DBR Migration to SBN

[Here is a Turtle]

One thing I like about SBN is that when schools play each other the two SBN sites will each have a reporter answer a series of questions to better inform fans what they are up against. Would DBR do this as well?

[devil84]

You're kind of reinforcing my point here. The examples that you bring up are about NEWS stories. Many of the posts that DBR puts on the front page are not news stories as much as they are opinion pieces. Some are news, but many are not, and even the news stories are posted with rather opinionated commentary. So you're taking your OPINION posts and elevating them to the level of being NEWS and then shutting off all ability to comment on them, apparently due to some fear about "all the Duke haters out there" (despite having zero evidence that "Duke hating" would even take place in the comments section).

I remember when you announced that you're moving to SBN, but I guess I missed the exact point of why you are doing so, since the whole point of the SBN format is to encourage discussion about a common interest

Regarding the bolded text: clearly you haven't seen what we moderators have dealt with to keep this a civil place. We have plenty of evidence that Duke hating will take place.

[BigWayne]

You're kind of reinforcing my point here. The examples that you bring up are about NEWS stories. Many of the posts that DBR puts on the front page are not news stories as much as they are opinion pieces. Some are news, but many are not, and even the news stories are posted with rather opinionated commentary. So you're taking your OPINION posts and elevating them to the level of being NEWS and then shutting off all ability to comment on them, apparently due to some fear about "all the Duke haters out there" (despite having zero evidence that "Duke hating" would even take place in the comments section).

I remember when you announced that you're moving to SBN, but I guess I missed the exact point of why you are doing so, since the whole point of the SBN format is to encourage discussion about a common interest

DBR is a private entity. If they want to post articles, have no comments, have no forum such as this, they are still free to do so in this country.

There are many times that DBR posts something I don't agree with. That affects how I think about the guys running it, but they can say whatever they want. It's up to me whether I want to continue to read it. I have no right to have my view online in contrast to theirs, unless I want to design and pay for my own website to do so.

If you don't like the way DBR is run, you are free to make your own website and set it up however you like. What I would expect though is that your opinion on how it should be set up might change quite a lot after a few years of running it and dealing with all of the opinions of the people that come to your site.

[DueBlevil]

DBR is a private entity. If they want to post articles, have no comments, have no forum such as this, they are still free to do so in this country.

There are many times that DBR posts something I don't agree with. That affects how I think about the guys running it, but they can say whatever they want. It's up to me whether I want to continue to read it. I have no right to have my view online in contrast to theirs, unless I want to design and pay for my own website to do so.

If you don't like the way DBR is run, you are free to make your own website and set it up however you like. What I would expect though is that your opinion on how it should be set up might change quite a lot after a few years of running it and dealing with all of the opinions of the people that come to your site.

I figured someone would come in with the "this is our site, if you don't like it, go somewhere else" comment. Of course I don't run this site. Obviously. And please don't get me wrong: the people who run this site put a ton of work into it and do a great job!! I'm sorry if I have put people on the defensive. I was just expressing an opinion and making an argument about what my preferences are. DBR is awesome but does that mean there's not room for a dissenting opinion? Is DBR at ultimate perfection and immune to criticism? I'm just being honest here: I like the SBN model better. I just do. I like being able to read an article, comment on it, have the author comment back, etc. Sure, some people misuse it and spam and hate, whatever, but most people don't. DBR doesn't want to follow that model and that's obviously not my decision to make.

Anywho I'm not a decision maker about the direction of this site, a fact for which I am thankful because I recognize the amount of work the moderators and owners put into it, but I did want to throw out my opinion. And I will leave it be now.

[-jk]

I think I see where you're coming from. The volume of commentary here is so far beyond what SBN is set up for that it just won't be a good fit. And we don't want to fragment our community or add work for the (volunteer) mods.

-jk

[tieguy]

The volume of commentary here is so far beyond what SBN is set up for that it just won't be a good fit.

You guys should talk to the Every Day Should Be Saturday authors/mods. They do 4-5,000 comments *a day* on college football saturdays, and 1,000 comment days are not unusual in the offseason. And the quality of discussion there is quite high; I know of at least one former DBRer (other than myself) who posts there regularly.

This isn't to say that all SB Nation sites are good (most of the Miami-related sites are pretty awful; the SF Giants one is quite good; the Sox one is mediocre) but at least some sites do it on the SBNation platform, so it isn't impossible.

[ricks68]

I started following DBR just after it morphed from Juliovision, and I can tell you that compared to the vast majority of other sports sites, there is no comparison regarding the quality of knowledge and conversation you get around here. If DBR changes to become just like the rest of those sites, I see no reason to continue following DBR any more than one of those sites.

If you want every day news, just Google what you want to know about each day, or follow NBC Sports or ESPN. If you want to really know what the scoop is on Duke stuff, and other news that true Duke fans are interested in (like UNC troubles, other teams of interest to us, opposing coaches, other Duke sports besides bball, ACC goings on, etc.), and get that information very quickly, then go to DBR.

I have found that DBR has so many knowledgeable fans that find and sort out information so quickly, that I usually do not have to go anywhere else. In addition, these fans will even check on the validity of the information before posting the link. On top of that, the mods prevent all the garbage from polluting DBR, so that I don't have to wade through all the trash to find the good information.

I think (no, I know) that DBR is different than most other sports sites because it is not a "superficial" fan site. While anyone can join and post, haters and immature fans are quickly weeded out by other posters and mods. Just go over to IC, the Kentucky fan site or that "turtle" site and read what goes on over there. Those "fans" are hardly ever interested in in depth learning about their teams, or furthering their knowledge about sports, etc. Most of what you see there is immature spouting off about how great their teams are and how bad the other teams are.

Now, I would also like to add that DBR is not alone in having great reporting and knowledge regarding Duke sports. Watzone also has a fantastic Duke fan site. In fact, he will sometimes come to visit with true inside information that he shares with DBR. I would highly recommend visiting his site. I'm also sure there are others.

As far as "original" members are concerned, I believe that a better term to use might be "mature", "insightful", "knowledgeable", "collegial", etc. Therefore, someone new (and not an "original") can be a great addition to the board, and is certainly welcome----------as long as they don't try to "pollute" it with the garbage you read about on other sites.

So, if what some posters are looking for is similar to what can be found on those other sites I mentioned, maybe they would be better off adding a "Duke" section over there where they can participate in the same kind of immature drivel.


ricks

[OldPhiKap]

I started following DBR just after it morphed from Juliovision, and I can tell you that compared to the vast majority of other sports sites, there is no comparison regarding the quality of knowledge and conversation you get around here. If DBR changes to become just like the rest of those sites, I see no reason to continue following DBR any more than one of those sites.

If you want every day news, just Google what you want to know about each day, or follow NBC Sports or ESPN. If you want to really know what the scoop is on Duke stuff, and other news that true Duke fans are interested in (like UNC troubles, other teams of interest to us, opposing coaches, other Duke sports besides bball, ACC goings on, etc.), and get that information very quickly, then go to DBR.

I have found that DBR has so many knowledgeable fans that find and sort out information so quickly, that I usually do not have to go anywhere else. In addition, these fans will even check on the validity of the information before posting the link. On top of that, the mods prevent all the garbage from polluting DBR, so that I don't have to wade through all the trash to find the good information.

I think (no, I know) that DBR is different than most other sports sites because it is not a "superficial" fan site. While anyone can join and post, haters and immature fans are quickly weeded out by other long-time posters and mods. Just go over to IC, the Kentucky fan site or that "turtle" site and read what goes on over there. Those "fans" are hardly ever interested in in depth learning about their teams, or furthering their knowledge about sports, etc. Most of what you see there is immature spouting off about how great their teams are and how bad the other teams are.

Now, I would also like to add that DBR is not alone in having great reporting and knowledge regarding Duke sports. Watzone also has a fantastic Duke fan site. In fact, he will sometimes come to visit with true inside information that he shares with DBR. I would highly recommend visiting his site. I'm also sure there are others.

As far as "original" members are concerned, I believe that a better term to use might be "mature", "insightful", "knowledgeable", "collegial", etc. Therefore, someone new (and not an "original") can be a great addition to the board, and is certainly welcome----------as long as they don't try to "pollute" it with the garbage you read about on other sites.

So, if what some posters are looking for is similar to what can be found on those other sites I mentioned, maybe they would be better off adding a "Duke" section over there where they can participate in the same kind of immature drivel.


ricks

All this is true.

For me, I originally posted on IC instead of DBR because I really hated the twig/strand/branch organization of the former board. And IC has ironically moved to a worse posting format.

In addition to ricks' traditionally great post, I would add that the off-topic board is equally interesting, entertaining and randomly educational. If you have never ventured over there, you are missing out.

[ricks68]

I figured someone would come in with the "this is our site, if you don't like it, go somewhere else" comment. Of course I don't run this site. Obviously. And please don't get me wrong: the people who run this site put a ton of work into it and do a great job!! I'm sorry if I have put people on the defensive. I was just expressing an opinion and making an argument about what my preferences are. DBR is awesome but does that mean there's not room for a dissenting opinion? Is DBR at ultimate perfection and immune to criticism? I'm just being honest here: I like the SBN model better. I just do. I like being able to read an article, comment on it, have the author comment back, etc. Sure, some people misuse it and spam and hate, whatever, but most people don't. DBR doesn't want to follow that model and that's obviously not my decision to make.

Anywho I'm not a decision maker about the direction of this site, a fact for which I am thankful because I recognize the amount of work the moderators and owners put into it, but I did want to throw out my opinion. And I will leave it be now.

I hope you didn't misconstrue my comments to mean for you to go somewhere else if you do not like it here. I meant that I really feel that to open up DBR to the same kind of bad stuff that is on most sites would be "inappropriate " for what DBR members appear to want "our" site to be. (Yes, even though I have had very little effect on the development or founding of DBR, I still consider myself to be a part of the DBR site.)

I am not resistant to change if it is for the better, or even a chance to be better. I am not agreeable to following DBR down the path to mediocrity, however----and it appears that those in actual control of the site content are not either.

Go Duke! Go DBR!

ricks

[Jarhead]

My view on comments on front page material is that if I felt the need to so comment, I would just do it in one of the DBR forums. That seems perfectly adequate to me. For the record his post is #2589 for me, and they are all late in the evening.

[JasonEvans]

My view on comments on front page material is that if I felt the need to so comment, I would just do it in one of the DBR forums. That seems perfectly adequate to me. For the record his post is #2589 for me, and they are all late in the evening.

Exactly. I don't get the controversy here. If you want to comment on an article, you can do it in the forums the way we have always done on DBR. We quite often have robust conversations about front-page articles. That is how the system will remain under the new format. It is not like we are saying comments on articles are disabled. The comments are merely directed to the forums instead of being attached to the article itself.

-Jason "the DBR 'pub' is always open to new patrons" Evans

[devildeac]

Things were amazingly smooth here yesterday and I was ready to send the administrators a fine note of congratulations until I read the main page this AM and found the migration had been delayed. I'll save the accolades that I worked on so meticulously for later today, tomorrow or whenever the big move is completed. Continued best wishes for as smooth a transition as possible and minimal headaches in the process.

[-jk]

The export of the old site was fairly uneventful. The import choked a couple times. The first time, they got 19,000 posts in before the choke. They'll be working on it today.

-jk

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Things were amazingly smooth here yesterday and I was ready to send the administrators a fine note of congratulations until I read the main page this AM and found the migration had been delayed. I'll save the accolades that I worked on so meticulously for later today, tomorrow or whenever the big move is completed. Continued best wishes for as smooth a transition as possible and minimal headaches in the process.

Perhaps you're talking about this development?

devildeac Member	02-26-2007	10,500	Today 01:27 PM
JasonEvans Moderator and post-a-matic	02-23-2007	10,494	Today 09:45 AM[/QUOTE]

[alteran]

Exactly. I don't get the controversy here. If you want to comment on an article, you can do it in the forums the way we have always done on DBR. We quite often have robust conversations about front-page articles. That is how the system will remain under the new format. It is not like we are saying comments on articles are disabled. The comments are merely directed to the forums instead of being attached to the article itself.

-Jason "the DBR 'pub' is always open to new patrons" Evans

I DO get the controversy, if you want to call it that.

It is FAR more convenient and more user-friendly to 1) post or read comments on the bottom of an article, than it is to 2) go to a completely different area, look for a thread and HOPE-- often wrongly-- that it was titled in a way that made it clear which article it was attached to. It's ludicrous to even debate this. Imagine trying to find comments on an article from more than a couple days ago on DBR. You can do this on almost any sports blog effortlessly and it is a great function-- but it's functionally impossible on DBR.

And can you imagine trying to find an article thread on DBR after a visit by the merge fairy?

None of this, BTW, is a tragedy. It is an annoyance, and it is handled better on other boards.

I agree that DBR is probably the best team blog out there. But I visit other sites, and I do sometimes think, "man, I'd love it if DBR had THIS." It seems that DBR has determined in some cases that the price of new functionality is too high. Fair enough. But it's legit that people either want to know why, or want to make a case that you reconsider. That's not a bad thing.

[devildeac]

Perhaps you're talking about this development?

I most certainly was not. I was going to post to/for Julian, -jk and Devil84 a note of hearty congrats/effusive praise/general suck-up-itude when they announced the merge/transition was complete. I was merely indicating I'd delay it a day or so when -jk said the process was not completed yet as of this AM.

[Jim3k]

Will our DBR password work on the other SBN sites? If we are signed in here, must we sign in again on sister SBN sites?

[GGLC]

I DO get the controversy, if you want to call it that.

It is FAR more convenient and more user-friendly to 1) post or read comments on the bottom of an article, than it is to 2) go to a completely different area, look for a thread and HOPE-- often wrongly-- that it was titled in a way that made it clear which article it was attached to. It's ludicrous to even debate this. Imagine trying to find comments on an article from more than a couple days ago on DBR. You can do this on almost any sports blog effortlessly and it is a great function-- but it's functionally impossible on DBR.

And can you imagine trying to find an article thread on DBR after a visit by the merge fairy?

None of this, BTW, is a tragedy. It is an annoyance, and it is handled better on other boards.

I agree that DBR is probably the best team blog out there. But I visit other sites, and I do sometimes think, "man, I'd love it if DBR had THIS." It seems that DBR has determined in some cases that the price of new functionality is too high. Fair enough. But it's legit that people either want to know why, or want to make a case that you reconsider. That's not a bad thing.

As someone who's been around since the juliovision days (as my username should at least in part demonstrate), I could not agree more with every bit of this post.

Jason C.

[DueBlevil]

I DO get the controversy, if you want to call it that.

It is FAR more convenient and more user-friendly to 1) post or read comments on the bottom of an article, than it is to 2) go to a completely different area, look for a thread and HOPE-- often wrongly-- that it was titled in a way that made it clear which article it was attached to. It's ludicrous to even debate this. Imagine trying to find comments on an article from more than a couple days ago on DBR. You can do this on almost any sports blog effortlessly and it is a great function-- but it's functionally impossible on DBR.

And can you imagine trying to find an article thread on DBR after a visit by the merge fairy?

None of this, BTW, is a tragedy. It is an annoyance, and it is handled better on other boards.

I agree that DBR is probably the best team blog out there. But I visit other sites, and I do sometimes think, "man, I'd love it if DBR had THIS." It seems that DBR has determined in some cases that the price of new functionality is too high. Fair enough. But it's legit that people either want to know why, or want to make a case that you reconsider. That's not a bad thing.

Yes this is also what I was trying to get at. You have stated it better than I did.

[-jk]

Will our DBR password work on the other SBN sites? If we are signed in here, must we sign in again on sister SBN sites?

SBN is one system, this board is a different system. The logins aren't mutual, and won't ever be. As we aren't having comments on the SBN DBR site (just as we haven't since the very beginning of dbr/juliovision), there isn't any meaningful change.

That said, the main page will change dramatically! Sometime this evening - if things go as expected. We think we have it resolved. (Those damned IT folks. )

-jk