Johnny and the Cardinal and Tommy and the Crimson (Harvard in!)

[hurleyfor3]

This statement reminds me of how people report--as though it were absolute fact--that Duke would have won it all in 2004 if the last bit of the UConn game went differently, or if our bigs had accrued a foul fewer apiece. What everyone ignores is that Georgia Tech made the National Final. And they had beaten us about a month earlier. In Cameron.

Not to mention that UConn had to deal with the same ticky-tack foul calling that we did, which forced Emeka Okafor to sit out much of the game, which allowed us to build that lead in the first place.

Losing to football schools playing football (2000, 2006) bothers me far more.

Geez, why am I discussing a UConn game from eight years ago in this thread. Anyway, the bigger travesty with Bradley was the joke of a commencement speech he gave in 1993. I guess that was our fool us twice, shame on us moment.

[snowdenscold]

This statement reminds me of how people report--as though it were absolute fact--that Duke would have won it all in 2004 if the last bit of the UConn game went differently, or if our bigs had accrued a foul fewer apiece. What everyone ignores is that Georgia Tech made the National Final. And they had beaten us about a month earlier. In Cameron.

Ehhh, I still feel that that GA Tech team way over-achieved and can't believe they made the final game (and I thought that at the time, not looking back after years of Hewitt mediocrity). IIRC, UConn was crushing them by 20 or 30 at one point in the NC game. They might have beaten us during the season, but I still feel strongly we had a high chance of winning had we played them again. Not 100%, but high.

[-bdbd]

This statement reminds me of how people report--as though it were absolute fact--that Duke would have won it all in 2004 if the last bit of the UConn game went differently, or if our bigs had accrued a foul fewer apiece. What everyone ignores is that Georgia Tech made the National Final. And they had beaten us about a month earlier. In Cameron.

Bradley went to Princeton. South Carolina left the ACC. Ronald Curry was a young slimeball in 1998. I was pretty exercised about that in 1998...when I was 21. Jeez, let's give it a rest.

'agree with your main point Throaty -- it's kinda like the Terpers who complain that a single call in the last 20 seconds "cost us the game" (while ignoring the preceding 100 calls during the previous 39:40, many of which were close and went the other way). But in the case of 2004, I was actually there in San Antonio. I remember a LOT of the discussion prior to that FF being that, in effect, the Duke-vs.-U-con game was for the championship, and whoever won the other game (GT vs OKSU) should get steamrolled by either Duke or U-con. That doesn't make it a feit accompli, but GT was something like a 10 point underdog to U-con in the finals, and would have been similar vs Duke. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/score...UKE------0.htm Duke gave U-con a MUCH better game, going down to a final possession, while GT unfortunately did get steamrolled by U-con. (Yes, the final score looks closer, but only b/c GT hit a bunch of buckets late - I think they made a bunch of 3's - in the last 8 minutes, but it really wasn't as the 9 point margin appears. They were down 20 with about 10 minutes to go. http://espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=244000063 ) But yeah, Okafor actually did sit out much of the latter stages of the first half with 2 fouls, as Duke expanded its lead, but not enough. I remember sitting there thinking "We need to take advantage of this opportunity more while he's out. Okafor had a tremendous second half, and we really didn't have an answer, but I think he actually didn't sit out much in the second half... and he DID commit the (decisive) foul in a 1-point game that wasn't called in the lane in the waning seconds...damnit! Must...let...go...arrrgh!!

[Bluedog]

I remember a LOT of the discussion prior to that FF being that, in effect, the Duke-vs.-U-con game was for the championship, and whoever won the other game should get steamrolled by either Duke or U-con. That doesn't make it a feit accompli, but GT was something like a 10 point underdog to U-con in the finals, and would have been similar vs Duke.

Right, I recall that too and people said the same thing about Duke vs. WV being the de facto national championship game in 2010 and whoever won that should be in the driver's set for the title. But then Butler gave us a much tougher game than WV, so it's always difficult to predict. Still, that 2004 game hurts to think about...

[JG Nothing]

'agree with your main point Throaty -- it's kinda like the Terpers who complain that a single call in the last 20 seconds "cost us the game" (while ignoring the preceding 100 calls during the previous 39:40, many of which were close and went the other way). But in the case of 2004, I was actually there in San Antonio. I remember a LOT of the discussion prior to that FF being that, in effect, the Duke-vs.-U-con game was for the championship, and whoever won the other game (GT vs OKSU) should get steamrolled by either Duke or U-con. That doesn't make it a feit accompli, but GT was something like a 10 point underdog to U-con in the finals, and would have been similar vs Duke. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/score...UKE------0.htm Duke gave U-con a MUCH better game, going down to a final possession, while GT unfortunately did get steamrolled by U-con. (Yes, the final score looks closer, but only b/c GT hit a bunch of buckets late - I think they made a bunch of 3's - in the last 8 minutes, but it really wasn't as the 9 point margin appears. They were down 20 with about 10 minutes to go. http://espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=244000063 ) But yeah, Okafor actually did sit out much of the latter stages of the first half with 2 fouls, as Duke expanded its lead, but not enough. I remember sitting there thinking "We need to take advantage of this opportunity more while he's out. Okafor had a tremendous second half, and we really didn't have an answer, but I think he actually didn't sit out much in the second half... and he DID commit the (decisive) foul in a 1-point game that wasn't called in the lane in the waning seconds...damnit! Must...let...go...arrrgh!!

For fun, I looked up the boxscore and play-by-play of the game. You are right about Okafor sitting out most of the first half with two fouls. He actually got his second foul four minutes into the game and sat out the remaining 16 minutes of the first half. Two things struck me about the game that I had forgotten. First, the largest lead we had in the first half was only nine points and we only had a seven point lead at the half (I thought it was more in both cases). Second, Okafor only had three fouls for the game and Boone only had two (I thought they both had more).

Even with Ucon at full strength, we still had the lead the entire second half except for the last 25 seconds (we also had an eight point lead with 2:50 left in the game). Here's a what-if that I never see mentioned: if Thompson doesn't transfer at mid-season, I think we win the game.

[turnandburn55]

For fun, I looked up the boxscore and play-by-play of the game. You are right about Okafor sitting out most of the first half with two fouls. He actually got his second foul four minutes into the game and sat out the remaining 16 minutes of the first half. Two things struck me about the game that I had forgotten. First, the largest lead we had in the first half was only nine points and we only had a seven point lead at the half (I thought it was more in both cases). Second, Okafor only had three fouls for the game and Boone only had two (I thought they both had more).

Even with Ucon at full strength, we still had the lead the entire second half except for the last 25 seconds (we also had an eight point lead with 2:50 left in the game). Here's a what-if that I never see mentioned: if Thompson doesn't transfer at mid-season, I think we win the game.

I watched the last three minutes for the first time since it happened. I had been under the impression that all of our big men had fouled out, which allowed Okafor to run wild. As it turns out, Shelden and Shav fouled out, which definitely hurt, but Nick Horvath was in the game getting abused by Okafor for the crucial run, and didn't foul out until after the game had gotten away from us. I doubt Michael Thompson makes any difference, with that in mind.

What I had also forgotten was how Luol Deng just killed us by jacking up random three-pointers at the end. Ben Gordon and Ryan Anderson both had four fouls-- we should've been attacking the basket on every possession. Yes, Redick was fouled, but I think Deng/Duhon get that call far more frequently than JJ does (at least the sophomore version).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edylGVZXIQc

If anyone's interested...

[JG Nothing]

I watched the last three minutes for the first time since it happened. I had been under the impression that all of our big men had fouled out, which allowed Okafor to run wild. As it turns out, Shelden and Shav fouled out, which definitely hurt, but Nick Horvath was in the game getting abused by Okafor for the crucial run, and didn't foul out until after the game had gotten away from us. I doubt Michael Thompson makes any difference, with that in mind.

What I had also forgotten was how Luol Deng just killed us by jacking up random three-pointers at the end. Ben Gordon and Ryan Anderson both had four fouls-- we should've been attacking the basket on every possession. Yes, Redick was fouled, but I think Deng/Duhon get that call far more frequently than JJ does (at least the sophomore version).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edylGVZXIQc

If anyone's interested...

Can't watch it again. Too painful.

[hurleyfor3]

Stanford snags a coveted Nit bid.

http://i.turner.ncaa.com/dr/ncaa/nca...NITBracket.pdf

[burnspbesq]

The Cardinal advanced to the semifinals of the NIT with a 28-point win over Nevada tonight. They will play UMass next Tuesday.

[pfrduke]

The Cardinal advanced to the semifinals of the NIT with a 28-point win over Nevada tonight. They will play UMass next Tuesday.

The Pac-12 is dominating the lesser tournaments. Stanford and Washington in the NIT final four, Washington State and Oregon State in the CBI final four (with Washington State on to the finals).

[Bob Green]

Congratulations to Johnny Dawkins as his Stanford team has advanced to the NIT Championship Game by defeating UMass 74-64 in the first semi-final. Minnesota and Washington are up next. The PAC 12 is looking at a possible all conference final if Washington can take care of business. Yeah, it's the NIT, but it's still an accomplishment.

[dukelifer]

Congratulations to Johnny Dawkins as his Stanford team has advanced to the NIT Championship Game by defeating UMass 74-64 in the first semi-final. Minnesota and Washington are up next. The PAC 12 is looking at a possible all conference final if Washington can take care of business. Yeah, it's the NIT, but it's still an accomplishment.

Winning the NIT is no easy feat- just ask UNC

[devildeac]

Winning the NIT is no easy feat- just ask UNC

Third place ban-ner: clap, clap, clap/clap/clap.

[Billy Dat]

Johnny brought Raven Ray Lewis in to fire up his squad before one of the recent NIT games ...tremendous! Love how pumped Johnny is, and how surprised and pumped the team is when Lewis strolls in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07fhOVQ9wEA