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  1. #1
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    Larry Brown: Formidable Competition Calipari Who? There's a New Kid on the Bloc

    Calipari is talented at coaching talent, in particular at helping the-best of the best one and doners prepare for the pros and win big during their year of apprenticeship. The key, in my opinion, to his consistent success at recruiting these budding stars has been getting the top-rate point (who wouldn't want to play with a star point in a pro style game? And, I have to believe that the key to Calipari's considtent success in landing that point year in and year out has been Strickland.

    Strickland has left, and he is now with a coach, a developer of talent who can run circles around Cal. The combination of Strickland's ability to mentor a star quality point, to model and teach the dazzling parts of the game, has to have been Calipari's best selling point. Why else did he have Stricland around. If the opportunity to learn the game and play for one of the best teachers the game has ever known was not enough, Larry has Strickland to land the straw; Larry will stir the drink.

    Calipari might well be toast. Also, everything points to the fact that Larry intends to use this new gig to go out on top--to win it all again in his very last gig, one that it seems it was not easy for him to land. Yeap, Larry wants him another championship and then ride off into the sunset. I think everybody ought to sit up and take notice of this one.
    Last edited by Newton_14; 04-21-2012 at 06:24 AM.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    Calipari is talented at coaching talent, in particular at helping the-best of the best one and doners prepare for the pros and win big during their year of apprenticeship. The key, in my opinion, to his consistent success at recruiting these budding stars has been getting the top-rate point (who wouldn't want to play with a star point in a pro style game? And, I have to believe that the key to Calipari's considtent success in landing that point year in and year out has been Strickland.

    Strickland has left, and he is now with a coach, a developer of talent who can run circles around Cal. The combination of Strickland's ability to mentor a star quality point, to model and teach the dazzling parts of the game, has to have been Calipari's best selling point. Why else did he have Stricland around. If the opportunity to learn the game and play for one of the best teachers the game has ever known was not enough, Larry has Strickland to land the straw; Larry will stir the drink.

    Calipari might well be toast. Also, everything points to the fact that Larry intends to use this new gig to go out on top--to win it all again in his very last gig, one that it seems it was not easy for him to land. Yeap, Larry wants him another championship and then ride off into the sunset. I think everybody ought to sit up and take notice of this one.
    At SMU? Very intriguing. Things are about to get interesting in Texas.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    Calipari is talented at coaching talent, in particular at helping the-best of the best one and doners prepare for the pros and win big during their year of apprenticeship. The key, in my opinion, to his consistent success at recruiting these budding stars has been getting the top-rate point (who wouldn't want to play with a star point in a pro style game? And, I have to believe that the key to Calipari's considtent success in landing that point year in and year out has been Strickland.

    Strickland has left, and he is now with a coach, a developer of talent who can run circles around Cal. The combination of Strickland's ability to mentor a star quality point, to model and teach the dazzling parts of the game, has to have been Calipari's best selling point. Why else did he have Stricland around. If the opportunity to learn the game and play for one of the best teachers the game has ever known was not enough, Larry has Strickland to land the straw; Larry will stir the drink.

    Calipari might well be toast. Also, everything points to the fact that Larry intends to use this new gig to go out on top--to win it all again in his very last gig, one that it seems it was not easy for him to land. Yeap, Larry wants him another championship and then ride off into the sunset. I think everybody ought to sit up and take notice of this one.
    Brown may "intend" to go out on top, but his chances of doing so at a backwater like SMU, with zero basketball history and tradition and lots of other obstacles, is essentially zero.

    Strickland was instrumental in the recruiting successes at Kentucky, but assistant Orlando Antigua has been HUGE as a recruiting force for Calipari. Whenever the kids talk about the connection they have at Kentucky, they're always talking about "Coach O."

    Calipari, with another big class coming in, and now with a championship under his belt, is far from toast. He has the most successful on-the-court program in the nation going right now. By far. And it's the destination of choice for a very large percentage of the top high school players in the land.

  4. #4
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    Larry Brown? The punk who took a cheap shot at Art Heyman and set off a court riot?

    I hope he gets the same treatment Doh! got with the Smustangs.

    Feh.




    (Not that I hold a grudge or anything)
    Twerp-free since July 1, 2014.

  5. #5
    Brown is the basketball genius who kept LeBron and Carmelo on the bench all the way to a flameout in the Olympics. He really doesn't like to play rookies. That doesn't jibe with the Calipari model at all.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turtleboy View Post
    Brown is the basketball genius who kept LeBron and Carmelo on the bench all the way to a flameout in the Olympics. He really doesn't like to play rookies. That doesn't jibe with the Calipari model at all.
    Neither of the guys you mentioned has yet to distinguish himself as a team player; Larry coaches a team game; and he was thrown under the bus by two, or was it three, key players from his Detroit Championship team who "needed to rest" rather then play for their country even while smoke was still rising in lower Manhattan. Had Chauncy, Hamilton, and I think also Big Ben been on that team, Larry would have had a chance of building some cohession, of getting his message across to the rest of players about how he wanted them to play. Besides, you're forgetting for a second how much pressure those guys were under, pressure had nothing whatever to do with the fact that it was the Olympics.

    As for playing freshman, I'm not a betting man, but you name it, you're covered. No other reason, as in none, for Larry to have hired Ro. Also, Larry, 71, obviously needs to get it done, if at all, in a couple or three years, and has gone so far as insisting on SMU's commitment to giving the head job to Larry's hand-picked successor whom SMU is paying an ungodly sum, just so Larry don't get slammed as he normally does for leaving a team too early (Larry still gets a wrap for his penchant for leaving teams early, even though now nothing is too early). Finally, this is a new era, everybody goes after obvious one-and-doners, even K right? If even K does it, Larry won't? Yeah right.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    Neither of the guys you mentioned has yet to distinguish himself as a team player; Larry coaches a team game; and he was thrown under the bus by two, or was it three, key players from his Detroit Championship team who "needed to rest" rather then play for their country even while smoke was still rising in lower Manhattan.
    Well, for the sake of the argument, let's assume you are right. I suppose one plan could be to bench those guys until they figure out how to be team players. Some coaches might coach them how to be team players. I've actually seen it done. With Olympians, no less.
    Besides, you're forgetting for a second how much pressure those guys were under, pressure had nothing whatever to do with the fact that it was the Olympics.
    You're probably better off restricting your comments to subjects you are more familiar with. You have absolutely no idea what I do or do not remember.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldPhiKap View Post
    Larry Brown? The punk who took a cheap shot at Art Heyman and set off a court riot?

    I hope he gets the same treatment Doh! got with the Smustangs.

    Feh.




    (Not that I hold a grudge or anything)
    Larry took the cheap shot? You're kidding right? Duke was up by about 30 (I think it was actually more) in the final 5 seconds of the game, Larry came from the right side along the baseline to the other side of the rim, Heyman came all the way down the lane at speed and horse collared Larry with two arms--Larry didn't get an inch off the ground and didn't get the ball up to the basket. Why'd Heyman do it? It was Larry, that's why.[/BA] The two had been going at it since high school, and not only was Artie twice Larry's size, but also he played mean--everything I've ever heard or read about the guy attests to it. Artie did get suspended from playing in the ACC tournament because of that gratuitous shot he took at Larry that started the whole thing, didn't he. Facts, facts are a killer, ain't they.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    Larry took the cheap shot? You're kidding right? Duke was up by about 30 (I think it was actually more) in the final 5 seconds of the game, Larry came from the right side along the baseline to the other side of the rim, Heyman came all the way down the lane at speed and horse collared Larry with two arms--Larry didn't get an inch off the ground and didn't get the ball up to the basket. Why'd Heyman do it? It was Larry, that's why.[/BA] The two had been going at it since high school, and not only was Artie twice Larry's size, but also he played mean--everything I've ever heard or read about the guy attests to it. Artie did get suspended from playing in the ACC tournament because of that gratuitous shot he took at Larry that started the whole thing, didn't he. Facts, facts are a killer, ain't they.
    I'll stick with my version:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0RroAH4vwU
    Twerp-free since July 1, 2014.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by OldPhiKap View Post
    I'll stick with my version:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0RroAH4vwU
    Wow, I'd say that pretty definitively shows:

    1. Heyman grabbing Brown (committing a hard foul)
    2. Brown chucking the ball at Heyman
    3. Brown throwing the first punch
    4. Heyman retaliating

    Gotta say this is pretty convincing evidence that greybeard's recounting of the story is wrong and yours is right.

    As for Brown as a coach, he has a pretty long track record of burning out with teams, wearing thin on the players and management, and thus leaving before his contract runs out. His approach and personality are grueling and eventually it's best for everyone to move on. That doesn't make him a bad guy or a bad coach (on the contrary, he's a FANTASTIC coach). But after so many similar occurrences you have to start to think that he's at the root of the situation and not some innocent victim. It can only realistically be someone else's fault so many times.

    As for Brown's chances of unseating Calipari as the top-dog in the one-and-done era, I think the only near-term threat to Calipari is him leaving on his own accord. Kentucky has way more resources, way more basketball history, and way more recent cache than SMU. Maybe if Brown chose to stick around for many years he could build a program to bump Calipari (though probably not at SMU). But given Brown's age and history of short-term stays, I don't see any way he really threatens Calipari. And I'm sure Strickland was a great recruiting aid to Calipari in getting going at Memphis. But at this point, the machine is rolling at Kentucky. Calipari has established his brand as the place to be if you're a one-and-done looking to be an NBA lottery pick. It'll take more than a year or two to change that. And I think it'd take SMU a year or two to gain cred before they could even begin to chip away at Calipari. So we're talking 3-4 years (at a minimum, in the best case scenario) for Brown/Strickland to seriously cut into Calipari's stature. And frankly I am not sure Brown has 3-4 years of coaching left.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    Wow, I'd say that pretty definitively shows:

    1. Heyman grabbing Brown (committing a hard foul)
    2. Brown chucking the ball at Heyman
    3. Brown throwing the first punch
    4. Heyman retaliating

    Gotta say this is pretty convincing evidence that greybeard's recounting of the story is wrong and yours is right.
    Youtube don't lie! I guess a videotape is more relieable than the (possibly) selective memory of a participant of an event far in the past.
    Plus, it all happened very fast, according to the tape.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    Larry took the cheap shot? You're kidding right? Duke was up by about 30 (I think it was actually more) in the final 5 seconds of the game, Larry came from the right side along the baseline to the other side of the rim, Heyman came all the way down the lane at speed and horse collared Larry with two arms--Larry didn't get an inch off the ground and didn't get the ball up to the basket. Why'd Heyman do it? It was Larry, that's why.[/BA] The two had been going at it since high school, and not only was Artie twice Larry's size, but also he played mean--everything I've ever heard or read about the guy attests to it. Artie did get suspended from playing in the ACC tournament because of that gratuitous shot he took at Larry that started the whole thing, didn't he. Facts, facts are a killer, ain't they.
    First: Up by 5, not 30; just a minor difference. Second: Your description of the Heyman foul deviates dramatically from the video and the unbiased versions describing the event. Third: Heyman was officially suspended for going after UNC reserve Donnie Walsh during the melee. After reviewing the film, league officials acknowledged that Brown threw the first punch and he was suspended too. Fourth: Larry was and remains a narcissist and a truly loathsome person.

    One similarity between Calipari and Brown is they leave college programs on probation and disarray.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by 77devil View Post
    First: Up by 5, not 30; just a minor difference. Second: Your description of the Heyman foul deviates dramatically from the video and the unbiased versions describing the event. Third: Heyman was officially suspended for going after UNC reserve Donnie Walsh during the melee. After reviewing the film, league officials acknowledged that Brown threw the first punch and he was suspended too. Fourth: Larry was and remains a narcissist and a truly loathsome person.

    One similarity between Calipari and Brown is they leave college programs on probation and disarray.
    To offer madd to the perspective on Artie, several of Frank McGuire's pupils went after Artie from the time they first played in the freshman college games right on through however long they remained in college. While it's true that Artie played tough and at times didn't keep his emotions under control, I wonder how many people would have handled being spit upon repeatedly in a college career or hit hard enough in a freshman game to be taken to the local hospital. Most of these antics took place out of the view of the officials and went unseen and unpunished.

    Lest anyone think the dust up over Harrison Barnes going to Chapel Hill is a significant example of ill will generated while rivals recruited the same player, the ill will generated by Artie going to Duke after he first said he was going to Carolina generated volcanic overtones that ran through the Duke - Carolina rivalry in multiple encounters in both football and basketball and lasted for years.

  14. #14
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    With respect to Cal v LB, we know that neither will have a salary cap, neither will have much interference from "academia," and neither will have much if anything in the way of restrictions. Both will be able to accurately portray the experience to recruits as "as close to the NBA as you can get until you are drafted."

    My question is: which has the higher recruiting "budget?"

  15. #15
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    LB cleaning house

    Unlike calismarmy, when LB cleans house, he offers the ousted players a chance to finish their degrees on academic scholarship

    http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_r...rc&eref=fromSI

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 77devil View Post
    First: Up by 5, not 30; just a minor difference. Second: Your description of the Heyman foul deviates dramatically from the video and the unbiased versions describing the event. Third: Heyman was officially suspended for going after UNC reserve Donnie Walsh during the melee. After reviewing the film, league officials acknowledged that Brown threw the first punch and he was suspended too. Fourth: Larry was and remains a narcissist and a truly loathsome person.

    One similarity between Calipari and Brown is they leave college programs on probation and disarray.
    This is what Artie hisownself had to say about the incident:

    With about seven seconds to go, he drove for the basket and I fouled him hard. He threw the ball at me and started swinging, and I cold-cocked him. I also hit Donnie Walsh [current president of the Indiana Pacers]. All three of us were suspended. It cost Duke the national championship because we had the best team in the country.

    You sure about this incident, 77devel, Sure?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by 77devil View Post
    First: Up by 5, not 30; just a minor difference. Second: Your description of the Heyman foul deviates dramatically from the video and the unbiased versions describing the event. Third: Heyman was officially suspended for going after UNC reserve Donnie Walsh during the melee. After reviewing the film, league officials acknowledged that Brown threw the first punch and he was suspended too. Fourth: Larry was and remains a narcissist and a truly loathsome person.
    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    This is what Artie hisownself had to say about the incident:

    With about seven seconds to go, he drove for the basket and I fouled him hard. He threw the ball at me and started swinging, and I cold-cocked him. I also hit Donnie Walsh [current president of the Indiana Pacers]. All three of us were suspended. It cost Duke the national championship because we had the best team in the country.

    You sure about this incident, 77devel, Sure?
    I'm confused. Doesn't the Heyman quote exactly back up what 77devil said? Heyman fouled hard, Brown threw the first punch, Heyman took him out, Walsh waded in, everyone gets suspended, Brown remains loathsome. These versions are in alignment.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Des Esseintes View Post
    I'm confused. Doesn't the Heyman quote exactly back up what 77devil said? Heyman fouled hard, Brown threw the first punch, Heyman took him out, Walsh waded in, everyone gets suspended, Brown remains loathsome. These versions are in alignment.
    We're done.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    Larry took the cheap shot? You're kidding right?
    Heyman's foul looks relatively tame in the video- perhaps hard, but certainly not how you describe it.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldPhiKap View Post
    Larry Brown? The punk who took a cheap shot at Art Heyman and set off a court riot?

    I hope he gets the same treatment Doh! got with the Smustangs.

    Feh.




    (Not that I hold a grudge or anything)
    See the Quote from Heyman himself about the incident. Seems Artie flat out has it different. It's okay to hold a grudge. With regard to Heman, next to Barry Krammer, he was my favorite college player. Guess.

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