Florida AD Randy Spetman:
Such carefully chosen words..... (I keed. I keed. . But they aren't too dissimilar to others in the last 24 months)We're in the ACC. We're committed to the ACC. That's where our president and the board of trustees has committed to, so we're great partners in the ACC.
Please go. I will help you pack. As the chair of the BOT, don't you have better things to do? Also, perhaps you should read the TV contract before spouting off, because you clearly don't know how it works:
The last time the chair of the BOT piped up, they ran out Bobby Bowden. Going to law school there, I can tell you most of these people don't care about academics and most of their fans think the ACC unworthy of their use as toilet paper and look down on basketball as a primary sport. Okay, maybe not their 5 basketball fans, who actually want to be in the conference.
Last edited by msdukie; 05-12-2012 at 04:43 PM. Reason: Fixed typo.
Trinity '97, Tent #1 '97
This is going exactly like 2010 when A&M blocked the move to the PAC 10. Pres and AD have one mission, Trustees and $$ have a completely different view, it appears.
Seems to me that ESPN decided it was going to contribute exactly what it had to in order to keep the ACC in the same relative ballpark as the other conferences -- and not a penny more. This left the ACC a distinct runner up to all 4 other big time conferences, which has got to rankle ACC member schools. For a league that went all in with ESPN this thriftiness might end up backfiring big time if FSU (& others?) bolt to the Big12, where ESPN doesn't even have Tier 1 media rights. Keeping the ACC as it is now and strong is in ESPN's interest and $3 million behind all the other big boys seems like they're trying to do it on the cheap. Wonder if Bristol isn't suddenly thinking about being a little more generous, or is this deal done and set in stone? The ACC can kiss the idea of Notre Dame coming goodbye, we're starting to look like we may be the next most unstable league behind the perennially teetering Big East...
Trinity '97, Tent #1 '97
FSU President Barron released this relatively boilerplate/expected response to tamp down the controversy:
"Florida State University regrets that misinformation about the provisions of the ACC contract has unnecessarily renewed the controversy and speculation about University's athletic conference alignment. Florida State respects the views of the Chair of its Board of Trustees that, of course, any university would examine options that would impact university academics, athletics or finances. At the same time, Florida State is not seeking an alternative to the ACC nor are we considering alternatives. Our current commitments remain strong."
The rumblings seem to be getting louder. Swofford and company had better work quickly to repair this or it could completely snowball. I wonder if they can't find some pretext for reopening negotiations with ESPN? I'm no FSU fan, but if the ACC lost them, the football product -- which is clearly the driver behind conference compensation from the media companies -- is clearly diminished.
The claim that ACC men's basketball third tier rights are kept by the schools is akin to the claims of Nebraska and A&M that one of the main reasons they left the BIg XII was due to revenue sharing inequalities. It's a way to distract from these schools simply moving to the "better deal" in their mind.
And while Haggard *seems* to be getting shouted down right now from Tallahassee, I still wouldn't underestimate --- at any school --- the power of the regents, as fans, over the power of the AD and the President when it comes to the school's athletics.
Blah, blah, blah. A bunch of self-important people thinking their school is the coup de grace of everything. A bunch of saber rattling from people who might have power, but no brains hoping to get more to make up for their own financial windfall. People keep saying it, but South Carolina remains the only school dumb enough to leave the ACC. For the Big 12 no less??? Please!!! Freakin conference wasn't even sure it'd be here a few months ago. Best comment I read was the WVU fan claiming how happy they were they ended up in the Big 12 instead of the ACC. It's all a freakin joke with all of them hoping we won't take the clothes pins off our noses and smell the crap coming from over there.
At this point, I'm with you.....I honestly don't want to see any current ACC school leave the conference for another; but at the same time, if a schol doesn't want to be committed member, then they should go and pay their 20M on the way out; and bring in schools that want to be in the ACC and will contribute in a positive way both athletically and academically.
Last edited by Class of '94; 05-13-2012 at 11:59 AM.
I truly believe the ACC is going to be fine and will not collapse no matter what happens. And while I've wondered if the ACC could've negotiated a better deal, the deal is still an increase in what they were making; and if schools want more, the football programs have to get better; and supposed traditional football powers like FSU, Clemson Miami and VT have to stop falling flat on their backs against top contenders from other schools and actually look like football powerhouses. I'm still amazed at how a year ago the Big 12 was on the verge of collapsing and now they somehow negotitiated a pretty sweet deal; but if they could do it, certainly the ACC can. The ACC has been far more stable as a conference than the Big 8...Big 12...now Big 12 (with only 10 schools b/c 4 left over a period of 1-2yrs and they scrambled to get 2 to meet tv contract obligations). And if the ACC could hold off poaching from the SEC (even if they had help due to unofficial gentlemen's agreements between the SEC and Fla, Georgia and South Carolina to not bring in certain schools from the ACC), I believe the ACC can hold off poaching from the Big 12 (unofficially the new Big 10). That said, Swofford and the ACC are going to have to be proactive and judicious again imo with respect ot expancion; and perceived as better tv-deal negotiators.
Btw, you don't think the Big 10 would take Duke and UNC together as a package deal? I add UNC because I honestly believe Duke and UNC are a packaged deal and I don't think either school would leave and join another conference without the other. I could be naive on this; but that's just what I think.
Last edited by Class of '94; 05-13-2012 at 12:50 PM.
I have found recently that the board of regents at a lot of schools don't always have the entire university's best interest in mind, and sometimes are dangerous. Texas has been dealing with this very thing this past week due to our lovely governor trying to flex his muscles, almost causing a very popular university president to get fired. As mentioned before, these boards of regents are fans of the university. Certainly there are some "independent" folks on these boards of regents, but they don't have anywhere near the independence requirements of, say, a public corporation.
To Class of '94's point, FSU's fans and regents act as if the ACC has been holding it back in football, when it's been FSU's performance that's been holding it back. The ACC hasn't had a dominant team in a dozen years, and frankly MOST of the blame should land on the shoulders of FSU and Miami for that, although the whole conference, even Duke, shares in a lot of it. I'll grant that Va Tech has more or less held up its end of the bargain.
Anyway, I find the source of Florida St. fan's anger with the ACC as comical as A&M's was with the Big XII, and in many ways, it's worse. As for this discussion generally, I get that annoys and even in angers some. But I, for one, enjoy discussing the game theory and politics of all of this, especially with you guys, which is why I post here (although it's never been as interesting as June 2010). I am not entirely enthused as to WHY expansion is happening and certain of the endgame scenarios, but the speculation and chess games behind the scenes will always be intriguing.
What do you think?
In truth, there are two Big Dog conferences, the Big Ten and the SEC. The PAC-12 is important but geographically so distant that it will not play in future moves. (I say this confidently in that it discouraged God-squadders OU and Texas from applying). The ACC and Big-12 are next, and it is hard for me to understand how a traditional, stable, academically strong conference in one's own reason is superior to a newly hatched collection of schools mostly int he Great Plains. But, hey, if FSU wants to do something dumb, they don't need my permission to proceed.
And, FSU, if you don't like an ACC where the North Carolina schools have influence, I am sure you will absolutely lo-o-o-ve the Big 12, where Texas and OU, or their Boards, or the wealthy oilmen in those states call the shots.
And if Duke and Wake and BC seem unattractive as football rivals, how do you think the fans will take to Iowa, Kansas State, TCU and Baylor?
Maybe there is more to this story than my utter skepticism suggests. But I don't see any reason to panic or be alarmed -- or, if there was a reason, I am not sure what Duke could do about it. Apply to the Big Ten?
Last edited by sagegrouse; 05-13-2012 at 01:48 PM.
Now for the ESPN "Petyr "Littlefinger" Baelish" scenario where Notre Dame is the Iron Throne.
ESPN signs the ACC up to an improved, but still below market, contract for *ALL* football and basketball rights, but doesn't make things quite that clear initially, and let a wrongheaded rumor about basketball third tier rights perpetuate itself among the conference's football schools.
FSU and Miami (or Clemson), led by rich fans and unqualified board of regents members, initiate a move to the Big XII. The Big XII, knowing it now has an eponymous number of teams again, obviously and gladly accepts. ESPN gets additional first tier games in its Big XII contract and lock up Florida St.'s third tier rights for $8MM to $10MM per year, possibly through an LHN style network.
Whither the ACC? With the addition of Pitt and Cuse, the basketball is finally in 1982-2005 form. The conference is deep and strong and overtakes the Big East as the best basketball conference, going so far as to play the ACC tourney at MSG on occasion while the Big East tourney is relegated to Brooklyn. ESPN markets the hell out of the ACC to the point where it makes sense to have an ACC network, bringing more money to the conference.
Behind the scenes, and with the help of ESPN (natch) the conference commissioners have finally figured out the 4 team football playoff, and due to pressure from the PAC 12, the tournament only allows conference champions and Notre Dame *IF* Notre Dame is in the top 6. This scares the pants off Notre Dame considering how the past two dozen years have gone, and they are finally pushed to a conference. Big 10? Nope. To much bad history and animosity there. The Big XII? Please. The Domer fans don't want to have to go to Ames and Manhattan every year.
ESPN swoops in and offers Notre Dame a godfather deal to join the ACC, a "weak" football conference that they (in ND's opinion) can win most years, giving them at least an opportunity at the plus one playoff. This also pays huge dividends for the other ACC schools who in turn are willing to give ND a few extra rights around football to get the deal done. It also offers ND entrance into the best basketball and non-revenue sports league in the country. The ACC also picks up one of Louisiville or UCONN (I know, I know, but getting ND is worth it) to even it back out to 14 and further strengthen basketball.
ESPN gets -- full coverage of the best basketball conference, full rights to ND sports, FSU's third tier rights to further their efforts to market single school networks and programming. And they probably get the plus one playoffs and the NCAA tourney too because that's what Petyr Bae--- er... Dan Skipper has been planning the whole time!
Wetzel Article here.
Wow. Time value of money and all, if true, the ACC and ESPN's spin ends up sounding a little disingenuous. It doesn't excuse Haggard's behavior, but there is blood in the water (as I've seen mentioned elsewhere on the intertubes) now. If these potential moves are serious, this backloading piece will now be the bait that the boosters, and eventually the trustees, will use to get the support they need to move.The reality was bad, however. The initial bump in television revenue is actually just over $1 million a year, sources said, and a total in the $12 million range next season. The deal is back loaded so the bigger money comes in escalator provisions that, considering how broadcast rights keep growing, probably will be below market by the time any sizeable gains are realized.
That additional $4 million per school, per year? That won't come until 2021, nine years in, sources said.