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  1. #1
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    Tiger performs heroic feat of barely making the cut at the Players Championship

    http://espn.go.com/golf/leaderboard?tournamentId=1028

    12 strokes off the lead, tied for 84,

  2. #2
    So did 81 other golfers not named Tiger.
    ~rthomas


  3. #3
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    What a beautiful thing it is to see Tiger miss a cut. Now, if we can just get ESPN to cover the sport on the weekends where Tiger doesn't play or doesn't compete. That 380 yard bomb Rory hit today (which reached the crowd crossing the fairway) should be on 'center tonight but it won't since Tiger or Phil didn't hit it.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by elvis14 View Post
    What a beautiful thing it is to see Tiger miss a cut. Now, if we can just get ESPN to cover the sport on the weekends where Tiger doesn't play or doesn't compete. That 380 yard bomb Rory hit today (which reached the crowd crossing the fairway) should be on 'center tonight but it won't since Tiger or Phil didn't hit it.
    An Irishman sending a bomb into a crowd at a US sporting event? Call Homeland Security!

    BTW - I don't belive any of the other 81 golfers that missed the cut have restricted access by the media, instead producing their own one-sided "video-chat" with fans. Nor have any said that they "have experienced success - and know what it takes - and will get to that level again" Tiger's ego makes his failure enjoyable to me.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by BD80 View Post
    An Irishman sending a bomb into a crowd at a US sporting event? Call Homeland Security!

    BTW - I don't belive any of the other 81 golfers that missed the cut have restricted access by the media, instead producing their own one-sided "video-chat" with fans. Nor have any said that they "have experienced success - and know what it takes - and will get to that level again" Tiger's ego makes his failure enjoyable to me.
    Conversly, virtually none of the other 81 can draw mass crowds to a golf tournament or cause a huge bump in the TV audience if he plays. Like him or not, Tiger is the heart of the Tour today - just as Arnie and then Jack were in their day.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Indoor66 View Post
    Conversly, virtually none of the other 81 can draw mass crowds to a golf tournament or cause a huge bump in the TV audience if he plays. Like him or not, Tiger is the heart of the Tour today - just as Arnie and then Jack were in their day.
    Uh... that's WAS the heart of the Tour. Now he's just an example of what can happen when one travels down that Lost Highway. Golf has rebounded nicely since Tiger's fall from grace. He may yet recover, but for now, Tiger is just a giant sideshow.

    "Now, boys, don't start your ramblin' round
    On this road of sin, or you're sorrow bound.
    Take my advice or you'll curse the day
    You started rollin' down that lost highway."

    Lost Highway, by Leon Payne (1948)

    famously sung by Hank Williams, also by Nitty Gritty Dirt Band on Will the Circle Be Unbroken, Vol. I.
    Man, if your Mom made you wear that color when you were a baby, and you're still wearing it, it's time to grow up!

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by killerleft View Post
    Uh... that's WAS the heart of the Tour. Now he's just an example of what can happen when one travels down that Lost Highway. Golf has rebounded nicely since Tiger's fall from grace. He may yet recover, but for now, Tiger is just a giant sideshow.

    "Now, boys, don't start your ramblin' round
    On this road of sin, or you're sorrow bound.
    Take my advice or you'll curse the day
    You started rollin' down that lost highway."

    Lost Highway, by Leon Payne (1948)

    famously sung by Hank Williams, also by Nitty Gritty Dirt Band on Will the Circle Be Unbroken, Vol. I.
    We get this same thread every time a thread is started on a PGA tour event. Oh I hate Tiger. Oh I love Tiger.
    ~rthomas


  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by rthomas View Post
    We get this same thread every time a thread is started on a PGA tour event. Oh I hate Tiger. Oh I love Tiger.
    I actually would love to see Tiger back at the top of his game. Fact is, though, that before his private life was made public he won a bunch of majors, including one of them on one leg. Now, he misses cuts in regular events. Physical problems? Sure, he's got 'em. But between the ears is where Tiger has been wounded the most.

    Unless he becomes the toughest-minded golfer out there again, there is plenty of old video tape if you want to see the real Tiger.
    Man, if your Mom made you wear that color when you were a baby, and you're still wearing it, it's time to grow up!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by killerleft View Post
    I actually would love to see Tiger back at the top of his game. Fact is, though, that before his private life was made public he won a bunch of majors, including one of them on one leg. Now, he misses cuts in regular events. Physical problems? Sure, he's got 'em. But between the ears is where Tiger has been wounded the most.

    Unless he becomes the toughest-minded golfer out there again, there is plenty of old video tape if you want to see the real Tiger.
    What we saw on Thursday and Friday is the real Tiger, 2012. Sure he has issues between the ears but his health is also a factor. He's trying to return to being the "best of the best of the best sir" not to being D.A. Points and the issues he's had (in particular with his knee) will make that difficult no matter how straight he can get his head.

    Much more important that Tiger this week is Ricky Fowler winning his first PGA event and doing it with a fantastic shot on the first hole of the playoff!
    Last edited by elvis14; 05-07-2012 at 01:56 PM. Reason: Fowler stuff added

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by elvis14 View Post
    What we saw on Thursday and Friday is the real Tiger, 2012. Sure he has issues between the ears but his health is also a factor. He's trying to return to being the "best of the best of the best sir" not to being D.A. Points and the issues he's had (in particular with his knee) will make that difficult no matter how straight he can get his head.

    Much more important that Tiger this week is Ricky Fowler winning his first PGA event and doing it with a fantastic shot on the first hole of the playoff!
    Fowler's win was a big one for the PGA Tour, as well. His popularity is already high. Agreed, that was one fine approach shot! He was acting so loose, joking around before the playoff, I was afraid he was trying to cover up for major jitters, but he put together four excellent strokes for the win.
    Man, if your Mom made you wear that color when you were a baby, and you're still wearing it, it's time to grow up!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by killerleft View Post
    Fowler's win was a big one for the PGA Tour, as well. His popularity is already high. Agreed, that was one fine approach shot! He was acting so loose, joking around before the playoff, I was afraid he was trying to cover up for major jitters, but he put together four excellent strokes for the win.
    I don't know why but I just loved it when Rickey and Rory were cutting up a little bit with the camera's rolling right before the playoff. That 3 wood Rory hit was incredible but paled in comparison to Rickey's approach.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by killerleft View Post
    I actually would love to see Tiger back at the top of his game. Fact is, though, that before his private life was made public he won a bunch of majors, including one of them on one leg. Now, he misses cuts in regular events. Physical problems? Sure, he's got 'em. But between the ears is where Tiger has been wounded the most.

    Unless he becomes the toughest-minded golfer out there again, there is plenty of old video tape if you want to see the real Tiger.
    I think that it is all physical--that playing Tory with two hairline fractures (apparently present for much of that season) and a torn ACL has cost Tiger his career, that is, a career as a Championship player. He has changed his swing plane several times to put less torque on that leg, but that will not stop the occasional slight twinge, or slight hint of the knee catching, having to sort of hop over an impediment (think micro inside the joint) that impede a swing, and even more importantly, a putting stroke (he pushes putts right often and then will "release" the club head, which is to say get handsy. Handsy will not hold up.

    The knee has also caused him to compensate in ways that go much deeper than a change in swing plane can address. There has to be an entirely different organization of his body, one that is far less the supremely organized machine that permitted Tiger to be Tiger. The new organization is unfamiliar and changing and causes Tiger not to know how he will show up perhaps even from hole to hole. They'll be a continuing array of strains, etc, that will prevent him from even playing tournament golf.

    Tiger, the creation of Pops, is no more. It seems to me obvious, elusively so to so many.

  13. #13
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    The "hits" just keep on coming:

    [Brandel] Chamblee, speaking on Woods’ work with Foley, bluntly offered up his fix.

    “Simply, he needs to fire Sean (Foley), call Butch (Harmon),” Chamblee said. “I think that would get it done right there. I know he'll never do that, because he's letting his ego get in the way of common sense. He wants to prove to people he's right. He would rather prove to people he's right than be right.”
    http://www.golfchannel.com/news/rand...icism-of-game/

  14. #14
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    Chamlee needs to ask himself who "coached" Woods when that swing that broke his left leg in two places and tore his ACL and cartlege. Does the term "Butch" Come to mind? Tiger's swing loaded incredible torque, unwound with unheard of speed into a rigid left leg that had no rise in it as the club came around to absorb any of the shock at the completion of the swing. Heany did noting to change that but rather enhanced the force by making Tiger's swing flatter. His current coach seems to be trying to help Tiger develop a swing that will put much less force into that knee and to equip him to play Championship golf. I applaud both he and Tiger, but think that they have to fail.

    You want proof that Harmon is the wrong coach at the wrong time for Tiger now, as he searches unsuccessfully for a swing that will put less force into that left leg, look only to the damage that that swing that Harmon helped develop and tweak has wrought. Chamlee needs to get out a physics book or consult one of those biophysics experts who have this high tech equipment and have them crunch some numbers based upon replications of the swing that Chamblee apparently wants Harmon to help Tiger to reinstate, and then get one of those biophysics experts (or whatever they are called) to offer an opinion as to whether that Swing, especially when employed as it was so often at max froce/speed to get Tiger out of seeming impossible lies, could possibly have held up to a human leg. Heck, we already know the answer. It didn't.

    Like I said, some athletes, often the most gifted, use their gifts in ways that anyone with a care about it would know puts their bodies and careers at great risk. That is what appears might be the case with respect to a second professional athlete in Chicage. The first was Gale Sayers, widely regarded as the "best" back of all time, as if competing in a manner that cut his career off at the knees (I couldn't resist) didn't count--that it didn't matter that Sayers played with a reckless abandon that made his talent of no use to anyone. Could other backs with Sayers' litheness, quickness speed, and erect posture (essential for the quickest of direction changes) have achieved Sayers' same numbers, same pizzazz, who knows. Maybe some were unwilling to try. At any rate, while sports writers and talking heads celebrate this guy they ignore irresponsibility, poor judgment and a lack of self awareness and control, as if they play no part in the equation when the term "the greatest" is thrown around.

    The other great Chicago athlete who might just have screwed the pooch and be in Sayers' same shoes is Derrik Rose. The guy had the best combination of speed, quickness, leaping and cutting and twisting ability, and the brain that goes with those abilities and put them into effect action in attacking the basket as anyone this side of Iverson the game has ever seen, but he has gone down and has everyone in the Chicago organization worried that the Rose that they have been marketing might well have been bought in ways that they never imagined because they were too busy counting the receipts.

    At risk play of this sort is now the signature of football and basketball stardoom at every level. In fact, it seems that it is now a base level requirement to even get a seat on the bench at any of those levels. People refuse to count the numbers because "football has always been a dangerous game" and because who cares about the fodder that fills out the field. Their careers are short-lived anyway and the long-term costs of medical care are born by a health care system that the rest of America plays for, both while these guys pay and through the rest of their lives. People don't care and most players don't either (except Hall of Famer Willie Lanier who after one teeth rattling hit of the sort that is now required form, decided to go old school and wreasle his opponents down, so don't tell me that football has always been the same "rough" sport that it is today, because Willie Lanier, Hall of Fame Willie Lanier, says otherwise.

    But, this head-in-the sand approach even when it fells stars in the rough games seems incipid or uneducated by the folks who comment and report on these sports. They can only say , what a shame as they wait for a knee to get all better, even well after we know that it won't. Well, what can you say, no one goes out and kills the goose and all that.

    This thing about Tiger has taken this nonsense to an entirely different level. Even if against all reason that somehow this is just a slump by Tiger or a matter of his having the wrong swing coach, has anyone seen or heard anyone in the media mention the damage wrought to that leg as the root of Tiger's problem, and that that root ain't going away? I haven't.

    I have to add one thing. Even great athletes have habituated movement patterns that escape their attention and that with all their ability to devise new shots to meet all sorts of challenges they lack the skills to identify and change. That's the way it is with all of us. We, however, have not lived our lives as finely tuned machines, as the most finally tuned machines that the world has produced. The patterns that are most essential for everything we do involve the use of the pelvis, the power center of the body. If you have been playing golf since you were a four year old protege and are now in your mid 30s what's the chance that you possibly are even aware of all that goes into that talent; how to develop something different, come on.

    Talking about a "knee" or a "leg" when it comes to injury is illogical in the extreme if you think about it. The forces imparted that caused the injuries to Tiger effect how Tiger does everything, and that knee and leg are useful in discussing the injury and pain that Tiger has, in treating them allopathically, in a way that hopefully makes the pain go away and the knee joint to function pretty near as it should, that is, have close to the same type ability to twist, turn, bend and bear weight that normal activity would permit. But, addressing those so-called parts without taking the rest of how Tiger's habits cause him to carry himself and move will not change the habituated behaviors that makes those aspects of Tiger's skeleton and anatomy do what they do and bear what they bear. That is root of Tiger's dilemma--all of him caused his injuries and doctors, physical therapists, the best physical trainers and swing coaches money can do nothing that can help Tiger to change who he is.

    A very famous neuroscientist, you can check his 20 minute talk on the subject if you like, has stated, defended, and offered proof that the most important function that the mind plays is movement. He makes clear that he is not talking about functions performed at an elemental level by the autonomic nervous system, the need for the heart to function, to salvate, to breath, to eliminate, etc. He is talking about the aspects of movement that are or can be subject to conscious control. he has performed experiments to prove his point and to touch the surface about how conscious control is developed. By definition, this investigation is at it's infancy. There are any number of very accomplished neuroscientists of the past, one the head of the neuroscience department at Standford who had reached the same conclusion. (forgive me for forgetting names).

    Where I am going with this? Certainly not whree Tiger and his phalanx of experts are. I think Tiger is cooked and that all the king's horses and all the king's men can't and won't change that reality.

    I doubt that even the genius that made Tiger, Tiger, and I mean that with all the respect in the world, can. He just doesn't have the time. Sad, I so enjoyed to watch golf; it just doesn't hold my interest anymore. What is even sadder is to watch the Champion that Tiger is try to play his way out of this out there in front of all of us.

    Guys like Chamlee tire me. These guys didn't hesitate to honor Tiger for his courage as he hobbled down the fairways of Torrey Pines when he made the cash registers go ca ching. I think that they should show the same honor for Tiger's courage now, or at least shut up.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    Where I am going with this? Certainly not whree Tiger and his phalanx of experts are. I think Tiger is cooked and that all the king's horses and all the king's men can't and won't change that reality.
    He played not so bad today at 68.
    ~rthomas


  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by rthomas View Post
    He played not so bad today at 68.
    From ESPN's story on the tourney...

    The cut claimed No. 1-ranked Rory McIlroy, No. 5 Hunter Mahan, No. 6 Steve Stricker -- whose consecutive cut streak ended at 49 on the PGA Tour -- and No. 9 Webb Simpson, who missed his first cut of the year.
    I eagerly await the thread about how Rory missed a cut.

    -Jason "I keed, I keed" Evans
    Don't ask me why, but my mother is making me Tweet. Says it will be good for my career. So, follow my ramblings, mostly on the film industry, @TVFilmTalk

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by rthomas View Post
    He played not so bad today at 68.
    I think it's wonderful when Tiger plays well; I just don't see him doing it on a regular basis, not often enough to even make the cut in a fair number of cases. In addition to hitting some awful shots, he often has no control over ball flight. On and around the greens is often just as problematic. I hope that Tiger can hold it together and play really well for four rounds. It would be great to see him in contention, to me he is the Entire show, and I think that he might have it in him to actually close the deal a couple of times. Right now, and it's been this way for quite along time, it's not looking real great that that's going to happen. We'll see.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    I think it's wonderful when Tiger plays well; I just don't see him doing it on a regular basis, not often enough to even make the cut in a fair number of cases. In addition to hitting some awful shots, he often has no control over ball flight. On and around the greens is often just as problematic. I hope that Tiger can hold it together and play really well for four rounds. It would be great to see him in contention, to me he is the Entire show, and I think that he might have it in him to actually close the deal a couple of times. Right now, and it's been this way for quite along time, it's not looking real great that that's going to happen. We'll see.
    I think you're overstating things a bit here. Woods has 4 top-5 finishes in 10 tournaments this year, and it would likely have been 5 had he not withdrawn with injury in the final round of another tournament. He's missed one cut this year, and has only missed one cut per year in each of the last 4 years. He's currently ranked 7th in the world. So he's in the hunt for a win much more often than he's in danger of missing the cut. Hardly the "missing the cut in a fair number of cases" scenario. By anyone else's standards he's still an elite PGA Tour golfer. He's just not the dominant force he used to be.

    Everyone on tour misses cuts. Most, even in the top-10 of the rankings, miss multiple cuts per year. The fact that Tiger misses a cut per year and it's news tells you he's still a big deal and a pretty good golfer. A jerk, but a pretty darn good golfer.

    I don't expect him to go back to dominating the tour like he used to do, and I agree that the knee is a huge part of that. But he can still win tournaments (as he has done this year already) and he can still compete at majors. He's just another top-tier golfer rather than standing alone as THE top-tier golfer.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    I think you're overstating things a bit here. Woods has 4 top-5 finishes in 10 tournaments this year, and it would likely have been 5 had he not withdrawn with injury in the final round of another tournament. He's missed one cut this year, and has only missed one cut per year in each of the last 4 years. He's currently ranked 7th in the world. So he's in the hunt for a win much more often than he's in danger of missing the cut. Hardly the "missing the cut in a fair number of cases" scenario. By anyone else's standards he's still an elite PGA Tour golfer. He's just not the dominant force he used to be.

    Everyone on tour misses cuts. Most, even in the top-10 of the rankings, miss multiple cuts per year. The fact that Tiger misses a cut per year and it's news tells you he's still a big deal and a pretty good golfer. A jerk, but a pretty darn good golfer.

    I don't expect him to go back to dominating the tour like he used to do, and I agree that the knee is a huge part of that. But he can still win tournaments (as he has done this year already) and he can still compete at majors. He's just another top-tier golfer rather than standing alone as THE top-tier golfer.
    I agree with much of the above. The bottom line, IMO, is that he is still a top golfer who will likely win 2-3 tournaments a year (particularly on his favorite venues) but I just don't see him returning to dominating the tour. There are several reasons for this. He is 36 years old and is, perhaps, an old 36 given his past injuries and the fact that he has played a lot of golf (and practice) since his dad starting working with him at a very young age. Another big reason, IMO, is that the PGA tour is deeper than ever and most of the up and coming American players and the Euros simply don't fear him. Several, when paired with him, have outplayed him.

    For health reasons, I've stayed inside and watched a lot of golf early this year and the play has been terrific. I found it interesting that viewership of Sunday play is up over 30% with Tiger not doing most of the heavy lifting. I think that this is a clear indication that we are in a transition period where Rory, Ricky, Bubba, Luke and others are beginning to lead the way. I don't see a Nicklaus or Woods among the current crop but you never know.

    gw67

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by gw67 View Post
    For health reasons, I've stayed inside and watched a lot of golf early this year and the play has been terrific. I found it interesting that viewership of Sunday play is up over 30% with Tiger not doing most of the heavy lifting. I think that this is a clear indication that we are in a transition period where Rory, Ricky, Bubba, Luke and others are beginning to lead the way. I don't see a Nicklaus or Woods among the current crop but you never know.

    gw67
    There is a lot of parity at the top of the golf world right now, that is for sure.

    And what about Kevin Na. I feel sorry for him that he has the Barkleys, and there is no place for heckling by the crowd at any place, but I wouldn't want to play with him and I wouldn't want him in the group one ahead of me on a crowed Sunday at my golf course.
    ~rthomas


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