friends of Duke lacrosse should be looking forward to this year's Under Armour All-American boys game, to be played on July 12 at Towson University's Johnny Unitas Stadium. The game will be televised on ESPNU.

Duke tops all NCAA D1 schools with six of its commits being selected to play. defender James Riley (Apple Valley, MN/St. Thomas) will play for the North.

What is the water in Apple Valley, MN? I believe Tyus Jones is from Apple Valley, MN as well.

[Native]

Yes, the injury was more an indirect result of the hit, and probably would have occurred whether or not the hit had been legal (which the commentators, IIRC, thought it was). He was blasting toward the goal and getting ready to shoot, and he did not see the defender coming. The hit was very hard and, because of the angle of Dionne's body at the time, the contact caused him to twist his leg as he fell and wrench the knee. I don't think the defender could have anticipated that his hit might have injured Dionne in this way. it was just bad luck, really.

Agree. That was a completely legal hit, no question about it. It was a matter of bad luck that the hit came just as he transferred his weight and inertia onto his front foot in his shooting motion. Probably exacerbated the injury, if anything.

Josh did look capable of supporting some weight on that ankle/knee/leg as he walked off the field, which could be a good sign.

[MCFinARL]

Agree. That was a completely legal hit, no question about it. It was a matter of bad luck that the hit came just as he transferred his weight and inertia onto his front foot in his shooting motion. Probably exacerbated the injury, if anything.

Josh did look capable of supporting some weight on that ankle/knee/leg as he walked off the field, which could be a good sign.

Fingers crossed, but Danowski said today that they are planning to be without him. Sounded like there was still a chance (you're saying there's a chance?), but not much of one.