K and Patrick are friends and always busting each others chops.
I have seen Coach K teach the bigs in practice on getting to the spot and bracing for the charge vs initiating the contact reaching in/over to block the shot. He stated that the latter would be a foul call on the defender 99% of the time. I agree with the philosophy, but my only issue is when the offensive player is a smallish guard. Going for the block on the smallish player is the better play IMO, at least in certain situations. If a 6'11 guy cannot block the shot of a 5'11-6'1/6'2 guard without fouling, then shame on him.
As for penalty for flopping, I would be ok for it to be an automatic foul on the defender and in cases of a blatantly obvious flop where the whole world clearly sees there was no contact, then hit the defender with a Technical. That would go a long way to stopping it.
Duke FB 2013 Coastal Division Football Champions
I listen to Patrick all the time. He loves Coach K. Whenever coach is on, the two of them go at it (in a brotherly or friendly type of way)...
There is not a single doubt in my mind that Patrick was just trying to have some fun.
-As for the topic of flopping in general, I agree something needs to be done. It would be great to have some sort of in-game penalty but the plays are so subjective that it would only bring on more controversy IMO. I like the idea of having the league review questionable plays after the game and giving out suspensions or something like that though. It would definitely make guys think twice.
I have heard the idea of fining the players but I am completely against that. You would have to fine them absurd amounts to actually effect them. I think that when a professional sports league fines their millionaire players amounts of money that some people don't even make in a year, they make themselves look very bad.
On the spot, give the offending player a technical foul. After the fact, in the post-game review by the league, give him a warning. The second offense gets a one-game suspension.
No, I wouldn't try to unravel the block-charge conundrum. I would go after the total fakers. And the refs can do it during the game or the league can do it afterwards. And if a player falls down in anticipation of contact that never occurred, he can avoid sanctions by fessing up to the refs on the spot.
Simple enough? And there is no reason it wouldn't work in college or the NBA.
Last edited by Newton_14; 05-15-2012 at 09:11 PM.
Duke FB 2013 Coastal Division Football Champions
I do not, however, favor sanctioning players for flopping, and have never seen rationale for doing so that I find compelling. Shall we sanction, via technical fouls and suspensions, other acts of subterfuge and deception as well? How about an offensive player who yells "and one" upon shooting in hopes of drawing a foul call and/or continuation? If he wasn't fouled, or was clearly fouled before the act of shooting, should that result in a technical? How about an offensive player who attempts to trick an official into calling a shooting foul by flinging the ball at the basket when fouled in the backcourt? All of those are attempts to win undeserved favorable calls. How are they qualitatively different from flopping? What is it about flopping that necessitates technical fouls and suspensions?
The refs already have a rule to cite: unsportsmanlike conduct (rule 2, sec 8). A nice catch-all for anything that goes over the line.
Even if Patrick was tongue in cheek, having fun, or whatever, the fact that the "joke" is made, the meme is repeated, or however you want to term it, is what causes damage. Even if done in fun. If something is said, even in jest, often enough, people start to believe there is a kernel of truth, at least, in it. And this particular accusation, whether made seriously or in jest, has been repeated over and over and over again, over a period of many years, and the result has been its acceptance and repetition by many members of the media and lots and lots of anti-Duke fans. While it can be debated, I suppose, as to how much the adoption of this into the conventional wisdom actually hurts Duke, I know one thing: it don't help.
You be concerned about what you want to be concerned about, and I'll be concerned about what I want to be concerned about, and neither of us will judge the other for it.
I feel the issue being discussed is something that hurts Duke. I care about that. You don't have to agree, or you don't have to care about it, and that's fine. But I'm not the only one who believes the insertion of this meme into the conventional wisdom out there is something that is a big picture negative for the Duke program. Nobody's jumping off a bridge about it, but it's an appropriate issue for discussion and for concern.
Most of the comments I read about Duke from coaches and players I interpret as "working the refs." I can live with the Dan Patrick comments.
I see UK as having a similar problem. None of their more respectable fans (if there are any) can shake the perception of the program as rife with cheating and NCAA violations. Likewise for them -- to paraphrase myself from above -- even if that problem does affect recruiting, the recruits that would be scared away by the cheating are the ones they don't want at UK anyway.
"With seven national titles and 20 Final Fours in the 64-team NCAA Tournament era, Duke and UNC have had more playoff success than any other CONFERENCE." - Al Featherston
I was thinking that when Jefferson chose Duke the other day and cited the school's academics, that's a perception that works in our favor that other schools must gnash their teeth over. Before anyone jumps on me, I recognize that it's a perception that is also a reality (Duke is a great school), and our players have to perform in the classroom, but they also get tons of help and resources to guide them. Duke is great, but it's not like we have the market cornered on great professors, etc.
Geez, look at the legs on this story - must be the dog days of summer. How long until tip off again?
I'd say there's an even split between Duke fans who are appalled that Dan Patrick would piggy-back on decades of stereotypes about Duke flopping, and those Duke fans who feel that this hypersensitivity just piggybacks on the stereotype that Duke fans are elitist and feel their program is above reproach.
Whatever happened to turning the other cheek? I guarantee you that each of us on this thread has spend more time worrying over any aspect of this than K has.
Next play please?