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  1. #1

    Hot Stove League

    Another offseason ... I thought I'd start this thread to give us baseball fanatics a place to talk about the various issues that pop up.

    As a Yankee fan, I was happy to see the Yankees reach agreement with CC Sabathia, who could have exercised an option to opt out of his contract. Instead, he re-upped for five more years.
    The Yankees still have issues with their starting pitching, especially since it's unlikely that either Garcia or Colon -- two aging arms that saved the Yanks in 2011 -- will be back. That leaves a rotation of Sabathia (a rock), Burnett (totally unreliable), Hughes (great in 2010; lousy in 2011), Nova (coming off a great rookie year -- but will he have the same sophomore slump that plagued Hughes?) and one of the kids -- Cashman says Noesi gets the first chance, but a lot of people think Betances and Banuelos will be ready. At least the bullpen should get better with the return from injury of Feliciano and Chamberlain, plus maybe Brackman.

    On the whole, I hear that the Yankees will stand pat in the offseason. Reportedly, they will not go after CJ Wilson (the best free agent starter on the market) or that ridiculously expensive Japanese pitcher (Darvish or something like that?). They won't bid for Pujols or Prince Fielder. They might make a movie of Casey Blake if Eric Chavez decides to retire (he's still young, but he's had a lot of injuries).

    For the big free agents, I'm guessing: Wilson to Boston; Fielder to the Cubs and Pujols stays in St. Louis ... if not, then he goes to the Angels. It's bad timing for Pujols and Fielder that the three most free-spending teams (the Yankees, Red Sox and Phillies) all have relatively young, expensive first basemen on hand.

    Happy to see the Braves cut away some deadwood. I think they have plenty of good young pitching ... but I think they have to add a bat. I think it should be an outfielder -- ideally it would be a slugging shortstop, but the Rockies aren't giving up Tulowiski, Reyes will be too expensive and Hanley Ramirez is too much of a head case (and has issues with Gonzales). Easier to find a quality outfield bat -- then use Prado as a fourth outfielder and an every-other-day relief from Chipper at third base.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Olympic Fan View Post
    At least the bullpen should get better with the return from injury of Feliciano and Chamberlain, plus maybe Brackman.
    Or maybe not. A little surprising given that it's not a very big option and he seemed to be pitching better late in the year. Maybe they think his stock has fallen low enough that they can bring him back for a lower salary.
    Demented and sad, but social, right?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue in the Face View Post
    Or maybe not. A little surprising given that it's not a very big option and he seemed to be pitching better late in the year. Maybe they think his stock has fallen low enough that they can bring him back for a lower salary.
    A little surprising but he looks to be a middle relief guy at best if he makes it to the majors at all. He did pitch better towards the end, after he was relegated to the BP. Doesn't throw enough strikes and his 6'11" frame sure doesn't help.

  4. #4

    Brackman

    Brackman is a victim/benificiary of Scott Boras.

    He's a guy the Yankees would like to keep in the hopes that he would develop. He does have promise. But to pick up his option, the Yankees would have to pay the going rate for an established Major League pitcher (a lower end of the rotation, solid middle-inning guy) thanks to the bloated/great contract that Boras negotiated when the kid was drafted.

    I know the Yankee-haters don't like to admit it, but in recent years (since the Boss stepped out of the picture) the Yankees have maintained SOME financial sanity. They've paid a lot for some big-ticket items (maybe even overpaid), but nowadays, they only overpay for stars, not journeymen. Cashman saved the 2011 season with relatively cheap pickups such as Garcia, Colon and Andruw Jones. Russell Martin was a good value for the money. It doesn't look like he's going to throw money at CJ Wilson or Prince Fielder or Jose Reyes (the latter two are stars, but the Yankees already have stars at those positions ... not that that would have ever stopped Boss George).

    George would never have let a high profile prospect like Brackman go -- even if he was grossly overpaid.

  5. #5

    braves-Yankees to deal?

    Don't know if there is any substance to this, but supposedly the Yankees and Braves are talking a trade that would involve sending Jair Jurrjens to the Yankees for a package that included Edward Nunez, Nick Swisher and a middle-of-the-road minor leaguer.

    The Braves have also fielded offers from several teams, including the Tigers, for Martin Prado, but I don't know what's being offered there.

    Apparently, the Braves are hot to upgrade at shortstop and will not re-sign Gonzales. Nunez is just 23 years old and has already demonstrated great potential offensively. He was a mess last season defensively with 14 errors at SS and six more at 3B. The spin put on that is that he struggled with his infrequent use and that he'll be better when he plays regularly. Who knows? Swisher is a switch-hitter who would be an upgrade for the Braves in LF. The thinking is that Atlanta has so much good young pitching that they could dangle Jurrjens, who has two more years at a fairly decent salary ($8-10 million), then becomes a free agent -- and he's a Boros client. Swisher is attractive because he only has one more year under contract, so the Braves wouldn't be committed to him long-term.

    Interesting speculation. As fan of both teams, I would like the deal.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...ticle-1.980241

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Walnut Creek, California

    A's move to San Jose heating up

    From yesterday's San Jose Merc-News and today's Contra Costa Times is this squib. The Giants hold so-called territorial rights in San Jose and supposedly have veto power over any other team moving there. So if Selig is meeting with them in two weeks to get them off their opposition, it seems to me that the game is almost over and the A's will be saying good-bye to Oakland shortly.

    Also, the other day, the CC Times' Joe Stiglich had a story regarding the A's possibly trading closer Andrew Bailey and starter Gio Gonzalez. Both have been all-stars. He seems to think that Bailey is the more likely, but it will depend on who is offered in exchange. No real deal is in sight. Much depends on whether the A's will be in a "moving to San Jose" mode or whether they will give the 2012 season a real try. Given Wolfe's lack of interest in Oakland, the city, I tend to think he won't make any effort to make the team better.

    His attitude is maddening since he would have fans in the seats if he would put a decent product on the field and let it be known that such was his aim. He's done the opposite. This is classic stuff; put a loser on the field and claim the team is losing money (he isn't) because of the lack of local support. See Seattle SuperSonics --> Oklahoma City Thunder. Also see Al Davis: History of Ripping Cities For Profit. The sad thing is that there is no guarantee that Wolfe will spend any money on upgrading the team when it gets to San Jose. Wolfe is burning it down.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Olympic Fan View Post
    Don't know if there is any substance to this, but supposedly the Yankees and Braves are talking a trade that would involve sending Jair Jurrjens to the Yankees for a package that included Edward Nunez, Nick Swisher and a middle-of-the-road minor leaguer.

    The Braves have also fielded offers from several teams, including the Tigers, for Martin Prado, but I don't know what's being offered there.

    Apparently, the Braves are hot to upgrade at shortstop and will not re-sign Gonzales. Nunez is just 23 years old and has already demonstrated great potential offensively. He was a mess last season defensively with 14 errors at SS and six more at 3B. The spin put on that is that he struggled with his infrequent use and that he'll be better when he plays regularly. Who knows? Swisher is a switch-hitter who would be an upgrade for the Braves in LF. The thinking is that Atlanta has so much good young pitching that they could dangle Jurrjens, who has two more years at a fairly decent salary ($8-10 million), then becomes a free agent -- and he's a Boros client. Swisher is attractive because he only has one more year under contract, so the Braves wouldn't be committed to him long-term.

    Interesting speculation. As fan of both teams, I would like the deal.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...ticle-1.980241
    I would hate to lose Swisher. Not only is he a productive player, he has a reputation as a great clubhouse leader. If Nunez is that attractive to Atlanta, then throwing in Swisher strikes me as too much.

    Should the Yankees move Swisher, I suspect they would target Carlos Beltran. He's a good player when healthy. But if you look at him the wrong way, he's on the DL.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Olympic Fan View Post
    Don't know if there is any substance to this, but supposedly the Yankees and Braves are talking a trade that would involve sending Jair Jurrjens to the Yankees for a package that included Edward Nunez, Nick Swisher and a middle-of-the-road minor leaguer.

    The Braves have also fielded offers from several teams, including the Tigers, for Martin Prado, but I don't know what's being offered there.

    Apparently, the Braves are hot to upgrade at shortstop and will not re-sign Gonzales. Nunez is just 23 years old and has already demonstrated great potential offensively. He was a mess last season defensively with 14 errors at SS and six more at 3B. The spin put on that is that he struggled with his infrequent use and that he'll be better when he plays regularly. Who knows?
    Jurrjens for Swisher and a promising young shortstop would be a good deal for the Braves. I just can't figure out what makes Nunez a promising young shortstop - is it the errors or the career .696 OPS?

  9. #9
    Well, whatever one thinks of the merits of Eduardo Nunez, he just got more expendable to the yanks, as they have reportedly won the bidding rights to Japanese shortstop Hiroyuki Nakajima. Whether he'll sign with them remains to be seen of course, but if the yanks do move Nunez, I think the Mets have a need....
    Demented and sad, but social, right?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    St. Louis
    Speaking of shortstops, the word is that Hanley Ramirez is unhappy about the prospect of being moved to third base to accommodate Reyes, so he asked for a restructuring of his contract. This in turn got the Marlins P.O.'ed so now they will try to trade him.

    It's as if the Fish didn't know that with HanRam, it's all about meeeeee. Doubtful that they get equal value for him.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Walnut Creek, California

    More on A's to San Jose

    Here is a link to the San Jose Merc-News saying that MLB is about to permit the A's owners -- Lew Wolff (Selig's college roommate) and John Fisher -- to move to San Jose. Mark Purdy's article, somewhat slanted in favor of San Jose, does detail some of the history leading to the move. He blames much of Oakland's lack of response on the Coliseum Commission, certainly true as far as it goes, but the ghost of Al Davis is not part of Schott and then Wolff's decision to exacerbate the issue by letting the team slowly fall away, at the same time they were rejecting at least four plans for a stadium that the city would have approved.

    Still, there's hope...the Giants seem likely to continue to stand in Wolff's way--even if Reinsdorf is supporting Wolff.

    Anyway, this news will not be as important in the short run as whether the A's will also make a play for better players or whether they will continue their penurious ways regarding available players.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Quote Originally Posted by rasputin View Post
    Speaking of shortstops, the word is that Hanley Ramirez is unhappy about the prospect of being moved to third base to accommodate Reyes, so he asked for a restructuring of his contract. This in turn got the Marlins P.O.'ed so now they will try to trade him.

    It's as if the Fish didn't know that with HanRam, it's all about meeeeee. Doubtful that they get equal value for him.
    Yeah, especially after the season he just had and the mental issues that come with the guy. He couldn't have picked a worse time for his club to trade him. I personally hope he stays. Imagine the fun they'd have down in Miami next summer with he and Ozzie. That might be worth the price of admission alone.

  13. #13
    The twitterverse says Pujols will sign with the Angels for $250MM plus over 10 years. Ba-boom.
    Demented and sad, but social, right?

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue in the Face View Post
    The twitterverse says Pujols will sign with the Angels for $250MM plus over 10 years. Ba-boom.
    I think that's too much money and WAY too many years. Pujols is on a 2 year decline and not getting any younger. Plus they had Morales and Trumbo over there. I suppose they'll tried to unload them to fill other spots but this one doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Doug.I.Am View Post
    I think that's too much money...
    Money seems to be in long supply in Anaheim - they've now added CJ Wilson for $75MM over 6 years. Did only Miami and LAA get the memo that the winter meetings were happening?
    Demented and sad, but social, right?

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue in the Face View Post
    Money seems to be in long supply in Anaheim - they've now added CJ Wilson for $75MM over 6 years. Did only Miami and LAA get the memo that the winter meetings were happening?
    I like this deal more than the one for Pujols, although 15 mill is pretty steep for CJ. It'll still be nice to pitch against the A's and Mariners all year long. The thing is now he'll have to face the Rangers instead of the previously offensively challenged Angels. I think his sub 3 ERA was very misleading.

    Agreed, Blue - this has been a very quiet session for teams not named Miami or LA.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Doug.I.Am View Post
    I like this deal more than the one for Pujols, although 15 mill is pretty steep for CJ. It'll still be nice to pitch against the A's and Mariners all year long. The thing is now he'll have to face the Rangers instead of the previously offensively challenged Angels. I think his sub 3 ERA was very misleading.
    Agreed, I think this is a pretty good deal (although I liked it better when that link said it was $75 over 6 years, instead of 5 - I swear the link changed, I didn't just mispost). And keep in mind, while he now faces Texas' offense instead of the Angels' as a divisional foe, he also pitches a lot fewer games in Arlington, where he gave up a lot more runs than on the road the past two years.
    Demented and sad, but social, right?

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of sports teams that disappoint in the playoffs
    Ready for something that will blow your mind...

    When this contract is up, Pujols will have played 11 seasons with the Cards and 10 with the Angels (he's pretty much untradeable and why would he retire early with $25+ mil per year coming his way?). Seeing as the Angels seasons will be much more recent, I would think there would be an excellent chance his bust in the Hall of Fame would be in an Angels cap.

    -Jason "crazy... but that is the new reality" Evans
    Don't ask me why, but my mother is making me Tweet. Says it will be good for my career. So, follow my ramblings, mostly on the film industry, @TVFilmTalk

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    St. Louis
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Ready for something that will blow your mind...

    When this contract is up, Pujols will have played 11 seasons with the Cards and 10 with the Angels (he's pretty much untradeable and why would he retire early with $25+ mil per year coming his way?). Seeing as the Angels seasons will be much more recent, I would think there would be an excellent chance his bust in the Hall of Fame would be in an Angels cap.

    -Jason "crazy... but that is the new reality" Evans
    If you think he'll actually play ten years. My guess is he won't, or that he won't be nearly as productive. He'll have a St. Louis hat after all.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Seeing as the Angels seasons will be much more recent, I would think there would be an excellent chance his bust in the Hall of Fame would be in an Angels cap.
    I think that's very unlikely. Unless he ages very well, as rasputin said he's unlikely to be as outrageously productive with the Angels as he was with the Cards, and I suspect there will be a significant disparity between his stats in StL and LAA. I think it will be completely non-controversial for his plaque to have a Cards' cap.
    Demented and sad, but social, right?

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