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  1. #181
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by 75Crazie View Post
    I'm thinking back to my thoughts at the beginning of the season. I was horribly dreading this year, seeing Carolina as head-and-shoulders above everybody else. And now, looking back, I see Duke split in two games with them, they didn't win the ACC Tournament, and they didn't even make the Final Four. The heck with the Lehigh game, this was quite a good year!
    Maybe I just don't get it. Duke a number 2 seed loses to a number 15 seed, which was a major embarassment, while Carolina makes the elite 8 and loses to a number 2 seed with arguably their key player out and you say it was ," quite a good year", for Duke basketball. I would have traded seasons with Carolina in a heartbeat.

  2. #182
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by gofurman View Post
    Roy is still a great recruiter



    I would disagree there is "no such thing as a great recruiter". Ex: See 'Calipari, John' - ethics? dont know on that front and have my doubts but I know the guy can recruit - and dont say UK recruited the same under Gillespie or Tubby Smith (who I respected more)... they didnt. Only Calipari right now can cherry-pick the 3 or 4 guys he wants each year. I fear seeing UK the most on the list of schools any guy we want is interested in. You almost know they can win the title this year and - more than any other school - totally reload with nasty talent... more than UNC, Duke, KU.. anywhere
    Totally agree with you. You are right on target.

  3. #183
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    boston, ma
    Quote Originally Posted by NYC Duke Fan View Post
    Maybe I just don't get it. Duke a number 2 seed loses to a number 15 seed, which was a major embarassment, while Carolina makes the elite 8 and loses to a number 2 seed with arguably their key player out and you say it was ," quite a good year", for Duke basketball. I would have traded seasons with Carolina in a heartbeat.
    Being pleased with our year as a Duke fan and acknowledging UNC had a better year are not mutually exclusive.

    Although losing to Lehigh IS historically embarrassing.

  4. #184
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by FerryFor50 View Post
    I celebrated by eating a Tar Heel burger at a local eatery and then eating a Tar Heel mint afterwards.
    I can't even imagine what a UNC fan ate after we lost to Lehigh.

  5. #185
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by duke09hms View Post
    Being pleased with our year as a Duke fan and acknowledging UNC had a better year are not mutually exclusive.

    Although losing to Lehigh IS historically embarrassing.
    I respect your opinion but I am not pleased with our year, sorry to disagree. Losing to a 15 seed does not make for a pleasant season. I admire the job that Coach K did this year but in my mind we had a disapponting season.

  6. #186
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    While he certainly overplays it, do you not find it astounding that roy failed to realize they switched defenses for the entire last 8 minutes of the game? that he failed to make an offensive adjustment while his team was busy scoring 3 points in 8 minutes because he failed to notice the change?

    that's about as close to the definition of "outcoached" as you can get
    If you listened to Roy's post- game press conference, he thought KU only ran the triangle and two for a couple possessions, which admittedly doesn't reflect well on him sine KU ran it 8 minutes. This loss is shaping up to be perfect for Duke fans. The goats are Barnes and Roy, the two you love to hate the most.

    However, even had he recognized it, what were Roy's options? As I understand it, what KU was really doing little more than laying off White/ Watts completely, packing the middle with a zone and then sending both guards after our perimeter shooters. Call the D what you want, it basically was a decision to play five on four. Roy could have removed White and gone with Bullock, Hairston, and Barnes to punish the D from the outside, but none of them could hit the broad side of a barn. Barnes got into the lane a few times but missed from close range. We shot poorly- that's the bottom line. Of course KU's D had something to do with that, but it has been a problem that plagued us before we saw the triangle and two.

  7. #187
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoHeel View Post
    If you listened to Roy's post- game press conference, he thought KU only ran the triangle and two for a couple possessions, which admittedly doesn't reflect well on him sine KU ran it 8 minutes. This loss is shaping up to be perfect for Duke fans. The goats are Barnes and Roy, the two you love to hate the most.

    However, even had he recognized it, what were Roy's options? As I understand it, what KU was really doing little more than laying off White/ Watts completely, packing the middle with a zone and then sending both guards after our perimeter shooters. Call the D what you want, it basically was a decision to play five on four. Roy could have removed White and gone with Bullock, Hairston, and Barnes to punish the D from the outside, but none of them could hit the broad side of a barn. Barnes got into the lane a few times but missed from close range. We shot poorly- that's the bottom line. Of course KU's D had something to do with that, but it has been a problem that plagued us before we saw the triangle and two.
    It's not about whether he would have had options or not...even if he DID have something in his toolbox, he couldn't have used it anyway since he failed to realize the switch.

    It sucks to lose, and I don't mean to harp on you CH, we just got beaten by lehigh for goodness sakes. You guys got hit with an unfortunate injury that probably kept you from a final four, if not a championship....maybe roy isn't good at coaching on the floor, but he makes up with it in other areas...recruiting for a big one. Maybe harrison barnes isn't the savior that he makes himself out to be, but he is what he is...and the team figured out how to have massive success with him down the stretch.

    In the end it was lack of depth at the PG more than anything that cost them the game...MUCH more so than roy or harrison
    1200. DDMF.

  8. #188
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Quote Originally Posted by Wheat/"/"/" View Post
    I'd like to see the play again at about the 4 minute mark where Henson was driving from top of the key and was blocked, resulting in a fast break basket to take KS up 6, I think. I thought he was fouled, but they never showed the play again, so I'm not sure?

    Not whinning about a missed call, if it was, but it was a key play in the game that gave KS separation and started the mental pressing by UNC.
    Even if Henson was fouled, perhaps you should view that (no)-call as a makeup call for the foul called on Withey on a Barnes drive only moments earlier in the game, where the announcer said "Bill Self is livid about that call, and I don't blame him-- Withey was there, and it looked like a charge on Barnes to me."

    Also, many times, Henson succeeds in looking like he is fouled, whether he is or not, because of his lack of strength, and his ungainly, Plastic-Man way of putting his body into awkward positions (from which he falls down with regularity, because he is often off-balance when he attempts shots and gets blocked).

  9. #189
    Quote Originally Posted by NYC Duke Fan View Post
    Maybe I just don't get it. Duke a number 2 seed loses to a number 15 seed, which was a major embarassment, while Carolina makes the elite 8 and loses to a number 2 seed with arguably their key player out and you say it was ," quite a good year", for Duke basketball. I would have traded seasons with Carolina in a heartbeat.
    Both teams had comparable regular seasons that were very good by most standards. But Duke and UNC are teams that measure their post season success by championships- not where they finish in a one and done tourney. UNC and Duke failed to achieve their goals for the season. Losing in the final 8 or round of 32 are both bad. Neither team was able to beat a ranked opponent in this or the ACC tourney. Both teams will lick their wounds and come back next season.

  10. #190
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Boca Grande Florida
    Quote Originally Posted by NYC Duke Fan View Post
    I can't even imagine what a UNC fan ate after we lost to Lehigh.
    Weber steak.

  11. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoHeel View Post
    If you listened to Roy's post- game press conference, he thought KU only ran the triangle and two for a couple possessions, which admittedly doesn't reflect well on him sine KU ran it 8 minutes. This loss is shaping up to be perfect for Duke fans. The goats are Barnes and Roy, the two you love to hate the most.

    However, even had he recognized it, what were Roy's options? As I understand it, what KU was really doing little more than laying off White/ Watts completely, packing the middle with a zone and then sending both guards after our perimeter shooters. Call the D what you want, it basically was a decision to play five on four. Roy could have removed White and gone with Bullock, Hairston, and Barnes to punish the D from the outside, but none of them could hit the broad side of a barn. Barnes got into the lane a few times but missed from close range. We shot poorly- that's the bottom line. Of course KU's D had something to do with that, but it has been a problem that plagued us before we saw the triangle and two.
    Can you really be surprised that Roy didn't recognize the defense being played against his team? Remember, this is the guy who also said he had no idea that he had left his walk-ons on the court at FSU.

    I will never be convinced that Roy is even an average game manager. He is a winning coach and a very sucessful coach, but I really do think that he gets caught up in the emotion of the game and goes into brain freeze A LOT.

    Anyway, UNC had a very good yet disappointing season. The injury gods were unkind and it caught up with them. I sort of hate it for Zeller and Marshall, two UNC players I can really like.

    Barnes had his shot at stepping up to be the man and he didn't. Not sure what this says about his legacy or future, but bottom line is that he seems to have peaked when he wore the banana suit at Late Night with Roy... well maybe not exactly, but the point is that he really hasn't gotten much better in his two years at UNC IMO.

    I wonder if there will be buzz about how Roy cannot develop wing players?

  12. #192
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Boca Grande Florida
    Quote Originally Posted by Mudge View Post
    Even if Henson was fouled, perhaps you should view that (no)-call as a makeup call for the foul called on Withey on a Barnes drive only moments earlier in the game, where the announcer said "Bill Self is livid about that call, and I don't blame him-- Withey was there, and it looked like a charge on Barnes to me."

    Also, many times, Henson succeeds in looking like he is fouled, whether he is or not, because of his lack of strength, and his ungainly, Plastic-Man way of putting his body into awkward positions (from which he falls down with regularity, because he is often off-balance when he attempts shots and gets blocked).
    I finally saw the replay and thought it could have easily been called a foul. The defender was verticle, but he was definitely moving forward into Henson and initiated the contact.
    It wasn't a bad call, and didn't cause UNC to lose, just one of those bang, bang sort of plays that could have gone either way.

    It was a tough break for UNC at that time, down 4 with a chance to cut it to 2. Instead, KS gets a fast break basket, goes up 6, and gets the crowd into it.

    I thought it was the key play that broke open the game for KS, and CBS never showed a replay.

  13. #193
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    I'm happy the heels are finally done, and that out of both schools we are the ones left with a team playing basketball. (On to Denver, ladies!)
    That being said, I was really impressed with Kendall Marshall's attitude last night, so I'm giving him props. At times he was up doing as much coaching as Roy, and giving every ounce of support he could in the only role he could fill...cheerleader. It reminded me very much of Kyrie from the bench last year, and in a way punctuated for me what was missing from our own team this year.
    Q "Why do you like Duke, you didn't even go there." A "Because my art school didn't have a basketball team."

  14. #194
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh
    Quote Originally Posted by moonpie23 View Post
    how do you like my new avatar?
    Is that a pigeon under that towel ?
    [redacted] them and the horses they rode in on.

  15. #195
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    raleigh
    roy doesn't pay attention to the other team's defense....he runs his offense come hell or high water and the team on the floor has ONE instruction... RUN!

    why should he be bothered about what the OTHER team does...?
    "One POSSIBLE future. From your point of view... I don't know tech stuff.".... Kyle Reese

  16. #196
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Wheat/"/"/" View Post
    I finally saw the replay and thought it could have easily been called a foul. The defender was verticle, but he was definitely moving forward into Henson and initiated the contact.
    It wasn't a bad call, and didn't cause UNC to lose, just one of those bang, bang sort of plays that could have gone either way.

    It was a tough break for UNC at that time, down 4 with a chance to cut it to 2. Instead, KS gets a fast break basket, goes up 6, and gets the crowd into it.

    I thought it was the key play that broke open the game for KS, and CBS never showed a replay.
    I think you're seeing that through Carolina blue lenses. Henson jumped into Withey much more than the other way around (if Withey was going forward at all). Henson initiated the contact. That's a no call as much as any no call can be on a contact play.

  17. #197
    Quote Originally Posted by Wheat/"/"/" View Post
    No question UNC lost their composure and deserved to lose.

    Maybe somebody can YouTube it?
    Can't YOU Youtube it? Or doesn't your new Ipad do such fancy stuff??

  18. #198
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    The injuries were really bad luck for the Heels, even going back to the loss of Leslie McDonald from the roster.

    The other fatal flaw IMO was their lack of good 3-point shooting.
    Very hard to win a series of tough games at tournament time without legitimate weapons from the perimeter.

  19. #199
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    The injuries were really bad luck for the Heels, even going back to the loss of Leslie McDonald from the roster.

    The other fatal flaw IMO was their lack of good 3-point shooting.
    Very hard to win a series of tough games at tournament time without legitimate weapons from the perimeter.
    That and a lack of competent ballhandlers outside of their PG. They ran their entire offense through the PG, and when that PG (and his backup) went down they simply had no answer for how to consistently generate offense. When Kansas finally settled down defensively (albeit 25 or so minutes into the game) they shut down UNC's offense entirely.

    Kansas was the better team on the court last night. That wouldn't have been the case with a healthy Marshall. But that's life.

  20. #200
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    The injuries were really bad luck for the Heels, even going back to the loss of Leslie McDonald from the roster.

    The other fatal flaw IMO was their lack of good 3-point shooting.
    Very hard to win a series of tough games at tournament time without legitimate weapons from the perimeter.

    Great point. As a Carolina fan still pondering the "what ifs", it totally hit me this morning how important McDonald, even if only as a sixth man off the bench could have been to this team. We all forget that by the time he got hurt, he was arguably the best three point shooter on the team, particularly in transition, and overall was evolving into a Danny Green type roll in terms of being instant offense off the bench. The ability to hit at least a few three's consistently would have been a huge difference. I mean, they didnt hit a single one in the second half. There were many games this year where Carolina failed to hit more than 2 or 3. Last night, one or two well placed three's in the second half could have made all the difference in the world. He will be a very important returning player for Carolina next year.

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