South/Atlanta region discussion (Kentucky #1)

[uh_no]

As I've heard Coach K say, just concentrate on the first 4-team tournament. That's all that matters. If you get past that, then look at the next 4-team tournament... etc...

You never have to beat all 67 teams to get the NC

GO DUKE!!!

I could go for a 67 game round robin for the title...heck, it'd still be shorter than the NBA playoff-apalooza that lasts 4 months.

[sporthenry]

duke and syracuse: two most winningest active coaches...and the coaches of the national team
louisville and marquette with memphis: C-usa rematches
duke and fsu: part 4...
kentucky and memphis: calipari rematch
temple vs any big east team: prove they belong in the big east

there are potential stories everywhere.

He also left off St. Louis in the UNC pool which would be a rematch of Majerus who ousted UNC in 1998 F4. Committee missed a big subplot there.

College basketball just has so many coaches that have been around forever, former players sitting on benches, and the same programs consistently there that it is inevitable that some story exists.

[FerryFor50]

He also left off St. Louis in the UNC pool which would be a rematch of Majerus who ousted UNC in 1998 F4. Committee missed a big subplot there.

College basketball just has so many coaches that have been around forever, former players sitting on benches, and the same programs consistently there that it is inevitable that some story exists.

Also another weak subplot.

Tell me what would get better ratings... UNC/Creighton or UNC/St Louis?

You'll hear all about it when the announcers keep harping on McDermott vs Barnes, should Creighton and UNC advance.

[A-Tex Devil]

Thoughts:

As good a second round possibility as we could ask for. Not a guarantee but I Like this 7-10 game better than the others. BPI didn't have either Notre Dame or Xavier in the tourney.

Baylor is as talented as any team in the country not named UNC or Kentucky, but led by a far, far inferior coach. Unfortunately the dimwitted Scott Drew has decided to let them play more man to man defense on occasion and that was one of the big reasons they beat KU. He went back to a ton of wannabe 'Cuse zone against Mizzou and lost. If we get them in the Sweet 16, they could definitely out-talent us like Carolina did last week but I like our chances. This Baylor team isn't as cohesive a unit as the ome we beat in 2010. Although neither are we.

Look, if we get to Kentucky, that's a bad matchup for us. But stranger things have happened, obviously.

[sporthenry]

Also another weak subplot.

Tell me what would get better ratings... UNC/Creighton or UNC/St Louis?

You'll hear all about it when the announcers keep harping on McDermott vs Barnes, should Creighton and UNC advance.

How is that a weak subplot? Majerus beat UNC in a F4 game? I guarantee you many UNC fans remember that. A much bigger subplot than Duke/Baylor or even MSU/Florida with Florida as a 7 seed. MSU could have subplots with Uconn who they beat in F4 2009, Duke who they've had battles with in the tournament, etc. I don't know anyone who is going to tune in to see Barnes play a HS teammate. Nobody cares that much. Yes, when it gets to the E8 and beyond, people want to see good matchups with the blue bloods but those will happen regardless. Whether its Duke/UK, Duke/MSU, Duke/KU, Duke/Cuse, UK/UNC, UNC/MSU.

[Sgt. Dingleberry]

Unfortunately the dimwitted Scott Drew

What is his reputation like down there? I know we all had a ton of respect for him after playing him in the 2010 tourney. Then I started hearing some not-so-flattering things about him through the grapevine...I have also watched some Bears' games and he does not seem to command a lot of respect from some of his kids.

[FerryFor50]

How is that a weak subplot? Majerus beat UNC in a F4 game? I guarantee you many UNC fans remember that. A much bigger subplot than Duke/Baylor or even MSU/Florida with Florida as a 7 seed. MSU could have subplots with Uconn who they beat in F4 2009, Duke who they've had battles with in the tournament, etc.

How many One Shining Moment clips have you seen from that game?

Now... UNC/Georgetown...

I'm not saying that what I'm selling is based in fact. But doesn't it seem odd to you that the #1 overall seed gets the #2 overall #2 seed, while the #3 overall seed gets Kansas (not sure where they rank)...

If they were going by numbers, you'd see different brackets at 1/2.

[ncexnyc]

How is that a weak subplot? Majerus beat UNC in a F4 game? I guarantee you many UNC fans remember that. A much bigger subplot than Duke/Baylor or even MSU/Florida with Florida as a 7 seed. MSU could have subplots with Uconn who they beat in F4 2009, Duke who they've had battles with in the tournament, etc. I don't know anyone who is going to tune in to see Barnes play a HS teammate. Nobody cares that much. Yes, when it gets to the E8 and beyond, people want to see good matchups with the blue bloods but those will happen regardless. Whether its Duke/UK, Duke/MSU, Duke/KU, Duke/Cuse, UK/UNC, UNC/MSU.

I can assure you that UNC fans have terrible memories. My co-workers can't seem to recall last year's drubbing in the ACC Tourney we gave them and that was only last year. When I mention Weber State they ask me why I'm talking about my grill.

[FerryFor50]

I can assure you that UNC fans have terrible memories. My co-workers can't seem to recall last year's drubbing in the ACC Tourney we gave them and that was only last year. When I mention Weber State they ask me why I'm talking about my grill.

Ha!

Harold "the show" Arceneaux!

[sporthenry]

How many One Shining Moment clips have you seen from that game?

Now... UNC/Georgetown...

I'm not saying that what I'm selling is based in fact. But doesn't it seem odd to you that the #1 overall seed gets the #2 overall #2 seed, while the #3 overall seed gets Kansas (not sure where they rank)...

If they were going by numbers, you'd see different brackets at 1/2.

After thinking about how they have done the brackets, no it doesn't seem that strange. Lets see, UK is the overall #1 seed and gets the South for regional preference. Syracuse is #2 so they get the East. UNC is #3 so they get the Mid-West and MSU goes out West. KU is the #1 2 seed so they get Mid-West, Duke is #2 2 seed so they get the South, OSU is #3 so they get the East, and Mizzou gets the West. Then follow general guidelines for seeding 1-4 and you get these brackets.

[FerryFor50]

After thinking about how they have done the brackets, no it doesn't seem that strange. Lets see, UK is the overall #1 seed and gets the South for regional preference. Syracuse is #2 so they get the East. UNC is #3 so they get the Mid-West and MSU goes out West. KU is the #1 2 seed so they get Mid-West, Duke is #2 2 seed so they get the South, OSU is #3 so they get the East, and Mizzou gets the West. Then follow general guidelines for seeding 1-4 and you get these brackets.

Fair enough. But it seems to happen every year.

Not sure how Georgetown ends out in the MidWest, while FSU is in the East, Baylor is in the South and Marquette is in the West.

Wouldn't it make more sense to have FSU in the South, Georgetown in the East, Baylor in the Midwest and Marquette in the West?

[A-Tex Devil]

What is his reputation like down there? I know we all had a ton of respect for him after playing him in the 2010 tourney. Then I started hearing some not-so-flattering things about him through the grapevine...I have also watched some Bears' games and he does not seem to command a lot of respect from some of his kids.

He took a job no one would touch and turned the program around with strong recruiting and really reaching out to the Baylor community, students and alumni, to increase support. He definitely has done a ton of good and soiled be commended for resurrecting a program and then taking it to unheard of levels.

That said, he has been Calipari-esquire in recruiting tactics and has burned bridges with other coaches in the Big XII. It is eyebrow raising, if not downright suspicious, how he has drawn so much 5 star talent to Baylor (with more coming) considering the location, Baylor's lack of tradition, and his system.

As for his system... It's a combination of letting the guys out talent people on the offensive end and forcing them to play a zone they don't ever really seem to understand on the defensive end. This Baylor team (and last year's) would excel at man to man, weak side help defense with all the shot blockers they have had. Instead Drew has them playing a zone with because "that's what he does". If we run into them, we need to pray that the light that came on against KU doesn't against us.

[uh_no]

Fair enough. But it seems to happen every year.

Mostly because all the good teams are in the east...so the worst 1 and 2 seeds end up out west, and the top 3 1 and 2 seeds get packed into the 3 more eastern brackets. Its more a consequence of the western half of the US being so down in basketball than anything.

[Bluedog]

After thinking about how they have done the brackets, no it doesn't seem that strange. Lets see, UK is the overall #1 seed and gets the South for regional preference. Syracuse is #2 so they get the East. UNC is #3 so they get the Mid-West and MSU goes out West. KU is the #1 2 seed so they get Mid-West, Duke is #2 2 seed so they get the South, OSU is #3 so they get the East, and Mizzou gets the West. Then follow general guidelines for seeding 1-4 and you get these brackets.

Yep, seems like if the committee had had OSU as #6 overall and Duke as #7, we'd have gone to the East while OSU would go south since it's closer to them as well (unless they think Boston is a more "natural geographic fit" for OSU).

[sporthenry]

Just look at Duke, they could have subplots with Michigan from last year or 1992. Uconn in 1999. MSU in 2005. KU in 2003. Florida in 2000. Indiana in 2002. VCU in 2007. Louisville in 1986. WVU, Baylor, Purdue, and Cal would all be rematches of 2010. And that doesn't even include other subplots like Brey being a disciple. Amaker with his Duke ties. Paulus on OSU's bench. And I'm sure you could do more of one degree of Mike Krzyzewski in the tournament especially if you consider things like Duke went after Greg Echenique back in the day.

[FerryFor50]

Just look at Duke, they could have subplots with Michigan from last year or 1992. Uconn in 1999. MSU in 2005. KU in 2003. Florida in 2000. Indiana in 2002. VCU in 2007. Louisville in 1986. WVU, Baylor, Purdue, and Cal would all be rematches of 2010. And that doesn't even include other subplots like Brey being a disciple. Amaker with his Duke ties. Paulus on OSU's bench. And I'm sure you could do more of one degree of Mike Krzyzewski in the tournament especially if you consider things like Duke went after Greg Echenique back in the day.

Fair points...

I think I'm just still trying to wrap my head around how Duke and Kentucky got the hardest draw.

[sporthenry]

Fair enough. But it seems to happen every year.

Not sure how Georgetown ends out in the MidWest, while FSU is in the East, Baylor is in the South and Marquette is in the West.

Wouldn't it make more sense to have FSU in the South, Georgetown in the East, Baylor in the Midwest and Marquette in the West?

Well FSU can't be in the South b/c not only would it violate the first 3 teams of a conference in the same bracket but nobody wants to see conference rematches until the regional finals so I agree with the NCAA in that rule. Similarly, Baylor can't be in KU or Mizzou's bracket. Georgetown can't be with Syracuse.

There are a ton of ways they could have placed the top 4, we drew the worst one as far as I'm concerned but I understand why it happened. Only the top 2 teams get regional preference and from a Duke fan (even though it is very improbably the 1-2 seeds all meet in the E8), I would much rather be out West with Marquette and MSU or in the Midwest vs. Georgetown.

[FerryFor50]

Well FSU can't be in the South b/c not only would it violate the first 3 teams of a conference in the same bracket but nobody wants to see conference rematches until the regional finals so I agree with the NCAA in that rule. Similarly, Baylor can't be in KU or Mizzou's bracket. Georgetown can't be with Syracuse.

There are a ton of ways they could have placed the top 4, we drew the worst one as far as I'm concerned but I understand why it happened. Only the top 2 teams get regional preference and from a Duke fan (even though it is very improbably the 1-2 seeds all meet in the E8), I would much rather be out West with Marquette and MSU or in the Midwest vs. Georgetown.

So... how do we give pitchforks? Because I'd shoot one your way. You have way more knowledge about the seeding process than I do and deserve a pitchfork for your efforts!

[sporthenry]

So... how do we give pitchforks? Because I'd shoot one your way. You have way more knowledge about the seeding process than I do and deserve a pitchfork for your efforts!

I enjoy the whole process so I kinda became a student of it all and its fun to put yourself in that room so figured I'd publish the only rationale that makes sense from the committee that got this bracket.

All that said, we had what 5 analysts say we'd be the first 1-2 seed to go down. No F4 predictions although as I projected FSU was a hot selection, which becomes a death certificate for a loss versus Cincy. We certainly have the bulletin board material and relatively easy schedule to get to the E8, see who is waiting for us and go from there. It is nice to know we can fly under the radar much like 2010.

[TexHawk]

He took a job no one would touch and turned the program around with strong recruiting and really reaching out to the Baylor community, students and alumni, to increase support. He definitely has done a ton of good and soiled be commended for resurrecting a program and then taking it to unheard of levels.

That said, he has been Calipari-esquire in recruiting tactics and has burned bridges with other coaches in the Big XII. It is eyebrow raising, if not downright suspicious, how he has drawn so much 5 star talent to Baylor (with more coming) considering the location, Baylor's lack of tradition, and his system.

As for his system... It's a combination of letting the guys out talent people on the offensive end and forcing them to play a zone they don't ever really seem to understand on the defensive end. This Baylor team (and last year's) would excel at man to man, weak side help defense with all the shot blockers they have had. Instead Drew has them playing a zone with because "that's what he does". If we run into them, we need to pray that the light that came on against KU doesn't against us.

Drew has basically fire-bombed those bridges in the Big 12. Bill Self and Rick Barnes, two of the nicest guys around off-the-court, refuse to speak to him. Not sure where Barnes's beef is, but with Self, Drew phoned KU-commit Dwight Lewis and lied to him about KU's graduation rate. Lewis de-committed from KU shortly after. (Turned out to be a blessing in disguise, as KU picked up Brandon Rush late.) He also pulls his team off the court and into the tunnel during pre-game introductions on the road. At best that's just weird, at worst it's disrespectful.

As far as coaching skills, the zone is hilarious, but that's not his only flaw. At times his team will just be happy chucking threes and he will do nothing to stop them. In the KU/Baylor game in Waco in February, Quincy Miller and Perry Jones started very well inside, and they went up by 8-9 points. They started drifting to the perimeter, and KU went on a ridiculous 34-4 run. They lead was 25+ before some garbage buckets made it more respectable.