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Thread: Perspective

  1. #1

    Perspective

    I just thought it useful to point out two specific examples from tonight that might help provide a little perspective about our team and season so far.

    Missouri (#3) lost at home by 10 to a decent but unranked K-State team. G-Town (#9) lost to an unranked Seton Hall team on the road by almost 20. (Also, as I write this Michigan (#11) is losing to a very mediocre Northwestern team at the half by 7).

    What I've often noticed in discussions about Duke (and not just this year, but over the past several) is that we fans, particularly after a loss, tend to magnify the flaws of our team while simultaneously magnifying the perceived dominance of other teams in comparison. "We'll never be able to compete with teams a,b,c becasue of fatal flaws x,y,z with our team." However, what we're really comparing our team against is, for the most part, some mythical dominant team that doesn't really exist. Many assume that there are 10 UNLV circa-1990 teams out there just waiting to eat our lunch in the tourney if we don't somehow fix all the things perceived as hopelessly wrong.

    Syracuse and Kentucky this year notwithstanding, I don't see any teams that are better than Duke. The field is pretty much open for teams 3-15 or even 20. And even Syracuse and Kentucky have flaws (rebounding and youth respectively) that can be exploited in the right circumstances and match-ups.

    All of this is to say that, whatever happens on Thursday, some perspective is in order as tonight's examples show. This team may (or may not) make a great run in the Touney. As it often does, it will depend greatly on match-ups and even a little luck. In the meantime, let's enjoy the ride! Go Duke!

  2. #2
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    Uh-oh.

    Usually when someone starts a thread called "perspective," there is an avalanche of posts that lack any perspective, berating the OP for having some perspective.

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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philadukie View Post
    I just thought it useful to point out two specific examples from tonight that might help provide a little perspective about our team and season so far.

    Missouri (#3) lost at home by 10 to a decent but unranked K-State team. G-Town (#9) lost to an unranked Seton Hall team on the road by almost 20. (Also, as I write this Michigan (#11) is losing to a very mediocre Northwestern team at the half by 7).

    What I've often noticed in discussions about Duke (and not just this year, but over the past several) is that we fans, particularly after a loss, tend to magnify the flaws of our team while simultaneously magnifying the perceived dominance of other teams in comparison. "We'll never be able to compete with teams a,b,c becasue of fatal flaws x,y,z with our team." However, what we're really comparing our team against is, for the most part, some mythical dominant team that doesn't really exist. Many assume that there are 10 UNLV circa-1990 teams out there just waiting to eat our lunch in the tourney if we don't somehow fix all the things perceived as hopelessly wrong.

    Syracuse and Kentucky this year notwithstanding, I don't see any teams that are better than Duke. The field is pretty much open for teams 3-15 or even 20. And even Syracuse and Kentucky have flaws (rebounding and youth respectively) that can be exploited in the right circumstances and match-ups.

    All of this is to say that, whatever happens on Thursday, some perspective is in order as tonight's examples show. This team may (or may not) make a great run in the Touney. As it often does, it will depend greatly on match-ups and even a little luck. In the meantime, let's enjoy the ride! Go Duke!
    I've said the same in several posts in post game and in game threads. Most people like to play chicken little, though.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philadukie View Post

    Syracuse and Kentucky this year notwithstanding, I don't see any teams that are better than Duke. The field is pretty much open for teams 3-15 or even 20. And even Syracuse and Kentucky have flaws (rebounding and youth respectively) that can be exploited in the right circumstances and match-ups.
    Speaking of, UK is currently down 13 at the half to Miss St. If the Bulldogs can pull this off, it would certainly do a good bit towards keeping that invincible aura of UK in check (and maybe even curtail the ego of UK fans on the ESPN message boards...nah!)

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philadukie View Post
    I just thought it useful to point out two specific examples from tonight that might help provide a little perspective about our team and season so far.

    Missouri (#3) lost at home by 10 to a decent but unranked K-State team. G-Town (#9) lost to an unranked Seton Hall team on the road by almost 20. (Also, as I write this Michigan (#11) is losing to a very mediocre Northwestern team at the half by 7).

    What I've often noticed in discussions about Duke (and not just this year, but over the past several) is that we fans, particularly after a loss, tend to magnify the flaws of our team while simultaneously magnifying the perceived dominance of other teams in comparison. "We'll never be able to compete with teams a,b,c becasue of fatal flaws x,y,z with our team." However, what we're really comparing our team against is, for the most part, some mythical dominant team that doesn't really exist. Many assume that there are 10 UNLV circa-1990 teams out there just waiting to eat our lunch in the tourney if we don't somehow fix all the things perceived as hopelessly wrong.

    Syracuse and Kentucky this year notwithstanding, I don't see any teams that are better than Duke. The field is pretty much open for teams 3-15 or even 20. And even Syracuse and Kentucky have flaws (rebounding and youth respectively) that can be exploited in the right circumstances and match-ups.

    All of this is to say that, whatever happens on Thursday, some perspective is in order as tonight's examples show. This team may (or may not) make a great run in the Touney. As it often does, it will depend greatly on match-ups and even a little luck. In the meantime, let's enjoy the ride! Go Duke!
    Great post. Someone give this man trident points. College hoops is a fickle deal these days. All teams have flaws, yet all have talent. Davidson wins at Kansas, yet Ohio St loses there. Boston College beats Florida State, yet Florida St beats UNC by 33 points. Think about that one for a minute. NC State wins at Miami, but Miami wins at Duke, but Duke wins at UNC who lost at Florida St by 33 (yes I said that twice on purpose ).

    If you only read this board and did not know Duke's record, you would swear they are below .500 on the season, yet here they are at 23-4, with wins over UNC, Kansas, Mich St (all top 5 teams recently) with none of those wins in Cameron, and tied for the ACC lead. I know it works both ways, but they could easily be 25-2 and undefeated in ACC play.

    These are crazy times. Like K always says, "Enjoy the journey". The "journey" is what it is all about. I have not even thought one second on March Madness yet. Will deal with that when it gets here. For now I am content to enjoy yet another Duke team that is winning games at a high rate. Winning 25+ games never gets old, and never gets boring. Nor should it.

    Did I mention that Florida St beat UNC by 33?

  6. #6
    Here's another (positive) view: when the regular season is over in a week and a half or so, we might well have beaten the regular season champs of the Big 10 (possibly the top two teams in the league), the Big 12, the Pac whatever, the Southern and the Atlantic Sun as well as the runners-up in the ACC (UNC, right?) and the Ivy. All this is reflected in our top 3 SOS and our RPI, but it is a another way to perspective on a very good season so far, a stellar season when measured against our talent and considering our lack of a classic PG, lack of a lockdown perimeter defender and lack of a long wing player to guard scoring small forwards. Notwithstanding his frustation at times, this might be one of Coach K's best coaching jobs.

    Go Duke!

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by barely View Post
    Here's another (positive) view: when the regular season is over in a week and a half or so, we might well have beaten the regular season champs of the Big 10 (possibly the top two teams in the league), the Big 12, the Pac whatever, the Southern and the Atlantic Sun as well as the runners-up in the ACC (UNC, right?) and the Ivy. All this is reflected in our top 3 SOS and our RPI, but it is a another way to perspective on a very good season so far, a stellar season when measured against our talent and considering our lack of a classic PG, lack of a lockdown perimeter defender and lack of a long wing player to guard scoring small forwards. Notwithstanding his frustation at times, this might be one of Coach K's best coaching jobs.

    Go Duke!
    I likely won't get the numbers exactly right on this so forgive me, but on the coaches show tonight, Wojo made the comment that something like 11 or 12 of non-conference opponents Duke has played this year is in the Top 3 of their league with a chance to win their league regular season crown. I think he said 11 or 12 but it was a high number either way. Wojo said it was the strongest schedule he could ever remember Duke playing. The current record is impressive no matter how you slice it.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philadukie View Post
    I just thought it useful to point out two specific examples from tonight that might help provide a little perspective about our team and season so far.

    Missouri (#3) lost at home by 10 to a decent but unranked K-State team. G-Town (#9) lost to an unranked Seton Hall team on the road by almost 20. (Also, as I write this Michigan (#11) is losing to a very mediocre Northwestern team at the half by 7).

    What I've often noticed in discussions about Duke (and not just this year, but over the past several) is that we fans, particularly after a loss, tend to magnify the flaws of our team while simultaneously magnifying the perceived dominance of other teams in comparison. "We'll never be able to compete with teams a,b,c becasue of fatal flaws x,y,z with our team." However, what we're really comparing our team against is, for the most part, some mythical dominant team that doesn't really exist. Many assume that there are 10 UNLV circa-1990 teams out there just waiting to eat our lunch in the tourney if we don't somehow fix all the things perceived as hopelessly wrong.

    Syracuse and Kentucky this year notwithstanding, I don't see any teams that are better than Duke. The field is pretty much open for teams 3-15 or even 20. And even Syracuse and Kentucky have flaws (rebounding and youth respectively) that can be exploited in the right circumstances and match-ups.

    All of this is to say that, whatever happens on Thursday, some perspective is in order as tonight's examples show. This team may (or may not) make a great run in the Touney. As it often does, it will depend greatly on match-ups and even a little luck. In the meantime, let's enjoy the ride! Go Duke!
    Hear, hear!

    Great perspective, that will no doubt be lost on many the moment we fall behind in any game again...

    This team has at least met expectations to date. We're tied for first in the ACC, beat NC@CH in dramatic, crushing fashion, and are ranked in the top-5 at present. Probably most importantly, at this point we are possibly in-line for a #1 seed in the NCAAT. Life is good.

    Are there things that we can still hope to improve? Most certainly YES. But when has that ever NOT been the case? This season has been a good, entertaining "journey" so far. There's no reason these guys won't be one of a handful of favorites come mid/late-March to make the FF and a threat to win it all. Now, should we fall short of a NC, no doubt the "Chicken Littles" will be out in force once again... But I like where we are, overall, and where we seem to be headed.







    Now about that darned Miss State collapse at the end vs KY...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by -bdbd View Post
    Now about that darned Miss State collapse at the end vs KY...
    Are you referring to the way they lost their cool after being collapsed upon by the refs?

    ricks

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ricks68 View Post
    Are you referring to the way they lost their cool after being collapsed upon by the refs?

    ricks
    That was atrocious....i don't think there's a better instance of the refs being influenced by the fact that UK is "supposed" to be better....
    1200. DDMF.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by uh_no View Post
    That was atrocious....i don't think there's a better instance of the refs being influenced by the fact that UK is "supposed" to be better....
    I try to honestly go along with the refs, as I do not know how they are supposed to call a game. Don Shula used to always say that if his team lost a game because of what was supposedly a bad call, then they didn't deserve to win, anyway. This game, however, appeared to have multiple bad calls against Miss State during the last half of the 2nd period. Miss State hung in there by continuously coming back after the bad calls-----a tremendous display of playing through it. But, in my opinion, the refs kept on doing it until a few of the Miss State players finally couldn't talke it anymore. As one attempted a layup, two Kentucky players smashed his arm and hand while almost pinning the ball against the backboard. (I played it back on my recorder) Kentucky came down with the rebound, and while the fouled Miss State played turned to the ref and complained, a Kentucky player ran past him and brushed his body against the Miss State player. Consequently, the Kentucky player "tripped" on the Miss State players leg, resulting in a technical foul call against the Miss State player. I think that was at least a four point turnaround with Kentucky having the ball possession again. I do not remember if the Kentucky player actually hit the floor, or was just "bumped" off stride (maybe someone could clarify this------and also comment on why an intentional "trip" would be called considering that the Miss State player wasn't even facing the Kentucky player at the time, and it appeared that the Kentucky player actually initiated the contact.), but it came across to me as an obvious payback for turning toward the ref in the first place. Interestingly, it also came across to me that when some of these serious calls went against Miss State, they were usually followed by an over-the-back call against Kentucky on the other end that didn't have an equal effect because Miss State had ended up with the defensive rebound anyway.

    Just my two cents on this one. I don't like to get on the refs because I believe that the calls usually even out over time, and have always taken the Don Shula approach, myself, even when some people think that we lost a game because of the refs. I also believe that "it is what it is", and we should not be making excuses if we "think" calls go against us. This game, however, just seemed a little strange in the foul-calling department. Anyone else see it this way?

    ricks

  12. #12
    i agree that duke is unquestionably a top 10 team and arguably a top 5 team - we've got as good a chance as anyone to make a run (with the exception of kentucky who looks a bit better than the field; and some would argue syracuse). we all should be happy with what this team has accomplished and where it stands.

    however, i think a lot of the angst is that this team could just as easily pull an oh-fer for the rest of the season as do something special. oh-fer being no more wins vs. unc, no acc regular season "champ", no acc championship, no final four. these are the things we (at least i) care about. is it an unfairly high bar? absolutely. has it been met more often than not over the past decade +? you betcha. thankfully, to-date, the team has won every thing i care about and we've put ourselves in a good position - won maui, beat unc, co-leader of acc, arguably leader for an ncaa #1 seed (i'd love to have added some weeks at #1 in the polls, but that's getting super greedy).

    so what drives that angst/why does it feel like we might not add any more notches to our belt? well, look at how we've done against at-large tourney caliber teams (particularly recent results, as teams have polished themselves and are closer to postseason form than preseason form):

    11/15 - handled michigan state (they closed at end, but we controlled h2)
    11/22 - handled michigan
    11/23 - eeked kansas (behind with ~1.30 left)
    11/29 - embarassed by ohio state
    12/10 - handled washington (they closed at end, but we controlled)
    ------
    1/4 - handled by temple
    1/12 - won a tight one vs. uva
    1/21 - lost at buzzer to fsu
    2/5 - lost in OT to miami
    2/8 - beat unc at buzzer
    2/16 - miraculous comeback vs. state

    it's basically a coin flip for the past 6. are we favorite to beat unc at cameron? no. are we the leader to "win" acc regular season? no (we've got the toughest remaining schedule). are we better than 50/50 to even advance to the acc title game? that's close and obviously depends on the draw, but involves 2 wins agains tourney caliber teams, so maybe not. are we better than 50/50 to advance beyond the sweet 16? again, maybe not (we'd need 2 wins over temple/uva/fsu/miami/state caliber or better teams).

    i think this team is still improving - it's apparent in a lot of ways. that will be what really drives this team's ultimate outcomes and is very satisfying to watch. but when i think about adding notches to our belt, it will definitely require a meaningful step up (and/or some luck - i'm not proud i'll, take luck too).

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by bob blue devil View Post
    it's basically a coin flip for the past 6. are we favorite to beat unc at cameron? no. are we the leader to "win" acc regular season? no (we've got the toughest remaining schedule). are we better than 50/50 to even advance to the acc title game? that's close and obviously depends on the draw, but involves 2 wins agains tourney caliber teams, so maybe not. are we better than 50/50 to advance beyond the sweet 16? again, maybe not (we'd need 2 wins over temple/uva/fsu/miami/state caliber or better teams).
    Let me start by saying I loved your use of "eeked" as an active verb. However, since this is a thread about perspective, the things you say you want here are not particularly reasonable. Especially the last one. To be "better than 50/50" to win three games against tough competition, you have to be an overwhelming favorite. Every year Pomeroy publishes odds (based on his rating system) of each team advancing, and I've never seen more than two or three teams that have better than 50/50 odds of advancing beyond the Sweet 16. I suppose you can angst on whatever pleases you, but to be disappointed because we may not be one of the top two or three teams in the country seems to be setting an unrealistic expectation.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philadukie View Post
    All of this is to say that, whatever happens on Thursday, some perspective is in order as tonight's examples show. This team may (or may not) make a great run in the Touney. As it often does, it will depend greatly on match-ups and even a little luck. In the meantime, let's enjoy the ride! Go Duke!
    I have to agree. We have a fantastic team this year, by any standard (including our own). Sure, there are areas for improvement, but we are far from doomed. If anyone thinks otherwise, then I have to say that they are just delusional. Plus, they need to relax or they aren't going to have any fun. But unfortunately, the fans with the least perspective are often also the loudest. Oh well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    If you only read this board and did not know Duke's record, you would swear they are below .500 on the season, yet here they are at 23-4, with wins over UNC, Kansas, Mich St (all top 5 teams recently) with none of those wins in Cameron, and tied for the ACC lead. I know it works both ways, but they could easily be 25-2 and undefeated in ACC play.
    I agree that it is dangerous, but I too would like to play the what-if game for a bit here, mostly out of curiosity. Let's pretend we hit our free throws against Miami and play suffocating defense for an extra five seconds against FSU. This is only a change of two possessions or so, which I think is acceptable. Our team would then be, as you said, 25-2 and undefeated in ACC play. We would currently be ranked only one spot higher (#3 instead of #4), but the talking heads would be discussing us as one of the three juggernauts this season (with UK and Cuse), we would be a virtual lock for a 1-seed, the ACC regular season would be all-but-guaranteed, and our fans would probably be expecting no less than ACC Championship and Final Four appearances, at the very least. There would probably be a small but vocal minority of posters arguing that we weren't as good as everybody thinks (probably the same group that is currently arguing that we are actually a little better than everybody thinks), but for the most part, that team would be doomed to failure and unfulfilled expectations. Despite being essentially the same team. Instead, people are questioning whether this team can even make the Sweet 16. I just find it interesting how a few possessions can sway these things.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Kedsy View Post
    However, since this is a thread about perspective, the things you say you want here are not particularly reasonable. Especially the last one. To be "better than 50/50" to win three games against tough competition, you have to be an overwhelming favorite. Every year Pomeroy publishes odds (based on his rating system) of each team advancing, and I've never seen more than two or three teams that have better than 50/50 odds of advancing beyond the Sweet 16. I suppose you can angst on whatever pleases you, but to be disappointed because we may not be one of the top two or three teams in the country seems to be setting an unrealistic expectation.
    i think we're in general agreement - elite 8 is a worthy accomplishment despite the media making the final 4 a seemingly remarkably greater accomplishment. i originally had a simple 'no' instead of 'maybe not' for it being a 50/50 bet, but feared getting jumped on for being overly pessimistic, which i am not...

    it might be interesting to turn this around a bit. let's say this team finishes fine by any reasonable measure - beats FSU, beats VaTech, beats Wake, but then loses to UNC at Cameron. meanwhile UNC beat UVa and Maryland, so we're #2 in the acc regular season. then we do okay in the acc tourney - beating, say, wake and avenging miami before losing to fsu (or even beating fsu, but losing in the title game), so no acc title. then, with a #2 seed in the ncaa tourney, we advance to the sweet 16, but lose there to baylor or georgetown. how would you feel? in the big picture, against any reasonable measure (including that of an elite basketball program), that's a very impressive season (30 wins no less, including many impressive scalps). but, gosh, it wouldn't feel that way.

    my point was not that we (i) have reasonable expectations, it's that having 'perspective' is much easier said than done. it's fun to dismiss others for their lack of perspective, but i think any good duke fan lacks it to some degree.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Philadukie View Post
    However, what we're really comparing our team against is, for the most part, some mythical dominant team that doesn't really exist. Many assume that there are 10 UNLV circa-1990 teams out there just waiting to eat our lunch in the tourney if we don't somehow fix all the things perceived as hopelessly wrong.
    I wholeheartedly agree with the post... But as I read this line it struck me. This team isn't competing on the national stage; any reasonable person would be happy with a top 5 ranking and positive outcomes against national competition. But, we're not competing with Kentucky, Syracuse, or Mizzou. The 2012 team is competing with the 2010 team, the 2001 team, the 1991-92 teams. We look at Seth Curry, Austin Rivers, Andre Dawkins, Ryan Kelly, and the Plumlees, and we wonder how they can compete with the legends of Duke's past. We don't see legends yet. Rivers might have legend potential (and a legendary moment under his belt), but he's a year away from either the legend status or the NBA. We see Seth and think he's no Stephen, or Dell. We look at Andre and wish he could do more than shoot a 3-pointer. We look at Kelly and wish he was tougher; we look at Miles and wish he'd put things together; we look at Mason and think, good but not consistently great. This isn't Battier/Williams/Dunleavy/Boozer/Duhon. There isn't a Laettner, a Hurley, a Hill. Heck, this team can't even play D the way every Duke team has for the past 25 years.

    But this team Wins. Capital W.

    Some fans are waiting for the commentary to talk about a Big Three plus Z, a shooter like Redick, a phenom like Brand. And even if we lose, if we had a player like that, a team whose path was cut short because of an unlucky break, we'd remember them. And we don't see ourselves remembering this team yet, just like we don't really try to remember 2003 or 2007. But this team is better than those teams, and this team has a great chance to win a lot. Because even though Seth isn't Stephen, he's one of the best guards in the conference. Austin has greatness in him and it comes at the best times. Dawkins may only have one reliable shot, but despite the other team knowing that, he still gets it off effectively and efficiently. Ryan may not have the greatest athletic ability, but makes up for it with his basketball IQ. Miles has quietly turned into one of the best rebounders in the country while we've been waiting for him to "put it together". And Mason is frequently the best player on the floor.

    And I don't mean to leave out Thornton, Cook, or Hairston, solid role players who can contribute to this team; but will make their impacts in the future.

    Perhaps the best thing about 2012 Duke is that for all the games shown on ESPN, no one really knows how to compliment this team. They can't believe how we stay on the national stage, how we beat really good teams. Because this team isn't marketable. They don't have a player of the year candidate; not a single player in the top 100 of ESPN's college PER. Commentators get disappointed that Rivers didn't take over the team after UNC; but that's what this team does. And so, you never hear how well we function as a team.

    It's a really good team. You don't end up 23-4 against high quality competition. It's not a collection of legends, but for me that actually makes it better.

    It's very much a Team. Capital T.

    There are probably past Duke teams that would beat this one seven times out of ten, but just like against this year's competition, 2012 would win more than you expect.

  17. #17
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    The only perfect team I've ever witnessed was UNLV in 1990. They destroyed all comers. Those days aint coming back. If you can find a way to be upset about 4 losses after losing your team captains and starting point guard to the NBA draft then your "perspective" may be a bit out of wack. Those losses have made this team stronger without a doubt. It seems that many have settled down and bought in and now they are building on their roles (most noticeably Austin making sure Dre gets to shoot his 3 and the increased number of lobs to the bigs). I've got a good feeling about this team.

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    Countervailing Views

    Quote Originally Posted by Kedsy View Post
    Let me start by saying I loved your use of "eeked" as an active verb. However, since this is a thread about perspective, the things you say you want here are not particularly reasonable. Especially the last one. To be "better than 50/50" to win three games against tough competition, you have to be an overwhelming favorite. Every year Pomeroy publishes odds (based on his rating system) of each team advancing, and I've never seen more than two or three teams that have better than 50/50 odds of advancing beyond the Sweet 16. I suppose you can angst on whatever pleases you, but to be disappointed because we may not be one of the top two or three teams in the country seems to be setting an unrealistic expectation.
    I have to say that I don't find your responsive post fair at all to the essential countervailing view bob is expressing.

    I think the original poster made the excellent point that this Duke team (particularly given the loss of two All-Americans and the soon-to-be NBA rookie of the year, and the strength of our schedule this season) is exceeding reasonable expectations and giving Duke fans and alumni a lot to cheer about. We are in a position to win the ACC regular season, and certainly have at least a puncher's chance of winning the ACC T and maybe even winning a number 1 seed. That is hard to beat. And the NCAA T is always kind of a crapshoot based on matchups.

    But the essence of bob's point, and a countervailing view I share, is that we have showed more growing pains as the season has progressed. It is fair to wonder whether Duke has the chops to beat FSU in Tallahassee or to beat Carolina in Cameron, and I don't know that I'd consider us favorites to do either. Same goes for making the Sweet Sixteen.

    So I think a bit of angst is fair and not incompatible with recognizing some nice accomplishments to date. Every Duke fans wants the team to win in March, and I think a victory over FSU on Thursday would probably build the confidence of the team and the fanbase in that regard.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by bob blue devil View Post
    it might be interesting to turn this around a bit. let's say this team finishes fine by any reasonable measure - beats FSU, beats VaTech, beats Wake, but then loses to UNC at Cameron. meanwhile UNC beat UVa and Maryland, so we're #2 in the acc regular season. then we do okay in the acc tourney - beating, say, wake and avenging miami before losing to fsu (or even beating fsu, but losing in the title game), so no acc title. then, with a #2 seed in the ncaa tourney, we advance to the sweet 16, but lose there to baylor or georgetown. how would you feel? in the big picture, against any reasonable measure (including that of an elite basketball program), that's a very impressive season (30 wins no less, including many impressive scalps). but, gosh, it wouldn't feel that way.
    I am always disappointed when Duke loses, but honestly I'd feel fine in your scenario. I felt fine last year, even though the Arizona loss was a disappointment. It took me a couple days after our first round exit, but I even felt fine in 2007.

    Perhaps it comes from my own student days. In my four years, we only had an appreciably better season than 2007 once out of four. But I rooted like crazy for the team, even when we finished 10-17 my senior year. I felt good about winning a couple games in the NIT my junior year. Compared to those years, a Sweet 16 finish is amazing.

    I try to look at it this way: I invest myself in following the team and the players; no matter how they perform on the court, they provide valuable entertainment for me and give me something to get excited about. That's all I can expect from them. The wins and the titles and the accomplishments make it more fun, but are not requirements for my fandom.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by SupaDave View Post
    The only perfect team I've ever witnessed was UNLV in 1990. They destroyed all comers. Those days aint coming back. If you can find a way to be upset about 4 losses after losing your team captains and starting point guard to the NBA draft then your "perspective" may be a bit out of wack. Those losses have made this team stronger without a doubt. It seems that many have settled down and bought in and now they are building on their roles (most noticeably Austin making sure Dre gets to shoot his 3 and the increased number of lobs to the bigs). I've got a good feeling about this team.
    Actually, the 1990 UNLV team lost 5 games, including 2 in the Big West. They almost didn't get past the Sweet 16, beating Ball State by just 2 points. They were far from perfect.

    The 1991 UNLV team was a near-perfect team. Until they ran into Duke in the Final Four, that is.

    The rest I agree with. I have a good feeling about this team, too.

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