Shane Ryan says Saturday is as good as it's going to get

[Billy Dat]

With all the complaining about Gottlieb, I am surprised how many DBR posters like Shane Ryan.

The Hardcourt Shuffle: A White Raven Leads Duke Over Miami
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...uke-over-miami

"The Blue Devils were supposed to come out incensed and blow Miami off the floor. Instead, they needed a miracle game from Kelly to win by three. Despite the loss, I was impressed with the Hurricanes. They came into a hornet's nest, withstood a series of body blows from Kelly, got eggs from Durand Scott and Reggie Johnson, and still almost won. On a neutral floor, they would have won. This team is the real deal. Duke, on the other hand, will not get the same performance every game from Kelly. They will not have the Cameron Magic on their side in the tournament. The flaws will emerge again"

[FerryFor50]

With all the complaining about Gottlieb, I am surprised how many DBR posters like Shane Ryan.

The Hardcourt Shuffle: A White Raven Leads Duke Over Miami
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...uke-over-miami

"The Blue Devils were supposed to come out incensed and blow Miami off the floor. Instead, they needed a miracle game from Kelly to win by three. Despite the loss, I was impressed with the Hurricanes. They came into a hornet's nest, withstood a series of body blows from Kelly, got eggs from Durand Scott and Reggie Johnson, and still almost won. On a neutral floor, they would have won. This team is the real deal. Duke, on the other hand, will not get the same performance every game from Kelly. They will not have the Cameron Magic on their side in the tournament. The flaws will emerge again"

Sigh. Criticisms like this are always one-sided.

For instance "got eggs from Durand Scott and Reggie Johnson and still almost won."

Well, Duke got eggs from Seth Curry and, arguably, Mason Plumlee and still won. Wash.

Miami was also the beneficiary of some friendly bounces at the end (such as the McKinney-Jones three and the Cook slide out of bounds) plus some uncharacteristic late game mistakes by Duke. Duke was up by 10 at one point and could have stayed there had they hit a normal FT %. Plus, Miami hit way above their FT% averages, so... wash.

No one predicted Duke would "blow Miami off the floor." In fact, many people thought it would be close, possibly with Miami taking the game.

"On a neutral floor, they would have won" is always a cop out. At the end of the day, both baskets are round, the ball is the same size and the court is still 94'X50'. Plus, there really is no such thing as a "neutral floor." There is always a fan contingent that travels... I'd say that Duke basketball fans travel better than Miami basketball fans would.

[Duvall]

With all the complaining about Gottlieb, I am surprised how many DBR posters like Shane Ryan.

The Hardcourt Shuffle: A White Raven Leads Duke Over Miami
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...uke-over-miami

"The Blue Devils were supposed to come out incensed and blow Miami off the floor. Instead, they needed a miracle game from Kelly to win by three. Despite the loss, I was impressed with the Hurricanes. They came into a hornet's nest, withstood a series of body blows from Kelly, got eggs from Durand Scott and Reggie Johnson, and still almost won. On a neutral floor, they would have won. This team is the real deal. Duke, on the other hand, will not get the same performance every game from Kelly. They will not have the Cameron Magic on their side in the tournament. The flaws will emerge again"

Not sure that a Shane Ryan column warrants a new thread. He doesn't understand basketball, and he isn't interesting. Was it "Cameron Magic" that caused Duke to go 16-26 from the free throw line Saturday, or Sulaimon and Curry to go 5-15 from the field?

[Ichabod Drain]

With all the complaining about Gottlieb, I am surprised how many DBR posters like Shane Ryan.

The Hardcourt Shuffle: A White Raven Leads Duke Over Miami
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...uke-over-miami

"The Blue Devils were supposed to come out incensed and blow Miami off the floor. Instead, they needed a miracle game from Kelly to win by three. Despite the loss, I was impressed with the Hurricanes. They came into a hornet's nest, withstood a series of body blows from Kelly, got eggs from Durand Scott and Reggie Johnson, and still almost won. On a neutral floor, they would have won. This team is the real deal. Duke, on the other hand, will not get the same performance every game from Kelly. They will not have the Cameron Magic on their side in the tournament. The flaws will emerge again"

If he believe's Miami is the real deal then how does he expect anyone to blow them off the floor...

[OldPhiKap]

With all the complaining about Gottlieb, I am surprised how many DBR posters like Shane Ryan.

The Hardcourt Shuffle: A White Raven Leads Duke Over Miami
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...uke-over-miami

"The Blue Devils were supposed to come out incensed and blow Miami off the floor. Instead, they needed a miracle game from Kelly to win by three. Despite the loss, I was impressed with the Hurricanes. They came into a hornet's nest, withstood a series of body blows from Kelly, got eggs from Durand Scott and Reggie Johnson, and still almost won. On a neutral floor, they would have won. This team is the real deal. Duke, on the other hand, will not get the same performance every game from Kelly. They will not have the Cameron Magic on their side in the tournament. The flaws will emerge again"

Miami has proven that it is the best team in conference play this year. They deserve credit for coming into an extremely fired-up cauldron, and coming within a whisker of beating us. And yes, it took an absurdly great performance by Ryan for us to pull that one out.

I think we will be better moving forward, and have no reason to doubt that Miami may improve as well. On a neutral court, I would not be surprised or insulted if we were a slight underdog.

Miami has two fifth-year seniors and sixth-year senior who turns 25 in a few months. Larkin is probably First Team All-ACC. Scott and Johnson are beasts.

But I like our chances anyway.

[Billy Dat]

Not sure that a Shane Ryan column warrants a new thread. He doesn't understand basketball, and he isn't interesting.

Agree, I couldn't find a more suitable thread for it and I wanted to share my angst at his typically off points about the team and program.

If he believes Miami is the real deal then how does he expect anyone to blow them off the floor...

This is often a point made after a Duke loss or close win...Duke isn't that good but the other team must be great.

[Billy Dat]

I think we will be better moving forward

This was precisely my feeling watching on Saturday...that, as Mason said post game, our ceiling had risen.

[ncexnyc]

All the points he made have been discussed on this board. Are they a tad extreme? Maybe, but it got your attention and now others on here will click-on as well, which is what the blog game is all about.

[sporthenry]

With all the complaining about Gottlieb, I am surprised how many DBR posters like Shane Ryan.

The Hardcourt Shuffle: A White Raven Leads Duke Over Miami
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...uke-over-miami

"The Blue Devils were supposed to come out incensed and blow Miami off the floor. Instead, they needed a miracle game from Kelly to win by three. Despite the loss, I was impressed with the Hurricanes. They came into a hornet's nest, withstood a series of body blows from Kelly, got eggs from Durand Scott and Reggie Johnson, and still almost won. On a neutral floor, they would have won. This team is the real deal. Duke, on the other hand, will not get the same performance every game from Kelly. They will not have the Cameron Magic on their side in the tournament. The flaws will emerge again"

I agree and appreciate you bringing him up. He has taken multiple shots at Duke including being one of the first national guys to talk about the grandma chant and he threw Duke under the bus before even knowing the whole story.

And I love this narrative coming out of the Duke game. Everyone talking about how Duke will be exposed b/c Kelly had an amazing game but they almost make it seem like Kelly is never going to play again. And they don't acknowledge that with him back, teams will have to adjust like they haven't had to for a month. Kelly might not break 20 again, but making a guy guard him, take away the double from Mason, open the lane for Duke's guards will be the things people don't notice.

And while Miami did well to keep it close, they won't continue to get to the rim that easily and that is really the only flaw Duke might have but seems correctable.

Never saw a team that lost almost get more credibility because they barely lost (even though it should have been a 10 point loss). And I'm not sure why Duke was expected to blow out a top 5 team? Sure they were at home but Kenpom has home court as I think a 4-5 point swing.

[UrinalCake]

Pretty sure everyone here hates Shane Ryan. These sort of anti-Duke rants are commonplace. And wasn't he the guy who tweeted the whole "how's your grandma" fabrication? I'm all for objective reporting, and I'm fine that not everyone sees Duke in the same positive light that I do, but Ryan takes things to such an extreme, making up stories just to pander for page hits, that he turns himself into a joke. The only reason he's on staff at grantland is that Bill Simmons is also a Duke hater (though he can actually show some semblence of respect and professionalism about it, on rare occasion)

[freshmanjs]

I'm not quite following how this is a "shot at duke" or "an anti-duke rant." He thinks Miami is better. You can make a good argument for that. He thinks Miami was more impressive on Saturday -- you can make a case for that too. Let him think Miami is better...I think he'll be proven wrong. Meantime, nothing he said is a slight against our program or an insult.

[Billy Dat]

All the points he made have been discussed on this board. Are they a tad extreme? Maybe, but it got your attention and now others on here will click-on as well, which is what the blog game is all about.

Your statement has helped me clarify something that I felt but couldn't quite put my finger on...Shane Ryan reminds me of typical glass-is-half-empty, self-loathing-Duke-fan DBR poster who occasionally makes make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark.

[Billy Dat]

I'm not quite following how this is a "shot at duke" or "an anti-duke rant." He thinks Miami is better. You can make a good argument for that. He thinks Miami was more impressive on Saturday -- you can make a case for that too. Let him think Miami is better...I think he'll be proven wrong. Meantime, nothing he said is a slight against our program or an insult.

"Mason Plumlee still stinks. At this point, he might be one of the worst interior defenders in Duke history. Over and over on Saturday, he tried to take awkward charges when defending the lane, or failed to provide adequate help when the guards got beat. There's nobody in America with worse instincts."

[freshmanjs]

"Mason Plumlee still stinks. At this point, he might be one of the worst interior defenders in Duke history. Over and over on Saturday, he tried to take awkward charges when defending the lane, or failed to provide adequate help when the guards got beat. There's nobody in America with worse instincts."

ah well that is helpful. i hadn't seen that quote. thanks.

[UrinalCake]

I'm not quite following how this is a "shot at duke" or "an anti-duke rant." He thinks Miami is better. You can make a good argument for that. He thinks Miami was more impressive on Saturday -- you can make a case for that too. Let him think Miami is better...I think he'll be proven wrong. Meantime, nothing he said is a slight against our program or an insult.

He basically said that Duke has peaked, that they only won this game because of luck and that Ryan won't do anything else for the rest of the year. He attributed poor performances by Miami's players to us being lucky, while he attributes poor performances by our guys to our guys being terrible. And he says that the optimism felt by Duke fans as well as other analysts is misguided.

I agree with many of the points that he made, including our team's weaknesses, but his tone and propensity for exaggeration and insult are pretty juvenile IMO

[mr. synellinden]

He basically said that Duke has peaked, that they only won this game because of luck and that Ryan won't do anything else for the rest of the year. He attributed poor performances by Miami's players to us being lucky, while he attributes poor performances by our guys to our guys being terrible. And he says that the optimism felt by Duke fans as well as other analysts is misguided.

I agree with many of the points that he made, including our team's weaknesses, but his tone and propensity for exaggeration and insult are pretty juvenile IMO

For what it's worth, there was a lot of talk like this about Duke's supposed weaknesses around the same time in 2010.

Let's see how the next few games go. If Duke resumes playing like the pre-Kelly injury team that went 15-0 against the toughest schedule in the country, we'll go into the tournament as as much of a favorite to win it as anyone.

For a contrary perspective from ESPN - check out Myron Medcalf's column:

Ryan Kelly's 36-point explosion in Saturday's win over Miami solidified Duke's slot as the No. 1 team in America in my mind. He's clearly a difference-maker for a team that maintained its elite status without him. But check the fine print on that effort: He went 10-for-14, while the rest of the starters hit a more modest 15-for-33.

This is obviously a dangerous team that can win its last two ACC games and the conference tournament. But the Blue Devils will have to adjust to playing together when Kelly's numbers reach a more reasonable level. How will the team respond when he's not in beast mode?

[JayBean]

He basically said that Duke has peaked, that they only won this game because of luck and that Ryan won't do anything else for the rest of the year. He attributed poor performances by Miami's players to us being lucky, while he attributes poor performances by our guys to our guys being terrible. And he says that the optimism felt by Duke fans as well as other analysts is misguided.

I agree with many of the points that he made, including our team's weaknesses, but his tone and propensity for exaggeration and insult are pretty juvenile IMO

I truly hope that the rest of our opponents believe that we have peaked. I saw a lot of room for team growth, assuming Mr Kelly can keep playing at a high level. We just won a game that

a) was against a top 5 team
b) was less than 48 hours after a very physical loss
c) was after we had less than half a practice with a key contributor coming back.

Mr Ryan seems to ignore that last point especially. Yes, Kelly may not go off for 36 again, but the team should re-adjust to him being around. This will greatly improve our defense and offense. Not to mention cut down on mistakes.

Everyone complaining about Mason not playing a great game against Miami has to realize that he has been playing without Ryan for 2 months. So he's gotten some habits (avoiding fouls, pacing himself for the full 40 mins) that he has to unlearn. That is not going to happen in 1 game after half a practice. The rest of the team probably didn't even know how much Ryan could give them minutes-wise.

Sorry for the rant. I just think that no one should really be too negative following this remarkable win. Put another way, this is the third 'team' that we have had this year that needs to figure out how to work together. Very similar to the first iteration, but slightly different (emergence of Amile, maturation of Rasheed, etc). I hope we can give it time (practice time is very precious now).

[OldPhiKap]

"Mason Plumlee still stinks. At this point, he might be one of the worst interior defenders in Duke history. Over and over on Saturday, he tried to take awkward charges when defending the lane, or failed to provide adequate help when the guards got beat. There's nobody in America with worse instincts."

See, that's what I get for responding to your reasonable post instead of reading the actual article.

That is just plain silly.

[weezie]

"There's nobody in America with worse instincts."

Oh, I dunno...Shane Ryan comes to mind...

[wilko]

I have a more optimistic view.
I tend to be the guy that drank the 1st part of the glass before everyone else noticed it had been touched...


What Kelly's performance DOES is eliminate any doubts about his health and conditioning. It'll FORCE opponents to honor that threat in the game plan to cover the 4. All the points about spacing are quite valid. Sheed, Cook, Curry and Thornton should find driving angles in a less congested lane.

What I'm more hopeful of is that this will energize an emotionally fatigued team. We've played a lotta games, most opponents try to "out-physical" us rather than play straight up. I'm sure its taken a toll on them.

As for Masons D - would you rather he foul out? One of the under-appreciated improvements in his game is staying on the court. I think there is a direct correlation to him taking LESS risks on D knowing - no one can fill in behind him. With Kelly back in the mix I think he will be able to challenge a bit more.