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  1. #501
    Quote Originally Posted by grossbus View Post
    "As far as the #1s go, McRoberts was about the biggest bust there's ever been. We should have easily won the national championship that year with Redick and Shelden if McRoberts had stepped up but he didn't."

    funny, what I remember about the loss to LSU is McBobs playing pretty well in his role on that team and JJ getting beat up by LSU defenders, getting no calls and missing a lot of shots.
    I didn't specifically mean just the LSU game. I meant in general in his two years at Duke, McRoberts was a bust.

  2. #502
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Fayetteville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by nolan8or View Post
    I didn't specifically mean just the LSU game. I meant in general in his two years at Duke, McRoberts was a bust.
    Sorry, but you're way off base calling McRoberts a bust. Here are his stats for two years at Duke.

    http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/pla...josh-mcroberts

    Josh had a very good all around game and had he been surrounded by a better supporting cast things would have been a lot different.

    I believe he takes way too much heat because our friends down the road had that other center.

  3. #503
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO

    Josh

    Quote Originally Posted by nolan8or View Post
    I didn't specifically mean just the LSU game. I meant in general in his two years at Duke, McRoberts was a bust.
    I dunno, Nolan8or. Josh has a lot of critics, and the collective feelings may be a case of "he-left-early-therefore-he's-a-bum." While I was disappointed he left as well, his record is pretty good: Josh was 2nd team All-ACC as a sophomore, the same as Ferry, Laettner, and Shelden (all retired jerseys); ahead of Boozer (who was injured); but behind NPOY Brand. And he was a stat sheet stuffer: 13 PPG, 7.9 RPG, 3.5 APG (!), and 2.5 BPG (!). And he was the third leading scorer on the JJ-Shelden 2006 team.

    He clearly left too early, in that he was a second rounder without a guaranteed contract. 2012 is the first year he has made good NBA money, and he isn't in a great situation with the Lakers.

    sagegrouse

  4. #504
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington, D.C.

    Thanks for perspective

    Quote Originally Posted by HateCarolina View Post
    I popped on here to get some more background on the note in the front page that CBS may have jumped the gun and all I see is bickering and people jumping down others throats seemingly unjustly. I've been pissed for about a week about our loss, but I thought I could come on here and read sane comments from other fans. Are we now turning on each other??
    Let's save our vitriol and venom for UNC!

  5. #505
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Durham, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Lauderdevil View Post
    Hey, Austin brought us one of the truly great moments in Duke basketball; to me, the season was a success purely for the joy of that shot. Stay or go, I thank him for that.

    Exactly. Thanks for playing your butt off every single minute of every single game. The shot will never be forgotten. You have left behind something that will live forever. Thank you for that. Good luck and good bye.

  6. #506

    He Probably Didn't Want to Be at Duke in the First Place

    I didn't realize that Austin had wanted to play for University of Florida. I agree that maybe he just didn't really want to be at Duke, that his dad may have pushed him into it, and now he can make his own decisions -- sort of. It wouldn't make any sense for him to transfer so better just to go the NBA. Good luck to him whatever he decides. There are all kinds of ways for him to get where he wants to be. I hope Doc lets him decide. It's when we start forcing our own agendas on our kids that things get screwed up.

  7. #507
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by COCO View Post
    I didn't realize that Austin had wanted to play for University of Florida. I agree that maybe he just didn't really want to be at Duke, that his dad may have pushed him into it, and now he can make his own decisions -- sort of. It wouldn't make any sense for him to transfer so better just to go the NBA. Good luck to him whatever he decides. There are all kinds of ways for him to get where he wants to be. I hope Doc lets him decide. It's when we start forcing our own agendas on our kids that things get screwed up.
    He had a verbal commitment to florida, then withdrew it to go do duke....he wouldn't have committed to florida to the first place without his father's blessing, and you most certainly don't renege on your commitment to go someplace else if you don't really want to be at that other place.

    The kid was crying on the court after we lost to FSU and gave us probably the biggest memory of the year in "the shot"

    Its just nuts to think for one second that he didn't actually want to be here.
    9f

  8. #508
    Quote Originally Posted by COCO View Post
    I didn't realize that Austin had wanted to play for University of Florida. I agree that maybe he just didn't really want to be at Duke, that his dad may have pushed him into it.
    Uh, where are you getting this from?! He committed to Florida his sophomore year, but changed his mind. Is a high schooler not allowed to do that? From all reports, Doc has not pushed him to do ANYTHING, but has simply given him advice as any father would, but that it was ultimately Austin's decision. Austin said he chose Duke because of Coach K and that Florida was more of a football school. He thought Duke would provide a better chance for a national championship and make him a better player. I don't know where people are coming up with stories that Doc forced him into something he didn't want.

    I always find it a bit sad that some here feel the need to disparage a guy who just gave his heart and soul to this team for this entire season. At times, while it seemed like other players weren't showing the passion, Austin always did. Did he have his faults? Of course. But he brought it every night with fire and passion and had a strong will to win and wasn't afraid to take the big shot. I, for one, am thankful for what Austin brought to this team this year and we would have been a lot worse off without him. And I'll especially remember his shot @UNC forever. If Austin decides that leaving for the NBA is in his best interest, then we should thank him for what he did for this club this year and wish him the best. Good luck to Austin with whatever he decides. I would love to have him back, but if he decides going to the NBA (obviously a dream of his) is the best choice, then I will support that as well just like the coaching staff will.

  9. #509
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    I don't mind if Austin leaves early. I don't think his teammates liked him very much. You could just tell in the demeanor of the players on the court. He came in with an NBA name and reputation and was the hot head from day 1. He is an NBA style of player (pick and roll basketball, one-on-one). I can't fault him for that because he was raised on it his whole life. I don't think Coach K will mind too much either. Austin isn't a system guy. And Coach K does things with HIS system.

    Personally, I am very big on having leadership and chemistry. Your best player needs to be respected and looked upon for leadership. Austin does not do that for Duke.

    When I initially heard Mason was leaving I was a bit surprised. But I don't blame him for leaving if he chooses to. He doesn't play with guards who get him the ball at his strong points (in transition and in pick and roll situations). A lot of the time a big is only as good as his guards allow him to be. If you look back at his short stint of games with Kyrie, he looked much more like an NBA type of power forward (explosive, running the floor, playing at the rim) and NBA scouts recognize this. I think Mason got sick of running pick and roll with Austin and NEVER receiving a pass from him. So maybe if Austin leaves, Mason stays.

    Both players did a lot of good in their time at Duke. Wish them the best either way but I'd much rather see Mason back than Austin

  10. #510
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluedog View Post
    Uh, where are you getting this from?! He committed to Florida his sophomore year, but changed his mind. Is a high schooler not allowed to do that? From all reports, Doc has not pushed him to do ANYTHING, but has simply given him advice as any father would, but that it was ultimately Austin's decision. Austin said he chose Duke because of Coach K and that Florida was more of a football school. He thought Duke would provide a better chance for a national championship and make him a better player. I don't know where people are coming up with stories that Doc forced him into something he didn't want.

    I always find it a bit sad that some here feel the need to disparage a guy who just gave his heart and soul to this team for this entire season. At times, while it seemed like other players weren't showing the passion, Austin always did. Did he have his faults? Of course. But he brought it every night with fire and passion and had a strong will to win and wasn't afraid to take the big shot. I, for one, am thankful for what Austin brought to this team this year and we would have been a lot worse off without him. And I'll especially remember his shot @UNC forever. If Austin decides that leaving for the NBA is in his best interest, then we should thank him for what he did for this club this year and wish him the best. Good luck to Austin with whatever he decides. I would love to have him back, but if he decides going to the NBA (obviously a dream of his) is the best choice, then I will support that as well just like the coaching staff will.
    I wasn't disparaging him, I was sympathizing with him. Maybe he thought or was persuaded that it was smarter to go to Duke but his heart was elsewhere. It happens frequently. He is just a kid no matter how well he plays basketball.

  11. #511
    Quote Originally Posted by nolan8or View Post
    I didn't specifically mean just the LSU game. I meant in general in his two years at Duke, McRoberts was a bust.
    McRoberts was far from a bust... If anything he was forced into the role of being our number one scoring option when his game just wasn't meant for that role.

  12. #512
    I have no doubt that Austin wanted to be at Duke and played hard for Duke.

    Until he says he is gone, I will be hoping for him to stay.

  13. #513
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington, D.C.

    Yup

    Quote Originally Posted by grossbus View Post
    I have no doubt that Austin wanted to be at Duke and played hard for Duke.

    Until he says he is gone, I will be hoping for him to stay.
    Amen. He was very good this year and gave it his all. I'm fine with whatever he decides.

  14. #514
    Quote Originally Posted by MChambers View Post
    Amen. He was very good this year and gave it his all. I'm fine with whatever he decides.
    I agree with you. That said, we might as well be fine with whatever he decides because we are not part of the decision process.

  15. #515
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    20 Minutes From The Heaven That Is Cameron Indoor
    Quote Originally Posted by johnny2001 View Post
    This is the key thing. Duke has a lofty goal. To win it all, every year. That's how I see it and to answer your question...yes, most fail. The best are the ones who admit they failed to achieve the goal, address the issues that came in the way, diagnose why they came in the way of your goal, and then ultimately go out and put the design and people in place to achieve the goal. it's rapid evolution and the faster teams can do that the faster they evolve and move toward the goal of winning championships. everyone fails, so it's not like it makes you a bad person or player. it just means you didn't achieve your goal. and anyone who thinks we achieved duke's goal for the season this year i will beg to differ and argue against that until the end.
    I have heard Coach K speak on this many times. He has made it crystal clear that he and his staff (not you or the media, or anyone else) set the goals each year for each team. K values all championships from the early season stuff like Maui, Pre-Season NIT, etc, to ACC Regular Season, ACC Tourney, Regional Tourney, National Title. Duke has won many of these over the years under K's watch. K sets the goals each year based on the abilities of the team at hand, and the goals differ each year. I can assure you he does not think that every team can win the NCAA Title, and for those teams winning the whole thing is a dream, not a goal. There's a difference.

    You may feel it is your "right" to have Duke win the National Title every single year. It is not.

    Wainstein Report Page 19 Section G:
    In men’s basketball, academic counselor Burgess McSwain (“McSwain”) and
    her successor Wayne Walden routinely called Crowder to arrange classes for their
    players.
    Roy Williams Of Nazareth had no knowledge however. He is sinless.

  16. #516
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    I have heard Coach K speak on this many times. He has made it crystal clear that he and his staff (not you or the media, or anyone else) set the goals each year for each team. K values all championships from the early season stuff like Maui, Pre-Season NIT, etc, to ACC Regular Season, ACC Tourney, Regional Tourney, National Title. Duke has won many of these over the years under K's watch. K sets the goals each year based on the abilities of the team at hand, and the goals differ each year. I can assure you he does not think that every team can win the NCAA Title, and for those teams winning the whole thing is a dream, not a goal. There's a difference.

    You may feel it is your "right" to have Duke win the National Title every single year. It is not.
    That said, I don't think he's afraid to say when he thinks the team can win. Often times you hear "if we do xxx, we have a chance to be really special"

    I think the takaway is that the goals are realistic, but that doesn't mean he is selling any team short....he's simply not setting them up for failure by setting goals which are likely out of reach.
    9f

  17. #517
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Scrap Metal Hill
    Quote Originally Posted by Dukehky View Post
    I've said it before, there is absolutely not way a player can develop better in college than he can in the NBA.

    They play basketball all day everyday for a living. They're allowed to play and be coached year-round. It is in the absolute best interest of their teams to develop these kids despite players, "being out for themselves." GM's, owners, and coaches don't want their first round pick to be a bust. They want them to develop in the way that is best for their team, and in the NBA that's becoming the best offensive player possible, including passing and shooting. You think Austin is going to get better playing against Tyler Thornton or Rajon Rondo. Rondo, all day every day. When you play with better people you get better as long as the gap isn't so great that you can't work on things. With first round picks, that's not the case. If kids work hard--- Austin, they're going to get better.

    I beg to differ. I think Supa Dave made the same point upstream, and I beg to differ with him, too. The NBA isn't all that interested in player development. That's why they went to the 19 minimum age rule that established the one-and-done. The NBA would set the league age at 20 and be glad to let the NCAA cash in on (I''m sorry, I meant "developing") their pool of unpaid labor if they could get away with it. The NBA is all about minutes and contracts. If you're not getting minutes, you're not getting better. If you have a contract, you can do what you want until it's time to worry about the next one. Lastly, you can make a nice career in the NBA with one major-plus skill and absolutely nothing else. For example, I'm thinking of Mike Miller (3 pointers), JaVale McGee or Slammin Sammy Dalembert (shotblocking), Reggie Evans (rebounding), and in years past, Ben Wallace, Bruce Bowen, etc.

    Sure, there might be more practices because the season is longer, but it's such a grind the practices aren't really for instruction. A few NBA teams who do want to develop players (e.g. Dallas, San Antonio) are investing into D-league teams, but they're the exception. It's not unusual for mid or low first round picks to cash their 3 year rookie deal, ride some pine, and then wash out of the league.

    To use your example, Austin's not going to get better working against Rondo, because Rondo's only going at half speed. The real development at the college age is in the weight room - the player growing into his body, getting stronger, and (hopefully) maturing as a person. If Austin doesn't have a left hand now, he's not going to get one over the summer.

    The reason people are so divided about Austin is because his NBA career has such a wide range of possibilities. Sure, he could make a couple all-star teams, or he could have a rank-and-file / journeyman career like JJ, Duhon, or GHenderson. Lot of room in between, too. That's why the right team with the right mix of players is so important. For example, if Austin winds up in Sacramento, he might as well be in Azkaban for all the good it will do his career...
    "Quality is not an option!"

  18. #518
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    new york

    Austin...

    Best of luck to Austin, whichever way he goes, but he played hard every minute and for much of the year was the only guy who had it and brought it every game. The Shot -- 2012 Version -- was one of the great all-time Duke moments, and Austin, for a freshman was everything anyone could realistically have asked for. I think he'd gain more both as a player and as a brand (awful word -- but it's the world we live in) by a year at Duke, but if he doesn't, best wishes to him. Anyone who knocks him is awfully hard to please. One of the best freshman years anyone has had at Duke. Horrible that it ended the way it did, but I'd love to see what a sophomore year would look like...

  19. #519
    Quote Originally Posted by FerryFor50 View Post
    I agree about the similarity of taking it to the rack. That part will improve.

    But DWade always had court vision. I'm shocked that so many schools missed on his recruitment and he ended up at Marquette.
    He had HORRIBLE grades. The previous administration at Marquette made a deal with the devil and took him in, in large part due to the insistence of the coach (the tanned one = crean). So it wasn't missing on him as much as it was being scared off by grades.

  20. #520
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by WiJoe View Post
    He had HORRIBLE grades. The previous administration at Marquette made a deal with the devil and took him in, in large part due to the insistence of the coach (the tanned one = crean). So it wasn't missing on him as much as it was being scared off by grades.
    Ah ok... that makes sense then.

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