Mason Plumlee Returning to Duke for Senior Season

[Duvall]

The guy is an AAU coach. I think he knows what he's talking about.

He's a high school coach, and based on the Plumlees' basketball skills coming into Duke, not a very good one.

[Big Pappa]

He is not feeding into the stereotype. He's not just repeating mindless drivel. He is saying that he believes that all of Mason's game was not used last year. The guy is an AAU coach. I think he knows what he's talking about.

Because all high school coaches have such gifted basketball minds...

[Double DD]

I remember Gaines posting some updates on one of the other Duke boards during the Plumlees' recruitment. He was always very positive towards Duke and seemed to favor it as a destination for them. If he's changed his mind about that, I'm assuming it's because he legitimately didn't like what he saw about how Mason was used. And I think Christ School's been dominant for the last several years in whatever division they play in, so at least at the high school, he does seem to know what he's doing.

[Class of '94]

I remember Gaines posting some updates on one of the other Duke boards during the Plumlees' recruitment. He was always very positive towards Duke and seemed to favor it as a destination for them. If he's changed his mind about that, I'm assuming it's because he legitimately didn't like what he saw about how Mason was used. And I think Christ School's been dominant for the last several years in whatever division they play in, so at least at the high school, he does seem to know what he's doing.

But again, I would have to ask the question: Is that due to Duke and the coaches or Mason?

I love Mason's potential to be a big-time big man in the ACC next season; and I do think his game suffered a bit by not playing with a pass-first PG this past season. That said, many times Mason was his own worst enemy; and it would've been nice if Gaines had acknowledged that.

[CDu]

But again, I would have to ask the question: Is that due to Duke and the coaches or Mason?

Unfortunately, in terms of playing in to the stereotype and perception about Duke, it doesn't really matter.

But again, I would have to ask the question: Is that due to Duke and the I love Mason's potential to be a big-time big man in the ACC this year; and I do think his game suffered a bit by not playing with a pass-first PG this year. That said, many times Mason was his own worst enemy; and it would've been nice if Gaines had acknowledged that.

I agree. I don't think the coaching staff wanted to turn Mason into a screener. And to be honest, I don't think that's a fair assessment of how Mason was used. Mason's lack of consistency was in part due to his teammates and in part due to his own limitations offensively.

It would have been nice for Gaines to acknowledge it, but he didn't. And by not doing so he has added to the stereotype.

[lotusland]

Because all high school coaches have such gifted basketball minds...

Isn't Christ School a big time prep school for ballers? Do we really want to get in a pissing match with the coach? Anyway it seems like the coaching staff has taken a different approach than deny deny deny so why can't DBR posters acknowledge what the coaches have evidently already acknowledged?

[Big Pappa]

Isn't Christ School a big time prep school for ballers? Do we really want to get in a pissing match with the coach? Anyway it seems like the coaching staff has taken a different approach than deny deny deny so why can't DBR posters acknowledge what the coaches have evidently already acknowledged?

Most people on here are not saying "deny, deny, deny." I am saying that what Gaines said and what K said are opposing and it seems that you and others do not have any problem siding with a high school coach over the greatest coach in the game at any level. It's ridiculous.

[Class of '94]

Isn't Christ School a big time prep school for ballers? Do we really want to get in a pissing match with the coach? Anyway it seems like the coaching staff has taken a different approach than deny deny deny so why can't DBR posters acknowledge what the coaches have evidently already acknowledged?

I don't think any poster is taking the approach of deny, deny; and I'm not saying anyone should deny anything. I'm just stating my wish that the HS coach could've been more complete in his assessment and acknowledge Mason had a bigger role with this year's team than just being a screener, rebounder and shot blocker; and that Mason had a part in why he didn't supposedly be a more complete/total player this past season. I don't think the coaches are acknowledging anything other than their pledge to help him develop in the weaknesses that he has in his game.

But I agree with you that it is not worth it for the coaches to get into a spitting match with a HS coach; but at the same time, his statements have potentially hurt Duke imo by continuing to feed that unfair/undeserved stereotype.

[OldPhiKap]

I frankly doubt anyone outside of our board is paying it much attention.

[AZLA]

I'm thrilled with Mason's return. He was trending up in the latter half of the season and I believe he has more upside and potential. This year we saw him comfortably showcase a deft baby hook and I thought his handle in the post improved dramatically. He played strong in both post-season tournaments and I was impressed with how when he hit a free throw slump, he worked hard and dramatically improved his free throw conversions to end the season. I hope that he comes back next fall as "The Man," even if these means being much more vocal and confrontational with the rest of the team (if required). One of the key intangibles that appeared from a distance to be lacking on the hardwood was a consistent and clear-cut floor leader, pulling the huddle together, pushing others, slapping teammates on the back, scolding them for not sprinting to the sideline, pushing back opposing players, confronting bad attitudes etc. This team severely needs a strong floor leader -- and extension of Coach K in the paint. Mason's success next year completely hinges on the guards' ability to feed him the ball. But part of that comes from commanding the floor and demanding it.

[lotusland]

Most people on here are not saying "deny, deny, deny." I am saying that what Gaines said and what K said are opposing and it seems that you and others do not have any problem siding with a high school coach over the greatest coach in the game at any level. It's ridiculous.

I'm not picking sides but I think the cat's out of the bag as far as Duke not using their bigs to the full potential in the second half of the season. The most obvious example is the Lehigh game where Mason dominated the first 5 minutes and we stopped getting him the ball. I don't see how you can watch that game and not wonder why Duke kept shooting threes or driving out of control when Lehigh clearly could not handle Mason's size and athleticism. And yes Mason did set a lot of screens in that game to free jump shooters. I remember a shot of Mr. Plumlee in the stands as time was starting to wind down and thinking that he has to be wondering why Duke was not able to get the ball inside where we had an advantage for most of the game.

Anyway I'm looking forward to our Senior bigs leading the team next year. Hopefully Mason will get the opportunity to shine and make the most of it so the perception can be put to rest.

[Kedsy]

The most obvious example is the Lehigh game where Mason dominated the first 5 minutes and we stopped getting him the ball.

I just went through the Duke/Lehigh box score. I can't tell from the play-by-play whether he got the ball and then passed back out (unless it resulted in an assist, which in that particular game it didn't), so in the next few sentences, when I say he "got the ball" I mean he got it and either shot, turned it over, or got fouled. In the first 5 minutes, Mason got the ball three times and scored on three dunks. It may be worth noting that after the third dunk, we were only winning 8-6. In the next 35 minutes, Mason played 29. In those 29 minutes, he got the ball 11 times, scored 6 baskets, turned the ball over 4 times, and got fouled once (he made 1 of 2 FTs).

So, while 11 "touches" in 29 minutes is fewer than 3 "touches" in 5 minutes, I'm not sure I agree with your assessment of what happened in that game. Also, the fact that he turned it over 4 of 11 times (presumably due to Lehigh's double-teams) may have led to fewer passes inside.

[DukieInBrasil]

I'm not picking sides but I think the cat's out of the bag as far as Duke not using their bigs to the full potential in the second half of the season. The most obvious example is the Lehigh game where Mason dominated the first 5 minutes and we stopped getting him the ball. I don't see how you can watch that game and not wonder why Duke kept shooting threes or driving out of control when Lehigh clearly could not handle Mason's size and athleticism. And yes Mason did set a lot of screens in that game to free jump shooters. I remember a shot of Mr. Plumlee in the stands as time was starting to wind down and thinking that he has to be wondering why Duke was not able to get the ball inside where we had an advantage for most of the game.

It's because we lacked a guard who could make good passes, and simultaneously earn PT from defensive prowess.

[OldPhiKap]

It's because we lacked a guard who could make good passes, and simultaneously earn PT from defensive prowess.

. . . or a PF (Ryan) who could play the perimeter, stopping Lehigh from packing it in on Mason . . . .

[AZLA]

It's because we lacked a guard who could make good passes, and simultaneously earn PT from defensive prowess.

Or could execute the pick n roll effectively

[lotusland]

I just went through the Duke/Lehigh box score. I can't tell from the play-by-play whether he got the ball and then passed back out (unless it resulted in an assist, which in that particular game it didn't), so in the next few sentences, when I say he "got the ball" I mean he got it and either shot, turned it over, or got fouled. In the first 5 minutes, Mason got the ball three times and scored on three dunks. It may be worth noting that after the third dunk, we were only winning 8-6. In the next 35 minutes, Mason played 29. In those 29 minutes, he got the ball 11 times, scored 6 baskets, turned the ball over 4 times, and got fouled once (he made 1 of 2 FTs).

So, while 11 "touches" in 29 minutes is fewer than 3 "touches" in 5 minutes, I'm not sure I agree with your assessment of what happened in that game. Also, the fact that he turned it over 4 of 11 times (presumably due to Lehigh's double-teams) may have led to fewer passes inside.

If your point is that Duke worked the ball inside sufficiently in that game we will have to agree to disagree. I don't think it is debatable so I won't. I'm glad Mason is coming back and I expect an all ACC caliber year from him next year. I also hope and expect that Duke will make Mason and Ryan the focus of the offense to the extent that anyone observing will notice and we won't need to dig up stats to "prove" that Duke isn't just for shooters and guards.

[FellowTraveler]

In the first 5 minutes, Mason got the ball three times and scored on three dunks. It may be worth noting that after the third dunk, we were only winning 8-6.

Slight nitpick: If you win every five minute stretch 8-6, you end up with a 16 point victory. That's a rather more pleasing outcome than what actually happened.

So, while 11 "touches" in 29 minutes is fewer than 3 "touches" in 5 minutes, I'm not sure I agree with your assessment of what happened in that game.

That's a pretty big gap from a rate standpoint: A "touch" every 1.6 minutes in the first 5 minutes, and every 2.6 minutes thereafter. Though, in support of your position, I should note that if memory serves at least one of the early "touches" was on a fast break/runout situation, and therefore more a result of circumstance than anything that indicates a strategic decision to get him the ball.

Also, the fact that he turned it over 4 of 11 times (presumably due to Lehigh's double-teams) may have led to fewer passes inside.

It's been a while, but I did not have the feeling during the game that Mason's turnovers were such a problem that he should stop getting the ball. He was, after all, 9-9 while his teammates were 15-49. Call each turnover a missed shot, and he was 9-13 (69%) while his teammates were 15-57 (26%.) I don't think that justifies fewer passes inside.

I very much thought while watching the game that Duke should have made a more concerted effort to consistently get Mason the ball in position to score. Unfortunately, I also thought, as I did frequently during the season, that doing so would have required a dramatically different overall approach to the offense, so I'm not sure such an adjustment was really plausible at that moment.

[UrinalCake]

Totally the wrong thread for this but I thought Lehigh started playing off of the guards after those three dunks, especially Tyler, and denying the entry pass. Once they did that it was up to the guards to make their open shots or drive to the basket, and they did neither.

[dcar1985]

Totally the wrong thread for this but I thought Lehigh started playing off of the guards after those three dunks, especially Tyler, and denying the entry pass. Once they did that it was up to the guards to make their open shots or drive to the basket, and they did neither.

They ran that high screen in roll to death and Lehigh played it perfectly all night...

[trinity79]

and a "let's refight the Lehigh game" war { }broke out. Having said that, I'm really glad to see Mason return. With the 'Holes in a rebuilding phase (even thought they'll try to spin it otherwise), I think our younger players (Murphy, Gbinije, Sulaimon, & MP3) will have a much easier time getting acclimated to the rigors of the ACC. And I believe at least a couple of these underclassmen will play major roles as the season progresses. I mean, just look what happened with the Kelly injury debacle this past season. Depth is a great thing to have in the college game.