Page 16 of 25 FirstFirst ... 61415161718 ... LastLast
Results 301 to 320 of 493
  1. #301
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    Exhortation? Prognostication? Celebration?
    I can probably muster the first. I will try my darndest to avoid the second. And I can only hope I'll be doing the third.

  2. #302
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg_Newton View Post
    The thing people seem to be forgetting is that Sheed is the exact same size as Austin, who played the "3" for us all year (and Thornton also guarded the 3 fairly often). Austin measured 6'5 in shoes with a 6'7 wingspan at one of the HS camps, while Sheed checked in at 6'4.5 with a 6'8 wingspan.

    I wasn't crazy about our 3-guard lineup this year, but as a 5-15 mpg stopgap, it wouldn't be the end of the world.
    http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/...Sulaimon-6280/

    If you measure only height, yes, but at 186 pounds, Rasheed is giving up weight to most PG's and SG's , much less SF's.

    He's only 10 pounds heavier than Quinn and 5 heavier than Seth while Rivers and Dre were both listed at 6' 4" 200, already small for the position.

    I would take Tyler's muscle over the two inches taller Rasheed.

    Coach K played Tyler 21.1 MPG even with Austin and Dre on the team, and he was chosen MVP at the banquet. Might as well have most of those minutes being as a reserve SF defender than having Tyler be an Offensively challenged starting or backup PG.

    Though this was imbedded in a Bleacher Report article and has to be taken with a grain of salt at best:

    "Walterfootball.com's scouting report on Rivers details his weaknesses as:
    A bit undersized to be a true NBA shooting guard
    Playing off the ball
    Frequently too selfish
    Handling contact
    Strength
    Toughness as a defender
    Half of those weaknesses could be improved by hitting the weight room, as handling contact, gaining strength and adding toughness as a defender would be aided by adding some muscle."


    Admittedly this is regarding NBA not college BBall but in the NCAAT the NBA ready SF will be on the team you eventually play.

  3. #303
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    Exhortation? Prognostication? Celebration?
    Sounds like a Moody Blues lyric.

  4. #304
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Nashville
    I'm not just considering height, but height plus wingspan (and thus, standing reach). In that respect, he's virtually identical to Austin - maybe even a little better, considering Austin's long neck - and far superior to any of our other guards. WRT to the 15 pound discrepancy - Austin was never listed at 200 pounds until a camp in the June following his senior year. Sheed was 185 last summer, and looks like he's put on a little muscle since then. I wouldn't think that would be the deal-breaker.

    I'd be more concerned about Amile's lack of lateral quickness and lack of an outside shot against most teams, personally, since we're just talking about a few mpg.

  5. #305
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    20 Minutes From The Heaven That Is Cameron Indoor
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg_Newton View Post
    I'm not just considering height, but height plus wingspan (and thus, standing reach). In that respect, he's virtually identical to Austin - maybe even a little better, considering Austin's long neck - and far superior to any of our other guards. WRT to the 15 pound discrepancy - Austin was never listed at 200 pounds until a camp in the June following his senior year. Sheed was 185 last summer, and looks like he's put on a little muscle since then. I wouldn't think that would be the deal-breaker.

    I'd be more concerned about Amile's lack of lateral quickness and lack of an outside shot against most teams, personally, since we're just talking about a few mpg.
    Reach definitely helps. No argument there from me. Just think weight matters with banging/positioning in the paint for rebounds. With Amile, I will go out on a limb and believe he can defend the taller college wings/Small Forwards. If he has trouble with shorter, quicker SF's, then we have Rasheed to match up with those type players.

    We are due a break here. Amile needs to sign on the dotted line and become a Dukie. Maybe he decides soon and we like his decision.

  6. #306
    I really like Amile, because [1] he's blessed with a sort of unusual game, about which I have posted several times, [2] it's possible that Andre will redshirt, in which case Duke could sure use that [talented] 10th guy, [3] he can play some right away as a combo 3/4, mostly, but not only, as a backup for Alex, and [4] he should develop into a solid-to-excellent player for the following 3, at least 2, years.

    I have nothing against Tony Parker. I've had little to say about him, perhaps unsettled a little by things he's been quoted as having said, but mostly because I'm high on Marshall's humor, attitude, and serious potential [maybe in that order]. In short, I'm fine with Tony's decision, as it means Marshall is sure to get some PT.

    Having posted in some detail above in this thread how I think Amile would fit in, PT-and-position-wise, it seems wise to consider briefly the [surely unlikely] possibility that Amile will matriculate elsewhere, breaking my poor heart in the process. Should Amile not choose Duke, K and co. will cope better than I, approximately as follows [pre-ACC]:

    PG - Cook (24), Thornton (16)
    SG/wing - Curry (30), Sulaimon (10)
    SF/wing - Murphy (26), Sulaimon (7), Thornton (5), Hairston (2)
    PF - Kelly (28), Hairston (12)
    C - MP2 (28), MP3 (9), Hairston (3)

    Now, these position designations are neither precisely precise, nor very important, and not merely because "K doesn't play positions." Rather, Duke will not be blessed with absolutely perfect-fit players at each, maybe even most, positions next season, which means it's conceivable, if barely, that K will not get #5 next April.

    My guess at PT/mpg above implies that several players will - ok, must - be used "flexibly." Thornton, for example, because he's not yet a consistent 3-bomber, but because he's a bulldog, will probably get a little, but not a lot of, time guarding much bigger SFs. Sulaimon is probably a "classic SG," but will also need to guard a bigger player for a few, not lots of, minutes. Even then, however, on O, Rasheed would be playing about the same as when playing SG, as he's a wing, for God's sake.

    Absent Amile - remember him? - Hairston might have to be the most flexible of all, particularly in limited situations where he just has to defend a little, not a lot, at the SF.

    Most important, the position designations above are imprecise because Seth, whom I have listed as playing zero mpg at PG, might actually function sometimes, a little, not a lot, as de facto PG. Thornton is listed as PG, but evidence thus far suggests he'd function quite differently at that spot than Cook. [This isn't a revelation, right?] When Rasheed is on the floor with Alex and Tyler, it might well be that he guards the opposing PG, allowing Tyler to play where he's shown to be effective, off the ball. But for those few, not lots of, minutes, I guess I'd still "list" Tyler as the PG and Rasheed as the SG. For the few, but not lots of, minutes when Josh and Ryan are the bigs, who's the 4 and who's the 5? It doesn't matter, designation-wise. And whereas Mason is listed as the 5, I'd assume we might see a few, not lots of, times in which he moves out 45 degrees, to pass into Ryan in the post. I know, I know, we all want Mason mostly to develop more smoothness and go-to moves down low. IMO, there's no contradiction between such a plan and his developing some handle and entry-passing, as a PF, into his brother, or into Ryan, who can, and should, score down low a few times per game.

    Amile, you should come to Duke. The fans here, especially on EK, are simply more informed, sensible, sweet-tempered, creative, and insightful than anywhere else in the US of A. As you will discover, when you read the responses to this post.

  7. #307
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Undisclosed
    Quote Originally Posted by jimsumner View Post
    Sounds like a Moody Blues lyric.
    Or King Crimson. Same difference, in a way.

  8. #308
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    20 Minutes From The Heaven That Is Cameron Indoor
    Quote Originally Posted by gumbomoop View Post
    I really like Amile, because [1] he's blessed with a sort of unusual game, about which I have posted several times, [2] it's possible that Andre will redshirt, in which case Duke could sure use that [talented] 10th guy, [3] he can play some right away as a combo 3/4, mostly, but not only, as a backup for Alex, and [4] he should develop into a solid-to-excellent player for the following 3, at least 2, years.

    I have nothing against Tony Parker. I've had little to say about him, perhaps unsettled a little by things he's been quoted as having said, but mostly because I'm high on Marshall's humor, attitude, and serious potential [maybe in that order]. In short, I'm fine with Tony's decision, as it means Marshall is sure to get some PT.

    Having posted in some detail above in this thread how I think Amile would fit in, PT-and-position-wise, it seems wise to consider briefly the [surely unlikely] possibility that Amile will matriculate elsewhere, breaking my poor heart in the process. Should Amile not choose Duke, K and co. will cope better than I, approximately as follows [pre-ACC]:

    PG - Cook (24), Thornton (16)
    SG/wing - Curry (30), Sulaimon (10)
    SF/wing - Murphy (26), Sulaimon (7), Thornton (5), Hairston (2)
    PF - Kelly (28), Hairston (12)
    C - MP2 (28), MP3 (9), Hairston (3)

    Now, these position designations are neither precisely precise, nor very important, and not merely because "K doesn't play positions." Rather, Duke will not be blessed with absolutely perfect-fit players at each, maybe even most, positions next season, which means it's conceivable, if barely, that K will not get #5 next April.

    My guess at PT/mpg above implies that several players will - ok, must - be used "flexibly." Thornton, for example, because he's not yet a consistent 3-bomber, but because he's a bulldog, will probably get a little, but not a lot of, time guarding much bigger SFs. Sulaimon is probably a "classic SG," but will also need to guard a bigger player for a few, not lots of, minutes. Even then, however, on O, Rasheed would be playing about the same as when playing SG, as he's a wing, for God's sake.

    Absent Amile - remember him? - Hairston might have to be the most flexible of all, particularly in limited situations where he just has to defend a little, not a lot, at the SF.

    Most important, the position designations above are imprecise because Seth, whom I have listed as playing zero mpg at PG, might actually function sometimes, a little, not a lot, as de facto PG. Thornton is listed as PG, but evidence thus far suggests he'd function quite differently at that spot than Cook. [This isn't a revelation, right?] When Rasheed is on the floor with Alex and Tyler, it might well be that he guards the opposing PG, allowing Tyler to play where he's shown to be effective, off the ball. But for those few, not lots of, minutes, I guess I'd still "list" Tyler as the PG and Rasheed as the SG. For the few, but not lots of, minutes when Josh and Ryan are the bigs, who's the 4 and who's the 5? It doesn't matter, designation-wise. And whereas Mason is listed as the 5, I'd assume we might see a few, not lots of, times in which he moves out 45 degrees, to pass into Ryan in the post. I know, I know, we all want Mason mostly to develop more smoothness and go-to moves down low. IMO, there's no contradiction between such a plan and his developing some handle and entry-passing, as a PF, into his brother, or into Ryan, who can, and should, score down low a few times per game.

    Amile, you should come to Duke. The fans here, especially on EK, are simply more informed, sensible, sweet-tempered, creative, and insightful than anywhere else in the US of A. As you will discover, when you read the responses to this post.
    Good post. Tried to give you trident points, but alas, I must spread the love a little bit more. I am really hoping Amile signs up. I love players with his build an length as they can be a terror in the College game, when they figure out how to use that God given build. Even if he did not get a ton of minutes this year, he could surely help, and like you, I feel he is the more important recruit to Duke between he and Parker. More versatile, and more likely to be able to quickly play Duke defense. Nothing against Parker, and no sour grapes, as I wish him well at UCLA.

    Telep just tweeted that all is silent in the Amile camp. Not a peep of info. Maybe he is trying to determine the most simple and low key way to announce for Duke.

  9. #309
    Though some of these guys will have moved on such as Humphrey at BC and Riice at GT, or may have to play PF for thir team this year, or be replaced by a new hot shot, here is a sample of ACC SF's that is actually smaller than the prior year

    77 192 BC Matt Humphries x-fer, not sure who will replace him
    81 225 CL Milton Jennings
    80 204 FS Okaro White
    77 206 GT Glen Rice Jr/Jason Morris 6'5" 210 so essentially same size actually a few pounds heavier
    78 175 MD Nick Faust
    78 200 UM Garius Adams with Dequan Jones 6' 8" 221 gone
    78 175 ST Scott Wood or TJ Warren
    78 220 NC PJ Hairston or Bullock 6'7" 205 in lieu of Harrison Barnes 6' 8" 229 if I recall
    78 211 VA Joe Harris
    79 209 VT Jarelle Eddie
    79 210 WF Travids McKie
    78.5 202.5 Average

    75 186 DU Rasheed Sulaimon
    (3.5) (16.5)

    So Sheed would always be the smallest in height and only be as heavy as a couple whose teams screen contiunuously for them (Wood and Faust).

    On average Sulaimon is giving up not only a year or more of ACC expereince but also 3.5" of height and 16.5 pounds whereas Dre/Austin were giving up 2.5 inches of height but only 2.5 pounds on average.

    Also comparing an April 7, 2012 weight for Rasheed versus a year old weight for the other ACC guys who have been in a college Strength & Conditioning program a full year since these weights were taken.

    Murphy on the other hand will match up favorably height wise and weight wise. So only a problem for 10-15 MPG.

  10. #310
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Nashville
    Well, Milton Jennings and Okaro White are both 6'9 PFs, so I agree that Sheed would have a tough time matching up with them...

  11. #311
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    Good post. Tried to give you trident points, but alas, I must spread the love a little bit more. I am really hoping Amile signs up. I love players with his build an length as they can be a terror in the College game, when they figure out how to use that God given build. Even if he did not get a ton of minutes this year, he could surely help, and like you, I feel he is the more important recruit to Duke between he and Parker. More versatile, and more likely to be able to quickly play Duke defense. Nothing against Parker, and no sour grapes, as I wish him well at UCLA.

    Telep just tweeted that all is silent in the Amile camp. Not a peep of info. Maybe he is trying to determine the most simple and low key way to announce for Duke.
    I join my friend Newton in admiration for gumbomoop's breakdown; I, too, tried to reward him with sporks, but could not due to the "spreading sporks" guidelines, perhaps the most arbitrary restrictions since the 5/8 rules were phased out.

    That was really quite a post, gumbomoop; if there are academic journals for hoops commentary, your analysis is worthy of being published.

    Seems to me that Amile would/will fit in well at Duke, both on and off the court. I think he realizes this, but is hesitant to take the plunge for some reason, perhaps because of some anti-Duke sentiment that floats around the basketball world. I reached the point of being indifferent to Parker's decision, but I really would like to see Amile come aboard.

  12. #312
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    NC
    Quote Originally Posted by ACCBBallFan View Post
    Though some of these guys will have moved on such as Humphrey at BC and Riice at GT, or may have to play PF for thir team this year, or be replaced by a new hot shot, here is a sample of ACC SF's that is actually smaller than the prior year

    77 192 BC Matt Humphries x-fer, not sure who will replace him
    81 225 CL Milton Jennings
    80 204 FS Okaro White
    77 206 GT Glen Rice Jr/Jason Morris 6'5" 210 so essentially same size actually a few pounds heavier
    78 175 MD Nick Faust
    78 200 UM Garius Adams with Dequan Jones 6' 8" 221 gone
    78 175 ST Scott Wood or TJ Warren
    78 220 NC PJ Hairston or Bullock 6'7" 205 in lieu of Harrison Barnes 6' 8" 229 if I recall
    78 211 VA Joe Harris
    79 209 VT Jarelle Eddie
    79 210 WF Travids McKie
    78.5 202.5 Average

    75 186 DU Rasheed Sulaimon
    (3.5) (16.5)
    The bolded players did not play SF last year, nor will they play SF next year. The SF for Clemson last year was Tanner Smith and the SF for FSU was Michael Snaer. White will likely start at PF this year (he was actually a reserve this past year) and Jennings will again start at PF for Clemson.

    The point is still accurate that Sulaimon would be at a substantial weight disadvantage against most SF. Thornton would be okay strength-wise, but he'd be really undersized height-wise (giving up at 4-6 inches and usually lacking the athleticism as well). That said, he may still be a better alternative than Sulaimon next year as the backup SF.

    Regardless, let's hope (if Dawkins does decide to redshirt) that Murphy is ready to go 30+ mpg and we get Jefferson (and he's ready to defend the SF spot).

  13. #313
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Quote Originally Posted by Kedsy View Post
    If Andre redshirts and Amile comes to Duke, I think your guess is reasonable. It would not surprise me if Amile plays 7 to 10 mpg in 2012-13, at least early in the season. I even agree with you that it would have to come at SF. I personally have some doubts as to whether he'll be able to guard the position, but when I said "I don't know how much he'll be ready to contribute his freshman year," I really meant I don't know. I'm probably not as optimistic as you are about his chances as a freshman, but Alex will be spending at least 5 to 15 minutes on the bench, and someone's going to have to take those minutes. If Andre's not around to do it, our only reasonable options would be 6'3" Rasheed, 6'1" Tyler, or Amile, if he chooses Duke. Against teams with larger SFs, if Amile could guard them adequately he would seem to be the most logical of the three options. The question remains whether he, in fact, can guard them adequately. We won't know until we know. Again assuming Andre is redshirting, by the time ACC season rolls around if Amile can defend SFs I'd expect him to continue seeing rotation minutes as probably the 8th man and if he struggles to defend SFs I'd expect his minutes to dwindle.

    I have one minor quibble with your logic, though. I've never heard that long arms make someone a good passer. Also, to the extent Amile passes, I expect it will be mostly kick-outs for threes. If Amile is playing SF with Ryan and Mason, it would seem to make sense to mostly play a three-out, two-in offense, with Amile attempting to post up and when the opponent packs it in to stop him and Mason, kicking out to Ryan, Seth, or Rasheed.
    Well there is another version ... a sort of comparative advantage situation. Even if Murphy is a better SF defender than a trimmed Josh, Murphy may be an even better PF defender compared to a still thick Josh. In that case, it is possible for Murphy to take minutes guarding the PF and leave minutes guarding the SF (for Josh ... assuming Amile does not come and Dre is not available and Rasheed is, as you fear, not fully ready to battle collegiate SFs). I don't think this is that big a deal as I suspect between Josh and Rasheed (one or the other depending upon the match up) they can cover the range of SFs. I am quibbling, admittedly, but it means we needn't think of the not-long-enough-for-the-job Josh battling big PFs but instead battling the bigger SFs, leaving big PF for the bigger Murphy. Is Murphy up to that?

  14. #314
    Dev11's Avatar
    Dev11 is offline Commissioner of Statistics, DBR Podcast
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Boston
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    And, keep in mind, this is before Rasheed has been introduced to hush puppies.
    Cookout is worth at least ten of every freshman fifteen. He's from Texas, though, so perhaps he is already used to some of the heavier items on the menu. Except the shakes. Nothing like those shakes.

  15. #315
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by gumbomoop View Post
    PG - Cook (24), Thornton (16)
    SG/wing - Curry (30), Sulaimon (10)
    SF/wing - Murphy (26), Sulaimon (7), Thornton (5), Hairston (2)
    PF - Kelly (28), Hairston (12)
    C - MP2 (28), MP3 (9), Hairston (3)
    I'm curious why you have Josh playing 3 minutes at C. Wouldn't it make more sense for Ryan to play C and Josh the PF for those minutes where Mason is resting and Marshall is not in the game for whatever reason?

  16. #316
    Quote Originally Posted by ACCBBallFan View Post
    Coach K played Tyler 21.1 MPG even with Austin and Dre on the team, and he was chosen MVP at the banquet.
    You've written this several times in various threads. What are you basing it on? Thornton was named "Best Defensive Player" and won the "Coach's Award, an honor given to the player exemplifying the commitment and values of Duke basketball while displaying overall improvement." But as far as I can tell, neither Thornton nor anyone else was chosen MVP.

  17. #317
    Quote Originally Posted by FellowTraveler View Post
    You've written this several times in various threads. What are you basing it on? Thornton was named "Best Defensive Player" and won the "Coach's Award, an honor given to the player exemplifying the commitment and values of Duke basketball while displaying overall improvement." But as far as I can tell, neither Thornton nor anyone else was chosen MVP.
    Thanks, Wasn't there and skimmed the article. Should have said Coaches Award that I read too much into.

    Does not change fact that coaches like his intesity and his PT will appoach the 21.1 MPG he garnered this year, but I will refrain from using any MVP terminology.

  18. #318
    Quote Originally Posted by ACCBBallFan View Post
    Thanks, Wasn't there and skimmed the article. Should have said Coaches Award that I read too much into.

    Does not change fact that coaches like his intesity and his PT will appoach the 21.1 MPG he garnered this year, but I will refrain from using any MVP terminology.
    I agree, though I have doubts about whether that's a good thing.

  19. #319
    Quote Originally Posted by CDu View Post
    The bolded players did not play SF last year, nor will they play SF next year. The SF for Clemson last year was Tanner Smith and the SF for FSU was Michael Snaer. White will likely start at PF this year (he was actually a reserve this past year) and Jennings will again start at PF for Clemson.

    The point is still accurate that Sulaimon would be at a substantial weight disadvantage against most SF. Thornton would be okay strength-wise, but he'd be really undersized height-wise (giving up at 4-6 inches and usually lacking the athleticism as well). That said, he may still be a better alternative than Sulaimon next year as the backup SF.

    Regardless, let's hope (if Dawkins does decide to redshirt) that Murphy is ready to go 30+ mpg and we get Jefferson (and he's ready to defend the SF spot).
    Thanks, Don't get to see Clemson on TV too much. Knew that had Booker the younger, Jennings, Young and Tanner Smith. Could not remember the 5th guy and it loosk like it was sometimes Tabb a G and sometimes Narcisse a F, possibly others, just looked at a couple box scores. I was recalling the prior year when they had Grant and Booker as the bigs but even then Jennings did not start as they had Tanner, Young and Stitt. Memory is the second thing to go at my age. What's the first? I forget.

    On FSU I was trying to factor in that they lost Bernard James, X Gibson and Jon Kreft who were all bigs plus Dulkys and Loucks and Peterson who were perimeter guys. I thought they had a JUCO transfer to play Center and Shannon to play PF relegating O. White to SF along side Ian Miller and Snaer. Hamilton plays a lot of guys so hard to tell who starts and who plays where but they all defend.

    Agree with you on other points too.

  20. #320
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh
    Quote Originally Posted by jimsumner View Post
    Sounds like a Moody Blues lyric.
    And sometimes exasperation.
    [redacted] them and the horses they rode in on.

Similar Threads

  1. New 2012 Recruiting Thread
    By Newton_14 in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 467
    Last Post: 05-14-2012, 01:50 AM
  2. Duke Basketball Recruiting getting hot-Goodman, Jefferson
    By watzone in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 01-09-2012, 01:19 PM
  3. Richard Jefferson Gives $3.5M to AZ
    By dukemomLA in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 08-20-2007, 07:08 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •