The Conference Realignment Vigil- Update: Terps to Big10?

[SoCalDukeFan]

The Ivy League to add Duke, Northwestern, Vanderbilt and Rice.

SoCal

[throatybeard]

Notre Dame schedule, 2011:

Sat, Sep 3 South Florida L 20-23 --
Sat, Sep 10 at Michigan L 31-35 --
Sat, Sep 17 (15) Michigan State W 31-13 --
Sat, Sep 24 at Pittsburgh 12:00 pm --
Sat, Oct 1 at Purdue 8:00 pm --
Sat, Oct 8 Air Force 3:30 pm --
Sat, Oct 22 (23) USC 7:30 pm --
Sat, Oct 29 Navy 3:30 pm --
Sat, Nov 5 at Wake Forest TBA --
Sat, Nov 12 Maryland 7:30 pm --
Sat, Nov 19 Boston College 4:00 pm --
Sat, Nov 26 at (5) Stanford 8:00 pm --

ACC 4, B1G 3.

That's irrelevant. They play BC now and then, and the Maryland and WFU games are part of one-time home-and-homes. They play Michigan State, Michigan, Purdue every single year.

[OldPhiKap]

Is the front page arguing that the ACC should want WV, because they're fans are like VTechs but worse?

I'm confused.

[killerleft]

Is the front page arguing that the ACC should want WV, because they're fans are like VTechs but worse?

I'm confused.

More fun to beat. What do you want, somebody we have to learn to dislike?

[fan345678]

As DBR has just noted on the front page, West Virginia would make a fine addition to the ACC. Too bad money is the great mover here. West Virginia would accept in a heartbeat, I think, and be a real asset to the ACC in the major sports. Their fanbase is strong and loyal. As DBR says, VT, VA, and Maryland would be natural rivals, and travel time for the northern teams wouldn't be bad.

Then again, Florida and Georgia would be logical as members of the ACC as well, but that's not happening, either.

Two issues: 1) academics, and 2) WVU fans are even worse than Maryland fans

It would be fun to have the backyard brawl rivalry, though.

[uh_no]

Two issues: 1) academics, and 2) WVU fans are even worse than Maryland fans

It would be fun to have the backyard brawl rivalry, though.

I would like to think that WVU and PITT will continue to play each year in football and basketball, and that the rivalry will be even more intense being between conferences.

[OldPhiKap]

I would like to think that WVU and PITT will continue to play each year in football and basketball, and that the rivalry will be even more intense being between conferences.

Yeah. like maybe in the ACC-Big East Tourney.

Oh, wait a minute . . . .


;>)

[A-Tex Devil]

Some of this stuff is common sense that goes out the window then hits you back on the head when things come to fruition, but this has been a wild ride, not yet done yet, where I'm not sure I am going to like the outcome. But here goes:

1. Coach K is more and more awesome every time he speaks. He can really put things in perspective, and he's clearly read "Who Moved My Cheese."

"I'm proud of the leadership of our conference to be ahead of things. We're in a period of change. Whether everyone agrees with it or doesn't agree with it -- change is happening. It's not a revolution, it's evolution. These things are happening . . . When it happens while you're doing it, it seems like it shouldn't happen, but it is. I think the leadership in our conference is doing a great job of getting ahead. It's good thinking, especially if everything goes down with these two schools that have great athletic programs. They are unbelievable fits for our conference."

2. The ACC is the real power broker in the east and southeast, not the SEC. For all the talk about the SEC's huge contract, and their actual results on the football field, Mike Slive may have bitten off more than he can chew. Let's see, he said he could have 4 teams in 15 minutes. I wasn't aware that he meant Memphis, UAB, Southern Miss and La Tech. The SEC still hasn't finalized A&M since it is asking the raided conference for unprecedented waivers. The ACC meanwhile has stood in solidarity (thus far), added the best 2 options from the Big East and set itself up for a contract that I think will be right up there with what the Pac 10 got. The SEC will probably still get a Mizzou or a West Virginia to even out to 14, but they have been a bit of a paper tiger in this in more ways than one.

3. Control of content is much more important than the immediate money from a television contract. This is why UT has been so steadfast in its stubborness with the Longhorn Network. I thought it was just a cable channel when I first learned of it. It's much much more than that, and this buisiness model may hit head on with the Pac 12 regional network model to determine what works best. I think you'll find that regionals will work for some smaller schools, but the big boys, once they see what the LHN is going to allow Texas to do with new media, are going to want to take back control of a lot of the rights they've turned over to the conference - especially in the Pac 16 where essentially EVERYTHING was turned over.

4. Leaks to the media are simply what the entrenched position would be if the smart guys weren't in reality negotiating and compromising behind the scenes. I think the evidence of this will be seen in the "Great Compromise" among the Pac 16, its network providers, Texas and ESPN. Hopefully I am right here, but we'll see.

I am sure there is more, but this is enough for now...

[ForkFondler]

That's irrelevant. They play BC now and then, and the Maryland and WFU games are part of one-time home-and-homes. They play Michigan State, Michigan, Purdue every single year.

Ok, Wake and Maryland are irrelevant, but Pitt and BC have been opponents just about every year for the last twenty years. So, 3-2 B1G then. And then there's USC and Navy. Now that Navy isn't a sure win anymore, maybe ND might be ready to substitute MD.

It might be a lot easier to get ND to play a 7 game divisional schedule than an 8 or 9 game conference schedule. I'd be OK with that.

[roywhite]

A-Tex, you've been on this story from the beginning and provided great info.

I hope things work out for the Texas schools, though it must seem a bit like the Alamo at some points.

Questions if you know or care to comment:
Is there really a significant risk of "flight" for one or more of current ACC members?
Would UConn and Rutgers be the most likely for #15 and #16 in the ACC, or are there other strong candidates and considerations?

[uh_no]

Ok, Wake and Maryland are irrelevant, but Pitt and BC have been opponents just about every year for the last twenty years. So, 3-2 B1G then. And then there's USC and Navy. Now that Navy isn't a sure win anymore, maybe ND might be ready to substitute MD.

It might be a lot easier to get ND to play a 7 game divisional schedule than an 8 or 9 game conference schedule. I'd be OK with that.

While that's still a shaky argument, its still a minor issue.

two reasons ND isn't coming

1) NBC contract-they get gobs of money from having every game they play shown nationally
2) BCS contract-every time they have like 8(?) wins they can be selected over the big east champion for the BCS bid

[wva_iron_duke]

"Two issues: 1) academics, and 2) WVU fans are even worse than Maryland fans"

WVU brings alot to the ACC. Firstly, fans in the seats for away games; and they are not as finicky as some wine and cheese types about where the games are. Secondly, they already have significant rivalries with VPI,MD, BC and the U.And, of course Pit and Syracuse. As far as academics, it's easy to get in since it is a land grant charter but not so easy to graduate from.It's has a pretty long list of Rhode Scholars. I remember one from the football team in the 70's; and it has all the departments/colleges. How many schools in the ACC have an on-campus medical school? Before Pitt and Syracuse I can only think of Duke VA and maybe one other. As far as their fans go,they are certainly not in the terps class in bball. Many MD fans go to football games in Morgantown,and vice versa, and have done so since 1976. How many Duke fans will go to a football game in Morgantown anyway?

[jimsumner]

The Ivy League to add Duke, Northwestern, Vanderbilt and Rice.

SoCal

The Ivy League that doesn't offer athletic scholarships, plays FCS football, rarely shows up on TV and hasn't had more than one team in the NCAA Basketball Tournament since, well, forever? That Ivy League?

This only makes sense if Duke wants a significant de-emphasis of every single one of its athletic programs, including men's hoops.

I've seen nothing to suggest that this is the case. Why is this option attractive to you?

[ForkFondler]

While that's still a shaky argument, its still a minor issue.

two reasons ND isn't coming

1) NBC contract-they get gobs of money from having every game they play shown nationally
2) BCS contract-every time they have like 8(?) wins they can be selected over the big east champion for the BCS bid

1) The NBC contract has five years left
2) The big east has less than that

[A-Tex Devil]

A-Tex, you've been on this story from the beginning and provided great info.

I hope things work out for the Texas schools, though it must seem a bit like the Alamo at some points.

Questions if you know or care to comment:
Is there really a significant risk of "flight" for one or more of current ACC members?
Would UConn and Rutgers be the most likely for #15 and #16 in the ACC, or are there other strong candidates and considerations?

Thanks!

I'd defer to some of the guys on the east coast re: ACC, but my impression is that the unanimous vote to create a $20MM exit fee tells you everything you need to know. Not to say the ACC won't get raided, but it's a lot harder now, and there is also a lot more reinforcement to prevent anyone from leaving, both positive (adding Pitt, Syracuse, and maybe more) and negative (the increased exit fee).

The ACC has been the big winner in all of this in my mind from a combination of a PR and actual results perspective.

I'm not a fan of adding Rutgers or Uconn. Rutgers brings nothing. I won't repeat what everyone else has said about Rutgers real draw in NY/NJ, but location isn't everything when determining a team's value (Ex #1 -- Big 10 taking Nebraska over Mizzou).

My heart says to spurn UConn too. Something down in my soul says they don't deserve to be in the ACC. But that's not objective thinking. They are likely the first choice of who is left if you asked any of the smart decision makers, and that's probably the correct play.

Still - given my druthers, I'd add WVU and Louisville. Louisville's basketball revenues are nothing to sneeze at (in fact they eclipse Duke's). I don't know enough about Louisville's academics

[A-Tex Devil]

"Two issues: 1) academics, and 2) WVU fans are even worse than Maryland fans"

WVU brings alot to the ACC. Firstly, fans in the seats for away games; and they are not as finicky as some wine and cheese types about where the games are. Secondly, they already have significant rivalries with VPI,MD, BC and the U.And, of course Pit and Syracuse. As far as academics, it's easy to get in since it is a land grant charter but not so easy to graduate from.It's has a pretty long list of Rhode Scholars. I remember one from the football team in the 70's; and it has all the departments/colleges. How many schools in the ACC have an on-campus medical school? Before Pitt and Syracuse I can only think of Duke VA and maybe one other. As far as their fans go,they are certainly not in the terps class in bball. Many MD fans go to football games in Morgantown,and vice versa, and have done so since 1976. How many Duke fans will go to a football game in Morgantown anyway?

I agree with this. Taking West Virginia over Rutgers is akin to taking Nebraska over Mizzou. I don't get the WVU hate.

[Duvall]

I agree with this. Taking West Virginia over Rutgers is akin to taking Nebraska over Mizzou. I don't get the WVU hate.

Have you been to a game with West Virginia fans there?

[trinity92]

This is a long thread, so my apologies that I didn't sift through every page in case this has been asked and answered, but given GT's great academics and basketball tradition, one which has featured a pretty long-lived matchup against us each year, why haven't we approached them, and if we already have, what's the status/thinking on their addition to the ACC?

[uh_no]

This is a long thread, so my apologies that I didn't sift through every page in case this has been asked and answered, but given GT's great academics and basketball tradition, one which has featured a pretty long-lived matchup against us each year, why haven't we approached them, and if we already have, what's the status/thinking on their addition to the ACC?

because they don't have a football team.

[sagegrouse]

This is a long thread, so my apologies that I didn't sift through every page in case this has been asked and answered, but given GT's great academics and basketball tradition, one which has featured a pretty long-lived matchup against us each year, why haven't we approached them, and if we already have, what's the status/thinking on their addition to the ACC?

Uh, GT is in the ACC. And, even before, Duke played them every year. In the '50s it was the big regional game every year.

Georgetown is GU. It is in the Patriot League [ FCS (I-AA)], up from Div III and before that club football. Georgetown lost to Yale last weekend, 37-27. Duke great, the late Scotty Glacken, was one of the head coaches at GU early in its football revival. ("Hoya, saxa" was a nonsense football cheer. "What" from Latin, "Rocks" from Greek.") -- End of transmission --

sagegrouse