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  1. #661
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    If it's not based on any facts, doesn't that by definition make it a rumor?
    Technically, I think that what kewlswim said was fact: he has a gut feeling that that Mason wants to play with his little brother. While it is a fact that he has this feeling, said feeling is just an unsubstantiated opinion and thus does has little/no correlation with the true probability of Mason actually wanting to stay and play with his brother. It only becomes a rumor if someone then goes and says "I heard that Mason wants to stay and play with his little brother."

  2. #662
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    Technically, I think that what kewlswim said was fact: he has a gut feeling that that Mason wants to play with his little brother. While it is a fact that he has this feeling, said feeling is just an unsubstantiated opinion and thus does has little/no correlation with the true probability of Mason actually wanting to stay and play with his brother. It only becomes a rumor if someone then goes and says "I heard that Mason wants to stay and play with his little brother."
    Thanks, that makes sense.
    usa

  3. #663
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Princeton, NJ
    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    Thanks, that makes sense.
    It does make sense. and yet, when someone says something like "i think someone might transfer out of the program," they get slammed with a barrage of accusations of rumor mongering.

  4. #664
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    Portland, OR
    Quote Originally Posted by freshmanjs View Post
    It does make sense. and yet, when someone says something like "i think someone might transfer out of the program," they get slammed with a barrage of accusations of rumor mongering.
    If you're on an airplane, would there be different reaction to "I think this flight will land a few minutes late" than there would be to "I think someone on this plane is packing a bomb?" Some conjectures require more certainty and evidence than others.

  5. #665
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    Princeton, NJ
    Quote Originally Posted by juise View Post
    If you're on an airplane, would there be different reaction to "I think this flight will land a few minutes late" than there would be to "I think someone on this plane is packing a bomb?" Some conjectures require more certainty and evidence than others.
    there would be a different reaction because people are scared of dying in a terrorist attack. that has nothing to do with a basketball message board.

  6. #666
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    Portland, OR
    Quote Originally Posted by freshmanjs View Post
    there would be a different reaction because people are scared of dying in a terrorist attack. that has nothing to do with a basketball message board.
    Like I said, some conjectures require more certainty and evidence than others. On a basketball message board, unfounded conjectures about players being unhappy are pretty serious. So in terms of a basketball message board, they are treated seriously here.

  7. #667
    Join Date
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    Princeton, NJ
    Quote Originally Posted by juise View Post
    Like I said, some conjectures require more certainty and evidence than others. On a basketball message board, unfounded conjectures about players being unhappy are pretty serious. So in terms of a basketball message board, they are treated seriously here.
    I don't think generic speculation that a team with a lot of scholarship players, some of which haven't played much, and with several recruiting targets, may have a transfer is "pretty serious" at all. however, i don't make the rules on this site and respect that.

    the rumor mongering rules are vague and confusing though, and actually are more defined by topic than whether the post is a "rumor" or not based on any reasonable definition of the term.

  8. #668
    Doc Rivers weighs in:

    http://espn.go.com/boston/nba/story/...entering-draft

    Doc Rivers OK with Austin's choice


    Updated: March 28, 2012, 8:32 PM ET
    Associated Press


    BOSTON -- Boston Celtics coach Doc Rivers says he is OK with his son Austin's decision to go pro after one year at Duke.

    The younger Rivers announced his decision on Monday to hire an agent and enter the NBA draft.

    Doc Rivers said on Wednesday that Austin was recruited as a "one-and-done" player by Duke coach Mike Krzyzewski. Still, Doc Rivers says Austin almost stayed because he liked Coach K so much. (that part kills me in one way as I wish Austin cam back...but is great to hear that he loved playing for coach K. also puts to rest some of the "team chemistry issues" bc if there were large chemistry issues I don't think you would even consider coming back)

    The Celtics coach says he won't pressure general manager Danny Ainge to draft Austin. Doc Rivers says the Celtics have to do what's best for the team.

    Rivers averaged a team-leading 15.5 points and was a unanimous selection as the Atlantic Coast Conference's rookie of the year. He's just the third Duke freshman to lead the team in scoring.

  9. #669
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    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by gofurman View Post
    Doc Rivers said on Wednesday that Austin was recruited as a "one-and-done" player by Duke coach Mike Krzyzewski. Still, Doc Rivers says Austin almost stayed because he liked Coach K so much. (that part kills me in one way as I wish Austin cam back...but is great to hear that he loved playing for coach K. also puts to rest some of the "team chemistry issues" bc if there were large chemistry issues I don't think you would even consider coming back)
    He would have put the chemistry issues to rest if he said he almost stayed "because he liked his teammates so much". (Actually that wouldn't have done it either, but it would have helped)
    Mmmm, BBQ!

  10. #670
    Quote Originally Posted by CameronBornAndBred View Post
    He would have put the chemistry issues to rest if he said he almost stayed "because he liked his teammates so much". (Actually that wouldn't have done it either, but it would have helped)
    Remember he did say in his interview after the Lehigh game that he felt so bad for his teammates and that he's going to be best friends with them for the rest of their lives. I really don't think team chemistry was the issue. I think it may have been in the earlier part of the season, but I think it was squashed. Remember Austin's interview after the UNC game on February 8th? He made a point to say that the whole team was close and had each other's backs in his interview with Erin Andrews after the game. I just think Austin's ultimate dream has always been to play in the NBA, and having the opportunity to do so next season is too good to pass up.

  11. #671
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    Deeetroit City
    Henson, Barnes and Marshall likely push Mason down farther toward the bottom of the first round making it more likely he stays for a less talented draft. Win/win in my book.

  12. #672
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    Boca Grande Florida
    There were chemistry issues on the court between their styles of play this season.

    It was probably OK in the locker room.
    Wheat/"/"/"
    "An angry man catches no fish"-Zen proverb.

  13. #673
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wheat/"/"/" View Post
    There were chemistry issues on the court between their styles of play this season.

    It was probably OK in the locker room.
    That's a fair assessment. On court chemistry rarely has anything to do with liking each other. It's much more about everyone being on the same page at all times and anticipating what each other is going to do. That was missing this year. The post guys never knew when they were going to get the ball vs when they were not. Several plays come to mind, but one in particular stood out for me. Duke was holding for the last shot of the first half in one of the early season games. Austin attacked off the high pick, and Kelly slashed to the hoop from the corner. Austin drew the help defender up out of the lane, and Kelly rose up expecting the lob. Austin's nice bounce back went to a camera man behind Kelly.

    It was neither kid's "fault". They just were not anticipating each other's move. Easy dunk becomes turnover. Similar things happened all year long with many different players involved.

    "[T]he tarnished Tar Heels that bear little resemblance to the revered program built by Dean Smith."- Ashville Times
    "UNC and the NCAA are trying to conceal that the fraud was specifically designed to pad the transcripts of varsity athletes" - Bloomberg

  14. #674
    Yeah, sure. Now there were "chemistry problems."

    The grapes.

  15. #675
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    Washington, DC area
    Quote Originally Posted by WiJoe View Post
    Yeah, sure. Now there were "chemistry problems."

    The grapes.
    Well, I think the word may not be exactly right, but we frequently didn't "click" on the floor. I think it's a reasonable statement.

    -jk

  16. #676
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    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by -jk View Post
    Well, I think the word may not be exactly right, but we frequently didn't "click" on the floor. I think it's a reasonable statement.

    -jk
    Yea, can't deny it in the last half of the season.... some atrocious offense at times.

  17. #677
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    Quote Originally Posted by gofurman View Post
    "Still, Doc Rivers says Austin almost stayed because he liked Coach K so much."
    I wonder if Austin realizes that he may be done playing for the best coach he will ever have.

  18. #678
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    Quote Originally Posted by BD80 View Post
    Henson, Barnes and Marshall likely push Mason down farther toward the bottom of the first round making it more likely he stays for a less talented draft. Win/win in my book.
    It would not surprise me to see Mason stay and become an offensive scoring force in the post next season when coach K changes the offensive focus and puts more emphasis on entry passes to him. He has the strength/talent and he can be a beast inside, but the offense has to play through him deeper in the paint. Coach K can adjust and often does... Hey, if I can see it, he surely can

    Mason could be an All-American, really improve his draft stock, and with Duke's returning roster and recruits, next year will be a good time to get back to the inside game.
    Wheat/"/"/"
    "An angry man catches no fish"-Zen proverb.

  19. #679
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    Quote Originally Posted by CameronCrazy06 View Post
    Remember he did say in his interview after the Lehigh game that he felt so bad for his teammates and that he's going to be best friends with them for the rest of their lives. I really don't think team chemistry was the issue. I think it may have been in the earlier part of the season, but I think it was squashed. Remember Austin's interview after the UNC game on February 8th? He made a point to say that the whole team was close and had each other's backs in his interview with Erin Andrews after the game. I just think Austin's ultimate dream has always been to play in the NBA, and having the opportunity to do so next season is too good to pass up.
    I think that K said that teaqm chemsitry was an issue in many different ways throughout the season. His best was when he talked abut growth, how he was disappointed that the team was not growning as a team, that the couldn't close out games and that games were really up in the air until the very end, with no ability on Duke's part even with a meaningful 4-6 point lead going into the final minutes engendering any confidence that what he would get bore a resemblence to what he wanted. He also said that other teams who beat Duke often "wanted it more," and fumbled around all season trying to find a line up that wold cohere on offense, finally settling on an offense featured around getting one guy to score. When you figure out how playing to one guy's scoring the ball as the first, second, and third option, please do write.

    For my part, I really didn't see steady end game play on either side of the ball by anyone but Tyler. Miles and Mason did not touch the scoring position duding the final five minuteshere was rarely one of those alley opp set plays set up for Mason during the final five minutes, much less the final two, Kelly lost the ball bringing it up or afterwards when he was dribbling like a real 3 near the endline, being pressed off balance and making an improdicent pass. The offense in such moments came down to one of the bigs sprinting out to set a screen for Rivers who darted every-which-way to try to break free, with other screens being set if he decided to try other areas of the court, and occasioaly the ball ending up in the hands of someone unexpected, I can recall two and they're both named Tyler. Inthe final minutes, the only plyer who was a serious other option was Curry, unless Dawkins had proven himself in an incredible zone early inthe game and K saw the need for a three-ball to keep the game within reach, or a small and dwindling lead from dwindling even further.

    This was not a team without "chemistry issues." I'd be shocked if any such dirty laudry was open for ciscussion, evening mentioning outside the locker room. If issues boiled over in practice, and one of the leser coaches intevened to calm things down, I can only guess that an aggrieved party could speak about it with K, but the talk would not be like sitting on the porch like one might with his proverbial grandfather. K probably had his ways of dealing with those matters that had proven quite successful in the past. He said jokingly after a game at the end of the season that his old tricks didn't seem to be working anymore.

    I just don't think see how a team filed with as much talent as Duke had that had most everyone but Curry and Kelly playing bit parts in service of a freshman who occupied the ball an ungodly amount getting more points would be a sanguine and cohessive group. Now maybe there were flare ups and maybe there weren't. But, K put the toothpaste back in the tube as best he could and everyone could be sure that such disagreements did not see thelight of day. One of the littles who was part of the trouble might have had some toes chopped off, and Rivers, who had good reason to be content, was not hating on anyone and I'm sure left feeling like the team were like a band of brothers. Not in Harry's eyes they wouldn't have been, and Harry knew a thing or two on that subject. I still think that there was something about Dawkins' post season decline, and declining minutes that has not been said and never will be.

  20. #680
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    That's a fair assessment. On court chemistry rarely has anything to do with liking each other.
    That was highlighted greatly in the Fox sports interview with Laettner and Hill. (http://msn.foxsports.com/collegebask...at-duke-022512)
    Laettner talked about his issues with Hurley, and even though they had their problems off the court they didn't allow it to carry onto the court.
    Hill added: "Christian was obviously demanding on Bobby, but he was demanding on a lot of people. Myself, Marty (Clarke), even the walk-ons he'd get in your face if you messed up. There was tension there, but it was all because he wanted to win. We always knew that. The great thing with Bobby and Christian was that it never carried onto the court. They may be arguing before a game or in practice, but Bobby would always find Christian at the three-point line in perfect position, and vice versa. The chemistry on the court was unmatched. It was 'iron sharpens iron.' And, really, that's the Duke way."
    Still, just because that's how it was between 2 players 20 years ago does not mean it will apply to every Duke player in Cameron. But we'd hope so.
    Mmmm, BBQ!

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