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  1. #601
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Silicon Valley
    Quote Originally Posted by geraldsneighbor View Post
    I assume you mean with Curry if he would forgo his final season to go play overseas? I don't believe he will do that ultimately because his goal in transferring to Duke was to become and NBA player. With a year of eligibility left, that is still possible. He needs to have a big summer though, IMO.
    He is also probably eligible to graduate with a Duke degree at this point. Just something to consider.

  2. #602
    Quote Originally Posted by anon View Post
    He is also probably eligible to graduate with a Duke degree at this point. Just something to consider.
    Why would Curry leave with a year of eligibility remaining? It's not like he won't have a major role for Duke next season.

  3. #603
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    greater New Orleans area

    Ditto

    Quote Originally Posted by ArkieDukie View Post
    My speculation is that one or more players may have felt a bit jealous of Austin and felt that he was taking away from their importance to the team. This could have caused a change in their attitude, resulting in the poor communication on the court that the players themselves admitted to...
    this is my impression as well....several comebacks and the shot against UNC, IMO, made a couple of people on the team jealous and they simply quit giving it their all, purposefully or subconsciously they checked out rather than sharing in "someone else's" glory.

  4. #604
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Quote Originally Posted by Kfanarmy View Post
    this is my impression as well....several comebacks and the shot against UNC, IMO, made a couple of people on the team jealous and they simply quit giving it their all, purposefully or subconsciously they checked out rather than sharing in "someone else's" glory.
    If you're going to throw around accusations like this, you may as well put some substance to them. Who, specifically, do you think was jealous of Austin? In what ways did they "quit giving it their all"? How do you conclude that they did so. And how exactly do you determine when someone subconsciously checks out?
    Just be you. You is enough. - K, 4/5/10, 0:13.8 to play, 60-59 Duke.

    You're all jealous hypocrites. - Titus on Laettner

    You see those guys? Animals. They're animals. - SIU Coach Chris Lowery, on Duke

  5. #605
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Quote Originally Posted by Kfanarmy View Post
    this is my impression as well....several comebacks and the shot against UNC, IMO, made a couple of people on the team jealous and they simply quit giving it their all, purposefully or subconsciously they checked out rather than sharing in "someone else's" glory.
    Given that most of the players-not-named-Austin-Rivers in the rotation were upperclassmen and had been with K for three or four years, I find this hard to believe. The only underclassmen in the rotation were Tyler and Josh, both of whom could not possibly be accused of low effort. If K hasn't sold everyone on the team concept, the subtraction of a spotlight player will make little difference, IMO.

  6. #606
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Fayetteville, NC
    We can speculate till the cows come home what the different comments made by various players after the loss to Lehigh actually mean. Does it serve any purpose? I really can't see what that would be, except to satisfy our curiosity.

    I also don't see how the loss of Rivers will let us fathom what did or didn't happen this year no matter how well or how poorly the team plays next year. The team dynamics will be completely different.

  7. #607
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Maybe I am cynical or not that understanding, but I have very limited feelings about players like Deng, Magette, Rivers, and Irving. I might give Irving a pass because of his injury but the others very little feeling .

    When you watch Deng or Magette do you get that same warm feeling you do when you see or saw Grant Hill, Shane Battier, Nolan Smith, Christian Laetnner, Gerald Henderson play ?

    Maybe I am in the minority but I have no proud feeling of being a Duke fan when I see Deng or Magette play and I will have the same non feeling when I see Rivers play in the NBA.

    OK he made that great clutch shot at UNC but bailed out after one year when in my opinion he will be a bench player or get very few minutes of play next year, unlike Irving who is a star immediately. His family certainly doesn't need the money.

    Sorry, I will not be rooting for Austin Rivers and in a few years or maybe even sooner , like Deng and Magette, I will probably forget that he even played for Duke.

  8. #608
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by Dukehky View Post
    Krzyzewski announced that Austin is gone. Don't know if we've said that, but it's official.

    Hopefully this helps us with Shabazz, I think it might.
    ,

    Shabazz, who I understand is a really good kid , will not propel Duke into a championship team, especially if Mason leaves and will be a one and done player, in my opinion.

    Next year at this time, many posters will be thanking him for a great season and wishing him well in the NBA.

  9. #609
    Join Date
    Feb 2007

    Mason

    In my opinion, Mason staying is more important than Rivers, who is bailing out after 1 year and will be a bench player for a year or two in the NBA.

    If Mason stays and I surely hope he does, Duke could be a very decent team...in my opinion not a championship one but very decent.

    If he leaves, my big question is who is going to rebound ? Are you telling me that Marshall and Kelley are going to be our rebounders....wow that should be interesting.

    If Mason stays or leaves, Coach K and staff should do everything in their power to get Oriaki, ( spelling ?) He is a much better fit that Shabazz, Parker, Jefferson etc.

    As a matter of fact, if Oriaki would come and Mason would stay, then we might have something special.

  10. #610
    Quote Originally Posted by NYC Duke Fan View Post
    If Mason stays or leaves, Coach K and staff should do everything in their power to get Oriaki, ( spelling ?) He is a much better fit that Shabazz, Parker, Jefferson etc.
    What do you mean by "better fit"? If you are saying we need a player who will publicly question his coach's decisions as "BS" and call his coach an idiot on twitter...then yeah, Oriakhi would be a great fit for us.

    Maybe we'll just have to settle for a 3-4 year forward with less attitude problems though. Or maybe we'll just be stuck with a dynamic all-around player who is ranked #1 in the 2012 class. It's not ideal, I know, but hopefully we can find some way to then overcome our inability to bring in a bad apple with one year of eligibility remaining who averaged 4.8 rebounds per game this year.

  11. #611
    Quote Originally Posted by Duvall View Post
    Why would Curry leave with a year of eligibility remaining? It's not like he won't have a major role for Duke next season.
    There was some speculation that he might decide to play overseas for a year. AFAIK that's not happening though.

  12. #612
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Arlington, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by NYC Duke Fan View Post
    Maybe I am cynical or not that understanding, but I have very limited feelings about players like Deng, Magette, Rivers, and Irving. I might give Irving a pass because of his injury but the others very little feeling .

    When you watch Deng or Magette do you get that same warm feeling you do when you see or saw Grant Hill, Shane Battier, Nolan Smith, Christian Laetnner, Gerald Henderson play ?

    Maybe I am in the minority but I have no proud feeling of being a Duke fan when I see Deng or Magette play and I will have the same non feeling when I see Rivers play in the NBA.

    OK he made that great clutch shot at UNC but bailed out after one year when in my opinion he will be a bench player or get very few minutes of play next year, unlike Irving who is a star immediately. His family certainly doesn't need the money.

    Sorry, I will not be rooting for Austin Rivers and in a few years or maybe even sooner , like Deng and Magette, I will probably forget that he even played for Duke.
    Therefore what? Of course if you don't feel the same way about people who leave Duke after one year as you do about people who stay for 3 or 4 years, that's understandable--not all would share your view, but people feel differently about the whole one-and-done phenomenon.

    Ultimately, though, basketball players are going to make their own choices for their own reasons. And given the way the current NBA rules work, the coaches have limited choices--recruit the best players they can, knowing that some will probably choose to leave early, or pass on potential lottery picks and stick to good, but not great players (some of whom might surprise and leave early anyway, whether or not they "should"). While I'm sure both players and coaches would like it if school fan bases continued to support and feel connection to the players when they go to the next level, it can't really be a top consideration for either group.

  13. #613

    Just one thing about Austin's announcement

    "It was a difficult decision to leave Duke..."

    It was just as difficult for me to return Sofia Vergara's call last Saturday, and even more difficult to lie to my wife and tell her I was going bowling with the guys. I just hate myself.

  14. #614
    Quote Originally Posted by NYC Duke Fan View Post
    If Mason stays or leaves, Coach K and staff should do everything in their power to get Oriaki, ( spelling ?) He is a much better fit that Shabazz
    Nope. No role player is going to a "better fit" than Bazz.

  15. #615
    Quote Originally Posted by NYC Duke Fan View Post
    Maybe I am cynical or not that understanding, but I have very limited feelings about players like Deng, Magette, Rivers, and Irving. I might give Irving a pass because of his injury but the others very little feeling .

    When you watch Deng or Magette do you get that same warm feeling you do when you see or saw Grant Hill, Shane Battier, Nolan Smith, Christian Laetnner, Gerald Henderson play ?

    Maybe I am in the minority but I have no proud feeling of being a Duke fan when I see Deng or Magette play and I will have the same non feeling when I see Rivers play in the NBA.

    OK he made that great clutch shot at UNC but bailed out after one year when in my opinion he will be a bench player or get very few minutes of play next year, unlike Irving who is a star immediately. His family certainly doesn't need the money.

    Sorry, I will not be rooting for Austin Rivers and in a few years or maybe even sooner , like Deng and Magette, I will probably forget that he even played for Duke.
    I agree totally. I on a very rare occasion think about those huge slam dunks Magette had in the NCAA tournament when he got technicals. But otherwise I have no real connection to these one and done players. For me it detracts from my enjoyment of watching Duke basketball. I like watching the players develop and mature and changing from year to year as well as seeing how the coaching staff adjusts to their evolving development. I frankly enjoy that more in the end than having them in the Final Four.

    Take Nolan Smith as an example. He went from a scrawny little freshman to being a superstar. That was seriously fun to watch. And how about watching Scheyer's growth? That was so much fun. I also enjoy the intrigue of a player like Andre. What do we need to do to get Andre back on track? I watched some clips from the last NCAA championship and saw Andre doing things he sure wasn't doing this year. What changed? To me it was probably the lack of leadership and confidence on this year's team. In hindsight I am continually reminded about how much difference a Scheyer or a Battier truly makes to a basketball team. And by them staying for the duration we get to see those leadership skills develop and guide a team.

    On a different note, I disagree that the team got jealous of Austin and quit playing. I recall Andre's reaction numerous times when Austin had a big play -- the tv cameras seem to love Andre. It was always huge and happy. He was the first one to get to him after Austin hit the 3 at UNC. I can't imagine the rest of the guys being any less happy.

    Now that I think about it though I do wonder how the media affects the dynamic of a team. It was weird that we had to look at Doc Rivers' reaction every time he was at a game and Austin scored. That must have gotten old for the rest of the team's families, especially the ones who can't afford to fly their private jet to every game.

  16. #616
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    New York, NY
    Quote Originally Posted by COCO View Post
    I agree totally. I on a very rare occasion think about those huge slam dunks Magette had in the NCAA tournament when he got technicals. But otherwise I have no real connection to these one and done players.
    I have somewhat different feelings about each of them. Maggette (and Brand and Avery) were all great college players (to varying degrees), but I'm still thinking that they underperformed at the end, and I think it may (MAY) have had to do with their NBA anticipations and possible/alleged partying before the final. So for Maggette, I think, "great talent, immature... kind of a kick to watch him in the NBA." I also thought all 3 of those guys seemed antagonistic about their Duke experiences, though it has been reassuring to see them return to support K and the team. Further, I'm a little embarrassed as a Duke fan about the amount of vitriol that was heaped on them by the fan base for making a decision that most of us would have made if we were in that same position.

    Deng is from one of the poorest, most difficult places on the planet. He had an opportunity to go to the NBA and lock in guaranteed millions that could buy him not just a bunch of cars but have an impact on a network of projects and people. He had a choice, but I don't begrudge him the choice. Sure, if he'd stayed even 3 years, he'd have a jersey flapping in the Cameron breeze, and being the best player alongside Redick, Williams, and Nelson, we'd have been the favorite to win the NC every year. Hard to argue wit hthe decision--though you're right, I didn't get to watch him enough to go out of my way to to turn on a Bulls game...

    I have somewhat different feelings about Irving and Rivers. Kyrie is so likable and so good and so adept at making his teammates better, that I both regret not seeing him play and wish him well at whatever he does. Rivers, meanwhile, never seemed to make his teammates better, played with a surly attitude and never appeared to really unpack his bags at Duke; I'll wish him well and realize I have no idea who he is as a person and will be perfectly happy to watch whoever is suited up next year in a Duke uniform.

  17. #617
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia
    Quote Originally Posted by johnb View Post
    Rivers, meanwhile, never seemed to make his teammates better, played with a surly attitude and never appeared to really unpack his bags at Duke; I'll wish him well and realize I have no idea who he is as a person and will be perfectly happy to watch whoever is suited up next year in a Duke uniform.
    I don't think making faces on the court means you have a surly attitude, and I didn't see any other indications of a surly attitude out of Austin. Personally, I felt that he totally unpacked his bags, although obviously that's a totally subjective assessment. He badly wanted to win, appeared to respect and listen to the coaching staff, rooted for his teammates when he was on the bench, and gave his all every time he stepped on the court. What more could you ask from the young man?

  18. #618
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Atlanta, GA/Durham, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by NYC Duke Fan View Post
    Maybe I am cynical or not that understanding, but I have very limited feelings about players like Deng, Magette, Rivers, and Irving. I might give Irving a pass because of his injury but the others very little feeling .

    When you watch Deng or Magette do you get that same warm feeling you do when you see or saw Grant Hill, Shane Battier, Nolan Smith, Christian Laetnner, Gerald Henderson play ?

    Maybe I am in the minority but I have no proud feeling of being a Duke fan when I see Deng or Magette play and I will have the same non feeling when I see Rivers play in the NBA.

    OK he made that great clutch shot at UNC but bailed out after one year when in my opinion he will be a bench player or get very few minutes of play next year, unlike Irving who is a star immediately. His family certainly doesn't need the money.

    Sorry, I will not be rooting for Austin Rivers and in a few years or maybe even sooner , like Deng and Magette, I will probably forget that he even played for Duke.
    Let me get this straight. You want Duke to win and win a lot right now. You want one and done talent but they have to stay 3-4 years. Even if they continue to visit Duke, talk to Coach K and become proud beacons in their community they still don't make you proud.

    Can we put two and two together for a second? A commitment to Duke is no one year thing. Coach K builds relationships with the huge majority of his players before they ever even get on campus and continues to monitor them when he can.

    Even Coach K understands that even if a player stays for 4 years, it's still but a pit stop in the grand scheme of life. He also understands that if a kid is good enough that he should be able to go straight to the NBA. If a kid wants to leave then Coach K discusses it with him as a BUSINESS DECISION (cause ya know - they did name a center in the business school after him). Everyone has their reasons for leaving. Duke may not be striving to be an NBA factory but he definitely wants his kids to be successful.

    I pray that most feel the same as K.

    http://thestartingfive.net/2010/05/2...or-the-taking/

    MT: Leaving Duke early when it wasn’t a normal occurrence. What went into making that decision?

    Elton Brand: It was a tough decision. Coach K was right there along with my decision. He knew my background financially and things like that. During the season he said “Hey, we’re gonna do this thing right.” He told me I was gonna be on the cover of magazines and player of the year…which I was. The same with the Wooden Award and the Naismith Award and all that. He said I was going to be a top three pick. He said it’s OK, I understand your situation.

    College is pure. I left a lot of fun there. It was more a business decision. Now my son or daughter (not yet) won’t have to make the same decisions I made.

  19. #619
    Quote Originally Posted by SupaDave View Post
    Even Coach K understands that even if a player stays for 4 years, it's still but a pit stop in the grand scheme of life. He also understands that if a kid is good enough that he should be able to go straight to the NBA. If a kid wants to leave then Coach K discusses it with him as a BUSINESS DECISION (cause ya know - they did name a center in the business school after him). Everyone has their reasons for leaving. Duke may not be striving to be an NBA factory but he definitely wants his kids to be successful.

    I pray that most feel the same as K.
    I think people feel however they feel - if someone is more attached to the 4-year guys, that's valid. As a fan of college basketball I think the game has been hurt by early entry. The quality of play is not what it once was, and it's harder as a fan to get attached to a player if he's only around for a year or two. I think all that is valid.

    But if Duke as an institution is in the business of doing what is best for these kids, as we're supposed to be, then you are absolutely right. When a player accepts a scholarship to Duke there are certain obligations that come with it - going to class, going to practice, representing the university appropriately - but fulfilling fan expectations is not on the list. AR, Deng, whoever - they've got to do what's best for them. So long as they are good students, good teammates, good representatives of the university for however long they're here, I'm at peace with it.

  20. #620
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Atlanta, GA/Durham, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Matches View Post
    I think people feel however they feel - if someone is more attached to the 4-year guys, that's valid. As a fan of college basketball I think the game has been hurt by early entry. The quality of play is not what it once was, and it's harder as a fan to get attached to a player if he's only around for a year or two. I think all that is valid.
    I bet they count EVERY last one of them when they are having the traditional "Success in the NBA" argument with a Carolina fan. Every last one.

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