Miles in the NBA

[MChambers]

I don't think Miles's performance at the NBA Combine and his physical attributes are a surprise to anyone who has followed Duke closely. The question with Miles is, and always has been, between the ears.

I agree with your first sentence, but not the second. There are physical basketball skills that aren't measured at the NBA Combine, as Kevin Durant has shown. I hope Miles gets drafted, but I don't think his relative lack of production at Duke had anything to do with his head.

Remember that he was ranked about #80 coming out of high school.

[hq2]

I hope Miles gets drafted, but I don't think his relative lack of production at Duke had anything to do with his head.

Remember that he was ranked about #80 coming out of high school.

No, I think it has to do with his hands and feet. People forget that Miles was not particularly good at
either catching the ball or moving to the basket once he caught it. He was known for turnovers
and traveling, and I'm not sure either is going to get that much better in the pros. I'd say he has
a relatively limited set of half court offensive skills for the pros; rebound, set screens and picks, hit the open jump shot, hit an occasional layup, shoot free throws (O.K., not great). His lack of any kind of reliable low post scoring moves will keep him from starting.

Where he begins to look useful is for his full court skills. Miles could definitely excel for the right
team playing in a bang-and-run rotation for about 10-15 minutes a game, with his size, good motor, and good leaping ability. Denver, Portland, the Clipppers or Phoenix, maybe, all might be interested in what he can bring in this area. Just needs to be on the right team where his skills will fit.

[CDu]

I agree with your first sentence, but not the second. There are physical basketball skills that aren't measured at the NBA Combine, as Kevin Durant has shown. I hope Miles gets drafted, but I don't think his relative lack of production at Duke had anything to do with his head.

Remember that he was ranked about #80 coming out of high school.

One could argue that he was only ranked about #80 out of high school because of his head. He clearly had the athleticism even in high school (state-ranked high jumper). The game has just not come naturally enough to him. He started to have things click this past year and finally started playing well. But he really struggled with his hands and footwork, and I think a fair amount of that was in his head.

Another key to his lack of production was that he basically played the same position as his brother, but his brother was better at it. The two sharing the court was a difficult pairing because they aren't quick laterally and they can't shoot (meaning they can't spread the defense).

[lotusland]

One could argue that he was only ranked about #80 out of high school because of his head. He clearly had the athleticism even in high school (state-ranked high jumper). The game has just not come naturally enough to him. He started to have things click this past year and finally started playing well. But he really struggled with his hands and footwork, and I think a fair amount of that was in his head.

Another key to his lack of production was that he basically played the same position as his brother, but his brother was better at it. The two sharing the court was a difficult pairing because they aren't quick laterally and they can't shoot (meaning they can't spread the defense).

Is it generally accepted that the Plums lack lateral quickness for their size? I've actually never noticed that deficiency

[CDu]

Is it generally accepted that the Plums lack lateral quickness for their size? I've actually never noticed that deficiency

I don't know if it is generally accepted or not. Miles may be quicker laterally than Mason. But Mason certainly seems "lumbering" in his play. Good straight-ahead speed and great leaping ability, but lumbering in a stop and go setting. Miles seemed a little more fluid than Mason in general, and perhaps he was even quick laterally (he scored well in all of the athletic tests). So maybe I'm projecting Mason's apparent deficiencies in this area onto Miles incorrectly.

However, I don't think Miles ever displayed the lateral quickness of the typical college PF (which is usually an NBA SF). And Mason definitely didn't display the lateral quickness of a college PF. That was my point in saying that it was tricky to put both on the floor together for long stretches.

[Li_Duke]

I don't know if it is generally accepted or not. Miles may be quicker laterally than Mason. But Mason certainly seems "lumbering" in his play. Good straight-ahead speed and great leaping ability, but lumbering in a stop and go setting. Miles seemed a little more fluid than Mason in general, and perhaps he was even quick laterally (he scored well in all of the athletic tests). So maybe I'm projecting Mason's apparent deficiencies in this area onto Miles incorrectly.

However, I don't think Miles ever displayed the lateral quickness of the typical college PF (which is usually an NBA SF). And Mason definitely didn't display the lateral quickness of a college PF. That was my point in saying that it was tricky to put both on the floor together for long stretches.

I think that's fair. College PFs often project to be NBA SFs. Miles and Mason project to be NBA centers (or maybe power forwards), they won't be expected to have enough lateral quickness to guard NBA SFs.

[luvdahops]

I think that's fair. College PFs often project to be NBA SFs. Miles and Mason project to be NBA centers (or maybe power forwards), they won't be expected to have enough lateral quickness to guard NBA SFs.

Our system is not well suited for two true posts playing at the same time, especially on defense, where the nominal PF must have sufficient mobility and quickness to handle switching on screens and cover a lot of ground on help situations. Our offense also tends to suffer when we don't have a 4 with decent range on the floor. We saw this when Kelly got hurt late this year. In addition, our offensive approach typically thrives on space for dribble penetration and kick-outs (not so much the case this past season), which is harder to come by with two bigs in and around the paint.

[gwlaw99]

2nd Day combine testing results available. Miles was third in max vert. He also had the second vertical reach (with steps) and did very well in the agility test. Rivers with a surprisingly decent vertical, but only 1 rep on bench press.

[NM Duke Fan]

SI had a nice section about Miles and how he is moving up into possibly being in the first round, scroll down in this article:

""Honestly, I feel like my athleticism is top notch," he said. "I don't think there's anyone with my blend of speed, strength, explosiveness. And I have a great skill base that I've worked on since I was little -- my ball handling, all of that. I have a lot more to offer than people know."

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...#ixzz1xo9I0ZMG

[hq2]

SI had a nice section about Miles and how he is moving up into possibly being in the first round, scroll down in this article:

""Honestly, I feel like my athleticism is top notch," he said. "I don't think there's anyone with my blend of speed, strength, explosiveness. And I have a great skill base that I've worked on since I was little -- my ball handling, all of that. I have a lot more to offer than people know."

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...#ixzz1xo9I0ZMG

Really doubt Miles would be a first rounder. Once the NBA execs get past the athleticism, they'll check the game films and see the same Miles we've seen the past four years; a great athlete with questionable hands and feet, and relatively low lateral quickness. Would be surprised to see him go anywhere higher than 40th, and might not even be drafted at all, if teams think they can just pick him up later (see Shavlik Randolph). Still, I believe with the right team, there's a home for him somewhere in the NBA. May just take a little time for him to find it.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

I'm no NBA exec, but I don't understand why some here are wont to beat down Miles' NBA potential. How many times have we watched great college players with outstanding shooting ability, passing skills, court awareness, etc., not get drafted, enjoy just a brief stint in the league or have a minimally productive career because of their lack of athleticism? Adam Morrison anyone? Scottie Reynolds? On this very board we have beaten our own heads against the wall knowing that some of our favorite players who had outstanding careers (far more productive many might say than Miles) would never make it at the next level because they were too short, too slow to defend, etc. And we sit here and watch with aggravation as super athletic kids from other hated teams get drafted despite their inability to throw the ball into the ocean. The NBA loves athletes. Just because Miles may never be a star center with amazing offensive skills doesn't mean he can't be incredibly effective as a role player. Every team needs them.

Enough of the negativity. Let's enjoy watching as one of our very own, incredibly gifted athletes does something amazing and gives us all something to be proud of. Duke sending a monster athlete to the NBA... who'da thunk it?

[mapleleafdevil]

He just needs to enter the NFL draft and not look back.

[PumpkinFunk]

I didn't think Miles had a problem with his feet or hands these past two seasons... definitely foul trouble, but that's such a hard thing to project. Because of the role he played, he didn't get to take advantage of his amazing rebounding (taken out of the post too often on both ends this past year), his better-than-given-credit-for mid-range jumper, his defense (solid, even if it was not flashy). Athletically, he's a stud. And he's a legit 6-11. His fundamentals are better than his brother. Defensively, he's way better than Mason. He was never the focal point of the team. He's someone who was written off because of the role he had on the team, but who you knew was going to be moving up on draft boards once he got to show off what he could do. Maybe not first round, but late first or early second are totally feasible.

[Class of '94]

I didn't think Miles had a problem with his feet or hands these past two seasons... definitely foul trouble, but that's such a hard thing to project. Because of the role he played, he didn't get to take advantage of his amazing rebounding (taken out of the post too often on both ends this past year), his better-than-given-credit-for mid-range jumper, his defense (solid, even if it was not flashy). Athletically, he's a stud. And he's a legit 6-11. His fundamentals are better than his brother. Defensively, he's way better than Mason. He was never the focal point of the team. He's someone who was written off because of the role he had on the team, but who you knew was going to be moving up on draft boards once he got to show off what he could do. Maybe not first round, but late first or early second are totally feasible.

From all accouts, Miles has looked great in Duke practices and workouts for a long time. But to be fari, there has to be a reason why he was never the focal point of the team. IMO, if Miles had played as well in games as he reportedly did in practice and the NBA workouts, he would've been a focal point. It still remains to be seen if he can translate his practice habits to actual "live" games. The great thing about this NBA draft potential is that he doesn't have to worry about playing in games to get drafted.

[hq2]

From all accouts, Miles has looked great in Duke practices and workouts for a long time. But to be fari, there has to be a reason why he was never the focal point of the team. IMO, if Miles had played as well in games as he reportedly did in practice and the NBA workouts, he would've been a focal point. It still remains to be seen if he can translate his practice habits to actual "live" games. The great thing about this NBA draft potential is that he doesn't have to worry about playing in games to get drafted.

The NBA drafts on both upside and skill level. From their point of view, athletically, Miles clearly has
plenty of upside. However, at some point, the skills must improve too. Since Miles had four years at
Duke to show improvement (which, he did, some) they legitimately have to ask whether he's really capable of consistently playing at this level in the pros in actual game situations. Clearly, he's worth a late second round pick just for him to be an occasional off the bench and good practice player, but I think an NBA exec would be considering it a risk at this point to expect more from him. That's why I don't think he'll go that high.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

The NBA drafts on both upside and skill level. From their point of view, athletically, Miles clearly has
plenty of upside. However, at some point, the skills must improve too. Since Miles had four years at
Duke to show improvement (which, he did, some) they legitimately have to ask whether he's really capable of consistently playing at this level in the pros in actual game situations. Clearly, he's worth a late second round pick just for him to be an occasional off the bench and good practice player, but I think an NBA exec would be considering it a risk at this point to expect more from him. That's why I don't think he'll go that high.

But don't most guys beyond, say, the top 10 picks represent a risk for any GM? And especially as you get into picks later in the first and certainly into the second round? Heck, many would argue that even picks in the top 5 can be pretty darn risky given the potential for busts. Plenty of those on record. We'll find out soon enough exactly how GMs are thinking about MP1 but I guess I would not be surprised at this point to see him break into bottom of Rd1 or top of Rd2 given his athleticism and what it seems to represent to GMs in terms of potential value in the league. It probably won't turn out this way, but really how different is MP1 from Fab Melo who is projected to go in the mid 20s? By the way, MP1 scored better than Melo on every athletic test at the combine. Give MP1 a star PG like he might have had with KI and he starts to look even better. We'll see...

[hq2]

But don't most guys beyond, say, the top 10 picks represent a risk for any GM? And especially as you get into picks later in the first and certainly into the second round? Heck, many would argue that even picks in the top 5 can be pretty darn risky given the potential for busts. Plenty of those on record. We'll find out soon enough exactly how GMs are thinking about MP1 but I guess I would not be surprised at this point to see him break into bottom of Rd1 or top of Rd2 given his athleticism and what it seems to represent to GMs in terms of potential value in the league. It probably won't turn out this way, but really how different is MP1 from Fab Melo who is projected to go in the mid 20s? By the way, MP1 scored better than Melo on every athletic test at the combine. Give MP1 a star PG like he might have had with KI and he starts to look even better. We'll see...

Yes, all picks represent a risk of some type; would anyone have thought Greg Oden would be a complete bust? (I thought he was overrated, but never thought he'd be a complete washout...) The difference between Miles and those likely to go ahead of him is that they showed that they could consistently perform at a high level, and Miles didn't. With Miles, the pros would be betting that somehow at this level, he would fix whatever it is that has prevented him from being consistently good (hands? feet? head? who knows...). It's not out of the question; the pro game, favoring speed and athleticism, with good point guards, may be more to his liking. It's just that they have to see some evidence that he could play at that level consistently, and we haven't seen it yet. That still
makes it a risk.

[gwlaw99]

But don't most guys beyond, say, the top 10 picks represent a risk for any GM? And especially as you get into picks later in the first and certainly into the second round? Heck, many would argue that even picks in the top 5 can be pretty darn risky given the potential for busts. Plenty of those on record. We'll find out soon enough exactly how GMs are thinking about MP1 but I guess I would not be surprised at this point to see him break into bottom of Rd1 or top of Rd2 given his athleticism and what it seems to represent to GMs in terms of potential value in the league. It probably won't turn out this way, but really how different is MP1 from Fab Melo who is projected to go in the mid 20s? By the way, MP1 scored better than Melo on every athletic test at the combine. Give MP1 a star PG like he might have had with KI and he starts to look even better. We'll see...

MP1's only bad score was standing reach which is helpful when defending on the block without leaving your feet. Melo also averaged 3 blocks per game.

[Kedsy]

...really how different is MP1 from Fab Melo who is projected to go in the mid 20s? By the way, MP1 scored better than Melo on every athletic test at the combine.

The difference between Miles and those likely to go ahead of him is that they showed that they could consistently perform at a high level, and Miles didn't.

Your response does not answer his question about Fab Melo.

Miles's stats last season: 6.6 ppg, 7.1 rpg, 0.9 bpg in 20.5 mpg

Melo's stats last season: 7.8 ppg, 5.8 rpg, 2.9 bpg in 25.4 mpg

Melo had much better blocked shots than Miles, but Miles rebounding is a lot better than Melo's. How has Fab Melo shown he could "consistently perform at a high level" more than Miles has?

[Greg_Newton]

MP1's only bad score was standing reach which is helpful when defending on the block without leaving your feet. Melo also averaged 3 blocks per game.

It's helpful in a lot of ways if you're a big guy, really. You're not going to achieve your max vert every time you need to contest a shot, get a rebound, go up for a shot/dunk, or even just get your hands up to prevent a shot from being taken. Fab Melo: 9'2. Miles: 8'8.5/8'9.5, depending on the combine. That's essentially the difference between Kyle Singler and John Henson.