Kendall Marshall Wrist Watch

[MChambers]

Are you comparing him to other sophomores or lumping him in with everyone?? I mean, he probably will not play four years at UNC but he is only a sophomore, has already set the assist record and just recently started to look for his shot and has increased his scoring by a good margin.
IF he were to play another year of college ball where do/how do you think he stacks up as he matures and progresses??

I have no idea, because I don't know how much he'll improve. Some players peak early; others keep improving. Maybe he becomes a better outside shooter. That would mean a lot. I don't ever see him being particularly good on defense, however.

[freedevil]

That is true. Barnes will likely want to be the hero. He has hit big shots before. To be honest- I still see UNC advancing. Not sure what will happen in the FF but they should win next week with the players available.

Agree with this, particularly in the sweet 16 game. The interesting thing to me is whether the first game will allow UNC some meaningful time to prepare and gel for a potential elite 8 game. If this injury were to have happened in the first game of a weekend (i.e., in between match ups), I would say there is no way they could recover for the follow-up game. But having practice time plus a game against a lower-ranked seed may prove beneficial for the Heels given the cirmcumstances.

[ncexnyc]

Agree with this, particularly in the sweet 16 game. The interesting thing to me is whether the first game will allow UNC some meaningful time to prepare and gel for a potential elite 8 game. If this injury were to have happened in the first game of a weekend (i.e., in between match ups), I would say there is no way they could recover for the follow-up game. But having practice time plus a game against a lower-ranked seed may prove beneficial for the Heels given the cirmcumstances.

Yes, I see how well that prep time worked for us.

[FerryFor50]

Has anyone seen this insanity?

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[WakeDevil]

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/uncnow...-injury-a-hoax

An email to a reporter.

Mr. Carter:

Did you actually see a doctor cut the wrist??? How many times has UNC played this card during the years??? You and I know there is no doubt Marshall will play this weekend. Roy knew that NC State was in the NCAA Tournament for the first time since the Titanic sunk, and lo and behold, the Pack was in the sweet 16. Roy knew the media would be all over the Wolfpack and he was not going to let that happen. We all know it is only about the Heels. So excuse me if do not believe the story...How is Barnes ankle??? Roy cried all year about that and he was 1st team ACC. I think the league should start fining the Heels for these false reports.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Can't let this go. Marshall is one of the best passers to play point in the ACC, but isn't remotely close to being one of the top 10 point guards in ACC history.

I think most coaches would have a tough time naming 9 PG's ahead of him to start a team, myself, but it's a subjective argument and you might be right at this point, still a soph.

What can't be argued is he's a team leader, and now the all time season assist leader, which is pretty much the gold standard PG's are judged by. And this is on a team that really can't shoot straight. His total could have been ridiculous with a full season

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Has anyone seen this insanity?

540978_10151421819415226_500060225_23549260_170714876_n.jpg

I had not, but I like it. Thanks for sharing.

[mgtr]

If Marshall is truly unavailable (which I will believe when the teams come out to start the game) maybe the Heels can get Drew II back from UCLA. They were pretty good with him. Oh, no, I have it backwards -- they were pretty terrible with him. So, is X, fill in whomever you chooses, better than Drew II? Probably not. Therefore, Marshall will play.

[Kedsy]

BUT, I don't think most people are giving White a chance. It's been said here many times that "he is no Marshall" and he isn't but he's not exactly chopped liver either.

Well, he's a freshman, he's pretty small, and he wasn't even a top 100 recruit. He's scored 23 career points on 23.8% shooting (20.0% from three) and 50% from the free throw line. He has 19 career assists. His per 40 numbers are a little worse than Andre Buckner's 2001-02 season, across the board. Essentially, he is exactly chopped liver.

In fact, I think Andre Buckner might be a good comparison. Imagine Jason Williams getting hurt in 2002 and Andre Buckner replacing him as our starting PG. That's more or less what UNC would be dealing with.

[ncexnyc]

Well, he's a freshman, he's pretty small, and he wasn't even a top 100 recruit. He's scored 23 career points on 23.8% shooting (20.0% from three) and 50% from the free throw line. He has 19 career assists. His per 40 numbers are a little worse than Andre Buckner's 2001-02 season, across the board. Essentially, he is exactly chopped liver.

In fact, I think Andre Buckner might be a good comparison. Imagine Jason Williams getting hurt in 2002 and Andre Buckner replacing him as our starting PG. That's more or less what UNC would be dealing with.

At this time last week a number of us had faith in Ryan's replacement and that somehow we'd be able to overcome his absence.

Nothing wrong with heel fans showing the same belief in the duo of Watts and White. Hopefully the results are the same.

Should Marshall actually get on the court it would be a huge lift for the heels, like Willis Reed for the Knicks, but if you recall Reed didn't play very much in that game. I'm not sure I'd waste that emotional boost against Ohio, but I would definitely consider it against Kansas or State.

[gumbomoop]

The scaphoid is the worst bone in the wrist to injure. The blood supply to the scaphoid is provided by a single vessel, and therefore is easily compromised... In other words, if KM were not a basketball player but some other college kid who broke his scaphoid playing ultimate frisbee on the quad, he would be placed in a thumb-spica cast that completely immobilizes the fracture site. He would be told not to play intramural basketball. He would be told not to play any sports at all for at least six weeks.

Long-term outcomes from improperly treated scaphoid fractures are not good... It is distressingly easy to end up with avascular necrosis of the scaphoid, which can leave a person with a life-long problem.

They may well trot KM out for another game before this is all said and done, but it's the wrong thing to do.

And I agree...we would not be having this discussion if he weren't a pro-like athlete.

... if he were to somehow do this effectively and become some sort of folk hero, I would be happy for him. He's a good kid. If he were my kid, though, I would not let him play, period.

Marshall's injury raises, for me, all sorts of complicated issues. I'm not confident that my response would be exactly the same if this involved a fine PG on a Duke team with a real shot at a NC. I hope it would be, but I'm not sure. I suppose one could go back through the Kyrie-vigil thread to see whether Duke posters are being consistent, but I don't have the time.

I've highlighted in these tag quotes what appear to me to be expert opinions, or at least as expert as possible given that the exact details of the injury are unknown. These 3 appear as expert on their own merits. But, by coincidence, just yesterday I had an unexpected opportunity to chat with a physician - one who has no connection with Duke or UNC - who has some experience in diagnosing and treating this injury. Everything he said matches the views of our 3 experts.

In short, it seems clear that if Kendall plays anytime in the tourney, he is risking not only his pro bball prospects, but the full use of his right hand for the rest of his life. Read that sentence again.

One might - and I'm willing to concede that if this were Duke situation, I might - claim that it's not necessarily a major risk, and the potential reward here - "emotionally," for lack of a better word - is overpowering. Then the debate might center around just how much danger is Marshall actually courting by playing. One who wants him to play, who wants UNC to win the NC, might say "Let's don't overreact. Yes, there's a long-shot he could do permanent damage, but that probably won't happen, and if he and his family are all right with it, you just can't deprive him and his teammates of this incredible moment, this chance to achieve a great dream."

Our experts disagree, straightforwardly and firmly. Very firmly: "It's ... wrong ... period." Are our experts unbiased, as, presumably, Duke fans? My physician-friend has no dog in this fight, and he says exactly what they say: "It's nuts for anyone to advise or allow Marshall to play."

Which brings us to Roy...

More importantly, when a college coach sends a student-athlete who IS NOT GETTING PAID out on the floor with a broken wrist, he better freakin not ever cry again on TV because "he is so sad for the kids." Hypocrisy by any other name stinks.

.... who's in a tough spot. Marshall undoubtedly wants desperately to play. His teammates, surely, would say, "If the doctors say it's ok for Kendall to play, we need him." Roy's not a doctor. He can only listen to their expert opinion. Now, is he seeking several opinions? Is that his absolute responsibility? For pretty clearly, were he to seek 2d and 3d opinions - outside the UNC physician-family - he'd hear some "Absolutely not, are you nuts?" warnings such as my acquaintance stated and as our experts, less colloquially but with specificity, caution.

Surely those physicians who advise Roy cannot be claiming there is no risk. Equally surely - yes? - it is their professional/ethical responsibility to explain just how life-changing would be further damage during this healing period.

So the ball really is pretty much in Roy's court. I'm pretty sure how I would respond if Roy says, "After listening to the doctors, I'm not letting him play anymore this season. Too much big risk."

I'm less certain how I'll respond if Roy says, "I've got to depend on the doctors, and they tell me if Kendall understands the risk, yes, he could play. So, this is awful tough, but it's up to Kendall and his family."

[#1Duke]

Well, he's a freshman, he's pretty small, and he wasn't even a top 100 recruit. He's scored 23 career points on 23.8% shooting (20.0% from three) and 50% from the free throw line. He has 19 career assists. His per 40 numbers are a little worse than Andre Buckner's 2001-02 season, across the board. Essentially, he is exactly chopped liver.

In fact, I think Andre Buckner might be a good comparison. Imagine Jason Williams getting hurt in 2002 and Andre Buckner replacing him as our starting PG. That's more or less what UNC would be dealing with.

White has seen very limited minutes and I myself would not base his "worth" on those limited minutes. In most cases he hardly had time to work up a sweat before being pulled out of the game.
He does not have to score big... UNC is loaded with people that can score. He is known for being able to hang onto the ball and commit limited turnovers and I have said several times that turnovers will be key in judging his performance. Along with the stats you listed you forgot to mention he had 2 turnovers in 70 minutes of play.
I understand where you are coming from but we won't see what he can do until he plays this weekend.
I'm not salivating at the fact that Marshall can't play, I feel sorry for him. I also feel that the Heels are in a bad spot and down to their 3rd or 4th option with McDonald and Strickland out.
I always feel for the underdog ( I'm talking about White) so I am going to give him a chance to show what he can do. Guys like him show up and practice just as hard as the starters and are important to the team.

Just the way I see it. I'm not going to gloat or downgrade a player thrust into a position he had no control over.
In fact, I would MUCH rather see the Heels beat at full strength than beat with injuries.

Sometimes great players or those that are perceived to be great and very talented fold in the heat of competition and underperform....sometimes those considered "chopped liver" rise to the occasion and perform above expectations.
We'll see where Mr. White shakes out very soon.

So, I don't know what bothers fans more. Great/talented players underperforming or untalented uncelebrated players doing just what is expected of them??
What do you think?

[ricks68]

I think most coaches would have a tough time naming 9 PG's ahead of him to start a team, myself, but it's a subjective argument and you might be right at this point, still a soph.

What can't be argued is he's a team leader, and now the all time season assist leader, which is pretty much the gold standard PG's are judged by. And this is on a team that really can't shoot straight. His total could have been ridiculous with a full season

It's really late here in Asheville right now, and I'm a real alter kocker, but even though my brain is in sleep mode coupled with a lot of lost memory cells, I can still name some of our guys in the past that I would take over Marshall in a heartbeat: Vacendak, Hurley, Williams, for example. Multiply just that number by the number of ACC teams and see what total you get. No matter how many assists he has, he ain't in the top ten. I think that the biggest boost to Marshall's numbers are not his skill set, but the skill set of the guys he passes to. His assist numbers are better because his guys are both in the right position to score and can finish. His toughness isn't even close to the 3 Duke players I mentioned, nor is his scoring ability. And how can you forget the other teams in the ACC that have had points like Steve Blake for example. Most coaches wouldn't have any problem naming more than 9 ACC points they would pick over him.

As far as the gold standard being assists, in which point guard's hands would you want to have the ball at the end of a tight game (or for a whole tough NCAA game)---------a guy like Hurley or Williams or Marshall? I think the combination of toughness, the ability to score when the game is on the line, and the ability to get the ball to others in a position to score are what makes for an outstanding point guard, not just the assists. (And I didn't even include the defensive aspect because we all know that Marshall shouldn't even be considerered if that were included in your criteria.)

No, he is definitely a stellar assist man, but I do not consider him among the great point guards in ACC history. I think it is time to ex him from that category.

ricks

[hurleyfor3]

Please, Marshall couldn't hold Hurley's jockstrap.

Wait, not just that. Marshall couldn't have held a 10-pack of BVDs and a roll of Scottissue for Hurley during the 1990 national semifinal.

[ricks68]

Sometimes great players or those that are perceived to be great and very talented fold in the heat of competition and underperform....sometimes those considered "chopped liver" rise to the occasion and perform above expectations.
We'll see where Mr. White shakes out very soon.

Just to be fair, Freddy Lind immediately comes to mind at this time. So, I agree that you never know for sure what someone can do when a certain kind of situation presents itself. Granted, this is different, and has to be sustained for 4 games, but you never really know, do you? But then, on the other hand, I'm willing to give really good odds that this is not going to be a Freddy Lind moment.

ricks

[#1Duke]

Just to be fair, Freddy Lind immediately comes to mind at this time. So, I agree that you never know for sure what someone can do when a certain kind of situation presents itself. Granted, this is different, and has to be sustained for 4 games, but you never really know, do you? But then, on the other hand, I'm willing to give really good odds that this is not going to be a Freddy Lind moment.

ricks

I'm just willing to give White a chance... that's all. He may fall flat on his face. I would say sustained for 2 games and then Marshall is back. Just my worthless opinion.

[davekay1971]

I think most coaches would have a tough time naming 9 PG's ahead of him to start a team, myself, but it's a subjective argument and you might be right at this point, still a soph.

What can't be argued is he's a team leader, and now the all time season assist leader, which is pretty much the gold standard PG's are judged by. And this is on a team that really can't shoot straight. His total could have been ridiculous with a full season

UNC: Kenny Smith, Phil Ford, Ty Lawson, King Rice (just kidding)

Duke: Hurley, J Will, Tommy Amaker, Kyrie Irving (all 11 games of him)

NC State: Sidney Lowe, Chris Corchianni

Ga Tech: Kenny Anderson, Mark Price

That's 11 from just 4 ACC teams off the top of my head without batting an eyelash, and other than Ford I didn't bother to think back before the early 80s.

Marshall is a better passer than some of the guys on that list. Marshall is, without question, an absolutely beautiful passer. But his scoring is moving from inadequate to mediocre, and his defense is a major liability. So, looking at the whole package, im(h)o, he doesn't surpass those 11 guys at this point in his career. If he stays at UNC for the next 2 years, maintains his amazing passing, improves his scoring and defense, he could certainly be one of the top ACC point guards of all time. Right now he's just not enough of the total package to put him in that category.

[weezie]

Chris Paul. A jerk but a pretty good PG.

[oldnavy]

The question is how effective can he be? I am sure they could cast his arm and reduce the risk of him reinjuring it to almost zero. But is that a good thing for UNC?

Even if he does have some use of his right hand, will he be able to use it effectively? He will have to deal with limited mobility AND pain...

And if he does play, you know that he will be forced to use the right hand almost exclusively. Also, will he be as quick to drive into the lane as he has been knowing that he will likely get knocked down and have to brace himself for a fall?

I don't think the question is can he play, but is can he play effectively to where he is not a liability to the team?

[pamtar]

Chris Paul. A jerk but a pretty good PG.

If were talking jerk acc pg's let's not forget Stephan Marbury! Jaw dropping good his one year at GT...