Page 19 of 24 FirstFirst ... 91718192021 ... LastLast
Results 361 to 380 of 468
  1. #361
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Philly
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    I have to confess....I just don't care much about Parker and Jefferson at this point.
    Does this make me a bad fan?

    This endless speculation and dithering by these two have worn me out.
    Neither strike me as a great talent, though perhaps that's wrong.
    Both have had more than ample opportunity to assess Duke, Coach K, the college basketball world in general, and still have not made up their mind.
    If they don't see the benefit of coming to Duke, so be it. We can move on with next year's team.

    Just my .02
    I understand this line of thinking, but I also understand the need to wait and see how the domino's fall. Its a very logical thing to do; these kids want to play right away and who can blame them. We can put our duke colored glasses on and say well its worth it to risk riding the pine for a year or two b/c you're at a great school, with the best coach, etc. but the fact is these kids are considering schools that all have good coaches and all have success putting players in the NBA (which, let's face it, is the ultimate goal for 90%+ of these kids -- NOT winning a national title in college or getting the best education, etc.). Not every kid is going to have the attitude of MP3 or Murphy, and I don't blame them for that.

    While it feels a little drawn out with Parker, its understandable to wait and see whether Mason, Robinson, Sullinger, etc. would go pro. Now he has that info and should be able to decide soon. With Amile its a bit different, we jumped in late and apparently kind of screwed his thinking up b/c he wasn't even thinking about Duke. He almost had to press the reset button and go back and re-evaluate everything.

    If this gets drawn out into the summer, then I'll be on your side, roy, but given that we just hit the NBA draft withdrawal deadline and these guys just now have ALL the information they can possible have, I think its reasonable to give them a couple weeks to digest and make a final decision.

  2. #362
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    I have to confess....I just don't care much about Parker and Jefferson at this point.
    Does this make me a bad fan?

    This endless speculation and dithering by these two have worn me out.
    Neither strike me as a great talent, though perhaps that's wrong.
    Both have had more than ample opportunity to assess Duke, Coach K, the college basketball world in general, and still have not made up their mind.
    If they don't see the benefit of coming to Duke, so be it. We can move on with next year's team.

    Just my .02
    You should be more upset with the coverage recruits get than with their decision process. Years ago you wouldn't have been frustrated with recruits decisons because you wouldn't have known much about them or their timetable to decide where to go to school.

    Lots of everyday students go back and forth on lots of different things and it doesn't bother you because you know nothng about it.

  3. #363
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxAMillion View Post
    You should be more upset with the coverage recruits get than with their decision process. Years ago you wouldn't have been frustrated with recruits decisons because you wouldn't have known much about them or their timetable to decide where to go to school.

    Lots of everyday students go back and forth on lots of different things and it doesn't bother you because you know nothng about it.
    I agree that fans should consider the process to be upsetting rather than the indecisiveness of recruits. The difficulty in weighing the relative merits of schools recruiting the top 150 or so basketball recruits is probably very similar to what top students face as they try to decide among the academically-excellent schools willing to accept them. Most, if not all, of the current and former Duke students on this board can likely relate to this to some degree, as there were probably other respected colleges, in addition to Duke, that were hoping to bring you on board as a student. My wife had to choose between Yale and Duke for medical school, which I would imagine is similar to a basketball recruit having to choose between UNC and Duke. It's an enviable position to be in, but that doesn't mean the decision is easy.

  4. #364
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Denver
    If you're concerned that a kid hasn't made his college decision before May of his senior year, you need a serious reality check. Just because we start reading about these kids when they are sophomores and juniors in high school (the years that many of us began visiting colleges and had no clue what we were looking for in schools) doesn't mean they have to become stale when they are seniors. Heck, most any of us have seen are highlight reels or AAU-style competitions, neither of which project how a player will perform in college at all. If you don't believe me, go watch some old Olek Czyz high school highlights. (Spoiler: they're awesome)

    Consider, also, that once they come to Duke and start playing (or anywhere else), all of their recruiting news is history. I don't think there are many analysts who take a look back at kids 2 or 3 years into college and re-evaluate what they saw in high school. Does it matter that Josh McRoberts was a better prospect than Tyler Hansborough when they were 17? Not a chance. I actually wish we visited it more often. People around here like to say that scout.com does a better job than rivals.com at evaluating prospects, but without proof other than general perception. I'd propose that you compare their rankings of the top 30 or 40 guys each year to those guys' eventual draft spot down the road.

    If you can get 'sick' of hearing about a guy and don't care anymore about him, consider the similar thought process that goes through NBA GMs' minds as it relates to college seniors. Many GMs, if you believe what NBA draft analysts tell you, might have ignored prospects like Kyle Singler or Jon Scheyer because they were 'sick' of seeing them. Mason Plumlee is headed this way, too, in that he was considered a lottery pick after his lackluster freshman campaign and will likely not crack the lottery (my guess, but not hard to envision him in the 20-25 range) after a year in which he may well average a double-double and be in the hunt for All-ACC First Team.

    My point, I suppose, is that people around here get worked up over prospects when they are really young and grow tired of them before they're even playing meaningful games in college. I mean, Quinn Cook was barely part of the rotation this year and we've been talking about him for 3 years now! Lighten up. The kids will choose their schools and we can't do anything about it except for the guys that end up in our shade of blue.

    Go DUKE

  5. #365
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    New York City
    Quote Originally Posted by Dev11 View Post
    If you're concerned that a kid hasn't made his college decision before May of his senior year, you need a serious reality check. Just because we start reading about these kids when they are sophomores and juniors in high school (the years that many of us began visiting colleges and had no clue what we were looking for in schools) doesn't mean they have to become stale when they are seniors. Heck, most any of us have seen are highlight reels or AAU-style competitions, neither of which project how a player will perform in college at all. If you don't believe me, go watch some old Olek Czyz high school highlights. (Spoiler: they're awesome)

    Consider, also, that once they come to Duke and start playing (or anywhere else), all of their recruiting news is history. I don't think there are many analysts who take a look back at kids 2 or 3 years into college and re-evaluate what they saw in high school. Does it matter that Josh McRoberts was a better prospect than Tyler Hansborough when they were 17? Not a chance. I actually wish we visited it more often. People around here like to say that scout.com does a better job than rivals.com at evaluating prospects, but without proof other than general perception. I'd propose that you compare their rankings of the top 30 or 40 guys each year to those guys' eventual draft spot down the road.

    If you can get 'sick' of hearing about a guy and don't care anymore about him, consider the similar thought process that goes through NBA GMs' minds as it relates to college seniors. Many GMs, if you believe what NBA draft analysts tell you, might have ignored prospects like Kyle Singler or Jon Scheyer because they were 'sick' of seeing them. Mason Plumlee is headed this way, too, in that he was considered a lottery pick after his lackluster freshman campaign and will likely not crack the lottery (my guess, but not hard to envision him in the 20-25 range) after a year in which he may well average a double-double and be in the hunt for All-ACC First Team.

    My point, I suppose, is that people around here get worked up over prospects when they are really young and grow tired of them before they're even playing meaningful games in college. I mean, Quinn Cook was barely part of the rotation this year and we've been talking about him for 3 years now! Lighten up. The kids will choose their schools and we can't do anything about it except for the guys that end up in our shade of blue.

    Go DUKE
    Here's everything you need to know about recruiting rankings: In the 2007 class, ESPNU ranked Taylor King (16) above Blake Griffin (18). Amile Jefferson and Tony Parker are currently ranked 25 and 26, respectively. Are they more Taylor King or Blake Griffin, or somewhere in between? Recruiting is somewhat of a roll of the dice.

    Personally, think we need one of those guys for the 2013-2014 season when Mason and Ryan are gone rahter than next season when I think our frontcourt will be relatively deep - I think Mason and Ryan should be expected to play a combined 60 minutes a game. The other 20 minutes at the 4/5 will be distributed between Josh and Alex - and 10 minutes each is not expecting too much. If Marshall is ready to contribute next year, then we'll be even deeper. If Jefferson and Parker are looking for the place where they'll get the most minutes as freshman, they won't go to Duke. If they are willing to be reserves and grow into starting roles (they'll both have that opportunity as sophomores) then they should consider Duke very strongly.
    Singler is IRON

    I STILL GOT IT! -- Ryan Kelly, March 2, 2013

  6. #366
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia
    Quote Originally Posted by mr. synellinden View Post
    Here's everything you need to know about recruiting rankings: In the 2007 class, ESPNU ranked Taylor King (16) above Blake Griffin (18).
    Well, in the RSCI (a composite of many recruiting rankings, although I'm not sure ESPNU was one of them since it isn't really a well-respected service, or at least it wasn't then), Griffin was ranked #16 and King #24. But that's not really relevant, as Griffin ended up being the #1 pick in the NBA draft two years later. An even better way to make your point would probably be Derrick Williams, who was the #100 recruit in 2009 and ended up the #2 pick in the NBA draft two years later.

    But just because recruiting services miss on some guys doesn't mean that's "everything you need to know" about them. A lot more top 10 kids are ready to contribute to their college teams early in their career than kids outside the top 10. A lot more top 10 kids will end up in the League than kids outside the top 10. A few exceptions every now and again does not disprove this.

  7. #367
    Quote Originally Posted by Dev11 View Post
    I mean, Quinn Cook was barely part of the rotation this year and we've been talking about him for 3 years now! Lighten up. The kids will choose their schools and we can't do anything about it except for the guys that end up in our shade of blue.

    Go DUKE
    Totally agree that the changes in the college game and especially the rise of the internet and the recruiting-scoop driven industry that has grown in recent years have really changed the way we deal with recruiting, and probably not for the better-- at least not better for our collective digestion.

    When I was at Duke, I was talking with a friend who was a good New York City high school basketball player (I believe he lettered at Tufts) the summer after my freshman year who told me we were about to get a superb point guard from New Jersey who turned out to be Bobby Hurley. I had never heard of him, and frankly, this was my first time even hearing about a recruit or being aware of the process through which we obtained new players. Since my buddy had risen through the NYC hs basketball ranks (riverside church, etc.), I take it he was much more aware of local hs talent than the average bear.

    Today, obviously, I (who barely cracked the rotation in Central Campus pick-up games) would probably have been hearing about Bobby for years and agonizing over his decision, what it would mean to the team and our rivals, etc. I certainly wouldn't have been hearing his name for the first time when he was already committed and may have already been on campus.

  8. #368
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    New York City
    Quote Originally Posted by Kedsy View Post
    Well, in the RSCI (a composite of many recruiting rankings, although I'm not sure ESPNU was one of them since it isn't really a well-respected service, or at least it wasn't then), Griffin was ranked #16 and King #24. But that's not really relevant, as Griffin ended up being the #1 pick in the NBA draft two years later. An even better way to make your point would probably be Derrick Williams, who was the #100 recruit in 2009 and ended up the #2 pick in the NBA draft two years later.

    But just because recruiting services miss on some guys doesn't mean that's "everything you need to know" about them. A lot more top 10 kids are ready to contribute to their college teams early in their career than kids outside the top 10. A lot more top 10 kids will end up in the League than kids outside the top 10. A few exceptions every now and again does not disprove this.
    My point was that when it comes to guys who are not consensus top 10 players, you really don't know how much they are going to contribute as freshmen. More likely than not, they aren't impact players in their first year. I feel confident that Shabazz is going to be an All-American level player as a freshman. I don't think Jefferson or Parker will - and may never reach that level. So the angst about how much we need a Parker or a Jefferson next year seems kind of silly to me. I think we'll need them more as sophomores and upperclassmen if they stay that long - as for next year, we already have 10 guys that should have a chance to compete for a lot of playing time. Whereas I'm sure Shabazz would have started for us, I don't think any of the other guys considering us would be likely to play meaningful minutes next season. Think of Silent G, Ryan Kelly, and Lance Thomas, all of whom were similarly ranked, and how much they played as freshmen.
    Singler is IRON

    I STILL GOT IT! -- Ryan Kelly, March 2, 2013

  9. #369
    Quote Originally Posted by mr. synellinden View Post
    My point was that when it comes to guys who are not consensus top 10 players, you really don't know how much they are going to contribute as freshmen. More likely than not, they aren't impact players in their first year. I feel confident that Shabazz is going to be an All-American level player as a freshman. I don't think Jefferson or Parker will - and may never reach that level. So the angst about how much we need a Parker or a Jefferson next year seems kind of silly to me. I think we'll need them more as sophomores and upperclassmen if they stay that long - as for next year, we already have 10 guys that should have a chance to compete for a lot of playing time. Whereas I'm sure Shabazz would have started for us, I don't think any of the other guys considering us would be likely to play meaningful minutes next season. Think of Silent G, Ryan Kelly, and Lance Thomas, all of whom were similarly ranked, and how much they played as freshmen.
    Agree with your post, save one thing: I count 11 guys who will compete for time. It's possible you have one particular player you think is obviously the last guy, but honestly, I don't. I do assume K will gradually move toward a 9-man rotation by ACC-time, but I'm thinking even the last 2 guys will still get scattered minutes late into the season. And although I'm certain those last 2 will not include Mason, Ryan, or Seth, I'm not sure who they'll be.

    Purely for thread relevance, I'll just guess that Rasheed won't fall to end of bench, either.

  10. #370
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia
    Quote Originally Posted by mr. synellinden View Post
    My point was that when it comes to guys who are not consensus top 10 players, you really don't know how much they are going to contribute as freshmen. More likely than not, they aren't impact players in their first year. I feel confident that Shabazz is going to be an All-American level player as a freshman. I don't think Jefferson or Parker will - and may never reach that level. So the angst about how much we need a Parker or a Jefferson next year seems kind of silly to me. I think we'll need them more as sophomores and upperclassmen if they stay that long - as for next year, we already have 10 guys that should have a chance to compete for a lot of playing time. Whereas I'm sure Shabazz would have started for us, I don't think any of the other guys considering us would be likely to play meaningful minutes next season. Think of Silent G, Ryan Kelly, and Lance Thomas, all of whom were similarly ranked, and how much they played as freshmen.
    I agree with pretty much everything you say here. Although I will note that Lance Thomas started 18 games as a freshman and played 15 mpg. I expect Parker would probably also play around 15 mpg as a freshman, if he comes to Duke. I wouldn't expect Jefferson to get more than mop up minutes in 2012-13. I would expect both guys to be ready to be contributors in 2013-14.

  11. #371
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Denver
    Quote Originally Posted by trinity92 View Post
    Totally agree that the changes in the college game and especially the rise of the internet and the recruiting-scoop driven industry that has grown in recent years have really changed the way we deal with recruiting, and probably not for the better-- at least not better for our collective digestion.

    When I was at Duke, I was talking with a friend who was a good New York City high school basketball player (I believe he lettered at Tufts) the summer after my freshman year who told me we were about to get a superb point guard from New Jersey who turned out to be Bobby Hurley. I had never heard of him, and frankly, this was my first time even hearing about a recruit or being aware of the process through which we obtained new players. Since my buddy had risen through the NYC hs basketball ranks (riverside church, etc.), I take it he was much more aware of local hs talent than the average bear.

    Today, obviously, I (who barely cracked the rotation in Central Campus pick-up games) would probably have been hearing about Bobby for years and agonizing over his decision, what it would mean to the team and our rivals, etc. I certainly wouldn't have been hearing his name for the first time when he was already committed and may have already been on campus.
    I recall a similar story where a D-3 coach saw Wojo in a little high school game and inquired about him, only to discover that he had already committed to Duke (note this is 1994). It was only 15 years later that hyped recruits were Skyping their new coaches on national tv.

  12. #372
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Durham

    Academics

    This is a nice interview with K that I found on Airowe's twitter feed LINK

    K just oozes wisdom. The response that caught my eye was concerning academics.

    “Yeah we can’t go after every one-and-done guy because a lot of the guys and they are great players and great kids, but school isn’t as important. A lot of those guys a number of years ago didn’t have to go to college. Dwight Howard. Kobe Bryant. LeBron James. Kids are…it’s not even going one year. They are going to spend maybe six-seven months. Sometimes…we have a great school, but it’s not as attractive as going someplace else, so we have to be careful with who we get involved with because it could be a monumental waste of time for us.”

    Although I think we all realize this, I tend to forget how big a role our academic threshold plays in our recruiting strategy. Very often I hear folks question K's judgment regarding why he didn't get involved with some top 20 hotshot recruit. In our minds, it's just about their highlight reels and rankings, but our coaches need to take into account a very complex amalgam of data when considering a recruit. Whereas at many schools academics can be an afterthought ("let's just get him signed and then we'll worry about getting him to qualify academically"), for K and company it sounds like academics are right at the forefront before they even start after a recruit. The pool they subsequently work with is smaller than what most other schools work with. Then, naturally, some academically adequate prospects are just not interested in Duke. This happens for all schools, even (gasp) the almighty KY.

    I think K's intimation that one-and-dones more often than not will want to find a school they can easily coast through rather than encounter even a modicum of rigor makes sense. If a big pay day ain't that far away, it makes sense to go the path of least resistance, particularly if the basketball is just as excellent as it might be in Durham.

    Recruiting is not easy. I'd say K's doing a pretty decent job.

  13. #373
    Mods, I wasn't sure where to put this so please move (or remove).

    I belong to another Duke board and there was a discussion on there about Duke LAX player Myles Jones.
    Several people posted on there that he will be a walk-on with the team next year?

    I am actually intrigued to know more about this if true. I haven't heard about this anywhere else.

    If hope this isn't considered rumor mongering, but if mods feel that it is, please remove. That is definitely not my intent - just trying to find out more info on Myles and if we have a new player on the team.

  14. #374
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    20 Minutes From The Heaven That Is Cameron Indoor
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGirl4ever View Post
    Mods, I wasn't sure where to put this so please move (or remove).

    I belong to another Duke board and there was a discussion on there about Duke LAX player Myles Jones.
    Several people posted on there that he will be a walk-on with the team next year?

    I am actually intrigued to know more about this if true. I haven't heard about this anywhere else.

    If hope this isn't considered rumor mongering, but if mods feel that it is, please remove. That is definitely not my intent - just trying to find out more info on Myles and if we have a new player on the team.
    If you are stating Jones may be a walkon to the basketball team (which I think you are) then this thread is fine for your post. It's not rumor mongering either. So, what kind of basketball player was Jones in high school?

    Wainstein Report Page 19 Section G:
    In men’s basketball, academic counselor Burgess McSwain (“McSwain”) and
    her successor Wayne Walden routinely called Crowder to arrange classes for their
    players.
    Roy Williams Of Nazareth had no knowledge however. He is sinless.

  15. #375
    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    If you are stating Jones may be a walkon to the basketball team (which I think you are) then this thread is fine for your post. It's not rumor mongering either. So, what kind of basketball player was Jones in high school?
    Thank you Newton. I don't want to do anything that doesn't follow the rules. I am a rule follower.
    The only thing I have read about Jones is that he played basketball in high school and seems to be pretty darn athletic.

    I've been trying to search more about him and as of now, this is what I found for HS.

    http://www.maxpreps.com/athletes/9W6...yles-jones.htm

    EDIT - Also found this: http://www.newenglandrecruitingrepor...Basketball.php
    ^This article makes it sound as though he's no longer coming to Duke for LAX and just wants to play basketball somewhere else. Not sure how accurate it is.
    Last edited by DukeGirl4ever; 04-17-2012 at 09:49 PM.

  16. #376
    I should probably wait before posting.

    This has the best info in terms of bball and Duke:
    http://www.newenglandrecruitingrepor...-After-All.php

  17. #377
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    20 Minutes From The Heaven That Is Cameron Indoor
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGirl4ever View Post
    Thank you Newton. I don't want to do anything that doesn't follow the rules. I am a rule follower.
    The only thing I have read about Jones is that he played basketball in high school and seems to be pretty darn athletic.

    I've been trying to search more about him and as of now, this is what I found for HS.

    http://www.maxpreps.com/athletes/9W6...yles-jones.htm

    EDIT - Also found this: http://www.newenglandrecruitingrepor...Basketball.php
    ^This article makes it sound as though he's no longer coming to Duke for LAX and just wants to play basketball somewhere else. Not sure how accurate it is.
    Interesting. He would solve the problem of Murphy having someone to go against in practice. The problem is, from reading that 2nd link, I get the impression he is abandoning the Lacrosse offer at Duke and is now on the open market as a basketball recruit.

    Wainstein Report Page 19 Section G:
    In men’s basketball, academic counselor Burgess McSwain (“McSwain”) and
    her successor Wayne Walden routinely called Crowder to arrange classes for their
    players.
    Roy Williams Of Nazareth had no knowledge however. He is sinless.

  18. #378
    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    Interesting. He would solve the problem of Murphy having someone to go against in practice. The problem is, from reading that 2nd link, I get the impression he is abandoning the Lacrosse offer at Duke and is now on the open market as a basketball recruit.
    I thought the same thing! He would be a person to challenge Murph at practice and help with his development.
    The 3rd link I posted shows he recommitted to Duke and plans to talk to the coaches in the fall about walking on.

  19. #379
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    20 Minutes From The Heaven That Is Cameron Indoor
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGirl4ever View Post
    I should probably wait before posting.

    This has the best info in terms of bball and Duke:
    http://www.newenglandrecruitingrepor...-After-All.php
    Ok, this makes more sense. So he is definately attending Duke on a Lacrosse scholly. Good deal. K certainly has plenty of room for him as you can carry as many walkons as you want (see UNC). It was actually weird this year seeing only one walkon in Todd on the team.

    I would actually be surprised if K does not take him as a walkon, if nothing else for having a good practice partner for Murphy. Something to watch for. Thanks for sharing!

    Wainstein Report Page 19 Section G:
    In men’s basketball, academic counselor Burgess McSwain (“McSwain”) and
    her successor Wayne Walden routinely called Crowder to arrange classes for their
    players.
    Roy Williams Of Nazareth had no knowledge however. He is sinless.

  20. #380
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO

    One Problem with the NCAA Rules....

    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    Ok, this makes more sense. So he is definately attending Duke on a Lacrosse scholly. Good deal. K certainly has plenty of room for him as you can carry as many walkons as you want (see UNC). It was actually weird this year seeing only one walkon in Todd on the team.

    I would actually be surprised if K does not take him as a walkon, if nothing else for having a good practice partner for Murphy. Something to watch for. Thanks for sharing!
    If you are on a LAX scholarship but playing on the basketball team, I believe the scholarship counts against the basketball limit of 13 scholarships. It may not be a problem if he can play. And it is possible we may have a scholarship or two available.


    From the NCAA Division I Manual:

    15.5.10.2 Basketball. A counter [i.e., a scholarship athlete -- sage] who practices or competes in basketball and one or more other sports (other than football) shall be counted in basketball.
    sagegrouse

Similar Threads

  1. 2012 recruiting thread
    By Osiagledknarf in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 3572
    Last Post: 03-13-2012, 08:25 PM
  2. The Official Coach K for 2012 ACC COY Thread
    By wgl1228 in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 68
    Last Post: 03-01-2012, 08:39 AM
  3. 2012 Football Recruiting Class Question
    By duke blue brewcrew in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 08-30-2011, 07:46 AM
  4. 2012 Recruiting: Jarnell Stokes
    By MulletMan in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 05-09-2011, 11:47 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •