More info on UNC academic scandal

[DUKIE V(A)]

Does this sound like a man worried that anyone is about to launch a serious investigation?

Same guy who doesn't give a S#$% about Carolina?

[ForkFondler]

For the legal folks on this board, "Would the person who leaked the transcript be covered by the North Carolina, Whistle blowers law?

The transcript was probably not deliberately leaked. It had apparently sitting on a publically available folder since 2007 or so. A pack pride researcher found it by searching the directory, but it could also be found with google.

[PackMan97]

From an article in today's Greensboro "News & Record" Roy: "I challenge anybody to tell me one thing we've done wrong."

Pardon me, but I'm speechless at this. Talk about "Carolina Way" hubris. I have no words.

from 2007-2010, 7 basketball players were enrolled in "aberrant" courses which appear outright fraudulent. Another 16 basketball players enrolled in "irregular" courses which have significant concerns raised about their legitimacy.

Sorry Roy, basketball is involved.

[davekay1971]

from 2007-2010, 7 basketball players were enrolled in "aberrant" courses which appear outright fraudulent. Another 16 basketball players enrolled in "irregular" courses which have significant concerns raised about their legitimacy.

Sorry Roy, basketball is involved.

23 players enrolled in bad courses in four years? Given the size of a basketball team roster, the percentage of players enrolled in bad courses during that time must be relatively equivalent to the percentage of football players enrolled in similarly, ahem, questionable courses. Basketball may be as deeply involved as football (albeit without Coach Santa or Tutorgate).

[PackMan97]

23 players enrolled in bad courses in four years? Given the size of a basketball team roster, the percentage of players enrolled in bad courses during that time must be relatively equivalent to the percentage of football players enrolled in similarly, ahem, questionable courses. Basketball may be as deeply involved as football (albeit without Coach Santa or Tutorgate).

I found the official definition of "aberrant" and "irregular" as used by UNC.

An aberrant course is defined in that report as a course for which there is evidence that students completed written work in these courses, submitted it to the department and received grades, but no evidence that the faculty member listed as instructor of record or any other faculty member actually supervised the course and graded the work, although grade rolls were signed and submitted.

An irregular course is defined in that report as a course for which the instructor provided an assignment and evidently graded the resultant paper, but engaged in limited or no classroom or other instructional contact with students.

Manalishi over at PP has a refresher on the UNC malfeasance.
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=178&f=2515&t=9234240

[JTH]

All of the UNC guys in my office are taking the exact same approach. "The investigation is over. The NCAA is finished and not coming back. This is just noise about academic issues that has nothing to do about football and certainly not about basketball. There is nothing there, so we are not worried at all. Just State fans and local media trying to make something about nothing"

Another good one was "We know the Peppers transcript was planted by a State or Duke fan that hacked into UNC's website, and the only thing that will happen with that is said fan getting in trouble with the law for posting a student's transcript which is illegal."

So that is the local reaction at least amongst UNC folks I interact with daily. The Roy Williams comments are mind boggling. What did they do wrong? Well Roy, academic fraud is a fairly serious offense. You have players that took fraudulent classes receiving fraudulent credits, and those credit kept at least one basketball player eligible when otherwise he would not have been. That was in a final four year. So it is possible said player is ruled ineligible which means vacated wins. Any other challenges Roy??

Edit: Forgot to add that another UNC response in my office today was, "this easy class stuff goes on everywhere including Duke, so if there is an issue, all schools would have to be penalized, which certainly will not happen". "Duke being private is the only thing that saves them from having all their dirty laundry like this aired, but we know it happens there too"

Sigh...

I know that the tar heel faithful I associate with (you can call it slumming) fervently believed that Butch was not at all in danger as the whole football scandal (Part I) was unfolding. I told them early on that he was a dead man walking and they were just sure I was wrong.

If your associates were anything like mine and went through this same period of denial, you might find it amusing to remind them of that. I think that this defensive front of "we are not worried" is pretty much just whistling past the grave yard. Deep down, I think most of them have an uneasy queasiness that they just do not want to reveal.

[pamtar]

Obviously a lot more would have to happen to get to this point, but would players who recieved degrees loaded with bad classes still be considered graduates? And looking further ahead, under the new ncaa rules would UNC still meet the requirements to compete in the tournament?

[moonpie23]

why do y'all think the NCAA is dragging their feet on this?

[devilsadvocate85]

why do y'all think the NCAA is dragging their feet on this?

I may be wrong, but I've got to believe that the ACC & NCAA are praying that this can get cleaned up without any evidence leading back prior to 1998. And given the alleged Peppers' transcript, the timing gets very close.

[Matches]

So that is the local reaction at least amongst UNC folks I interact with daily. The Roy Williams comments are mind boggling. What did they do wrong? Well Roy, academic fraud is a fairly serious offense. You have players that took fraudulent classes receiving fraudulent credits, and those credit kept at least one basketball player eligible when otherwise he would not have been. That was in a final four year. So it is possible said player is ruled ineligible which means vacated wins. Any other challenges Roy??

The big UNC guy in my office is very worried - he takes a much more realistic approach IMO. Every school has easy classes. Every school has occasional academic dishonesty by student-athletes (we've had it at Duke too). The notion of the university actually setting up fake classes for athletes that did not require ANY coursework, though - that's a whole nother ball of wax. That doesn't happen "everywhere", and it's a VERY big deal.

re: Roy - I'm sure he'd discount the Peppers stuff as not having happened on his watch, which of course it did not. Lest we forget, though, there was a football player on the 2005 team.

[roywhite]

why do y'all think the NCAA is dragging their feet on this?

Don't really know; hasn't been a whole lot of media attention until recently.

FWIW, the ESPN President John Skipper is a Tarheel.

[Duvall]

why do y'all think the NCAA is dragging their feet on this?

What is that you think they should be doing - another investigation?

[wilko]

What is that you think they should be doing - another investigation?

I'd be perfectly content with some knee-jerk reactions that lead to further embarrassment, ridicule and general depreciation of the UNC Brand as a whole.

The Magnetic poles must be flipping - NCSU fans are obnoxious blowhards - UNC fans full of self-loathing. I for one Love it!

[dukedoc]

A brief blurb from the N&O about a possible outside panel investigation LINK

[JasonEvans]

It looks like UNC will announce later today the formation of an independent panel to investigate the new academic scandal. Former North Carolina Governor Jim Martin, a man of unquestioned integrity and not a UNC grad, will be a part of it according to this article.

-Jason "I imagine the panel will take some time, but this is exactly the kind of meaningful step I would expect UNC to take to show they truly recognize something serious is going on here" Evans

[PackMan97]

In other news, while the NCAA does not investigate or punish UNC for kids not going to class...

Rodney Purvis, due to being the first graduating class from his high school, is prevented from enrolling and taking classes this fall at NC State due to the NCAA not yet clearing Upper Room Christian Academy. Apparently, they care about high school academic standards, but not collegiate standards.

[OldPhiKap]

It looks like UNC will announce later today the formation of an independent panel to investigate the new academic scandal. Former North Carolina Governor Jim Martin, a man of unquestioned integrity and not a UNC grad, will be a part of it according to this article.

-Jason "I imagine the panel will take some time, but this is exactly the kind of meaningful step I would expect UNC to take to show they truly recognize something serious is going on here" Evans

I think Martin was on the Bd of Governors of UNC at some time. So not sure how that plays out.

I still don't understand what a "test" transcript is, why it would exist, and why it could be accessed by someone outside of the University. Can someone enlighten me?

Thanks, OPK

[PackMan97]

I still don't understand what a "test" transcript is, why it would exist, and why it could be accessed by someone outside of the University. Can someone enlighten me?

Thanks, OPK

It was an example of how their athletic department reviews student athletes course work and checks to see if their eligible. (or something like that).

[Bob Green]

In other news, while the NCAA does not investigate or punish UNC for kids not going to class...

Rodney Purvis, due to being the first graduating class from his high school, is prevented from enrolling and taking classes this fall at NC State due to the NCAA not yet clearing Upper Room Christian Academy.

In the long run, the NCAA might be doing NC State a favor.

[hudlow]

In the long run, the NCAA might be doing NC State a favor.

Good point...when the smoke clears on the Hill, you can bet the Carolina faithful will be looking for revenge.