Games in China & Dubai

[Scorp4me]

Does the white team look like the starters to anyone else?

If so I think no one predicted Murhpy and Zafirovski as starters.

And agree with Thornton looking like he may definitely be a factor this year.

[ThePublisher]

Thornton will definitely be a factor. He turned around a couple of games for us last year. I imagine he will get his share of starts depending on the opposing teams PG. If we need an offense slowed down, he's our guy.
Hopefully he gets his fouls in check.

[Duke of Nashville]

So, from what I remember is that ESPN was thinking about airing 3 of the 4 games of the China and Dubai trip. Any confirmation? Will they be available on GoDuke.com?

[msdukie]

So, from what I remember is that ESPN was thinking about airing 3 of the 4 games of the China and Dubai trip. Any confirmation? Will they be available on GoDuke.com?

I believe that they are still negotiating this and an announcement should be released soon.

[dukeblue1206]

I asked a local ACC writer if he knew anything or heard anything about the China/Dubai games being broadcast. He said he had talked to Bob Harris and that he was making the trip. So maybe at least Go Duke will be covering them to some extent since Bob is going.

[lotusland]

If so I think no one predicted Murhpy and Zafirovski as starters.

And agree with Thornton looking like he may definitely be a factor this year.

Recently read on DBR Singler and Nolan both looking at this years team and pointing to TT as a major contributor. For them both to say that is telling. We may have a real battle form PG minutes between Seth, Quinn and Tyler.

[hustleplays]

I've been traveling -- Have any of the games been televised? Any TV scheduled?
thanks.

[CDu]

Does the white team look like the starters to anyone else?

Depends on what pictures you're talking about. There are some pictures with Dawkins in blue and some with Dawkins in white. And there are some with Gbinije in blue and some with him in white. Also, I doubt Murphy or Zafirovski starts.

[Dukehky]

Can't help but to mention that no where does Andy Katz even talk about Josh Hairston! I really do not understand why he just gets lost in the mix. I hope he uses this as motivation this year. But I'm pretty sure Katz mentions every scholarship player on the team except Josh. Maybe its due to the fact no one knows what his role will be? Hmm...

I agree that Katz probably should have mentioned him in some way, as maybe someone who comes in to give up fouls in the plumlees and kelly are in trouble. But the reason no one knows his role is because he's not going to have very much of one, no matter how much Andy Katz's article motivates him. He doesn't have the skill to play outside, nor the size to play inside. Even if he has a great motor, he seems like a poor man's Jamal Boykin at this point. Maybe he's expanded his offensive game and grown a few inches, but I have heard no reports of that.

[CDu]

I agree that Katz probably should have mentioned him in some way, as maybe someone who comes in to give up fouls in the plumlees and kelly are in trouble. But the reason no one knows his role is because he's not going to have very much of one, no matter how much Andy Katz's article motivates him. He doesn't have the skill to play outside, nor the size to play inside. Even if he has a great motor, he seems like a poor man's Jamal Boykin at this point. Maybe he's expanded his offensive game and grown a few inches, but I have heard no reports of that.

He has the size to play inside. 6'8" is plenty big for a college 4. I think his problem is that he has two McDonald's All-Americans with more experience and better skills in front of him, along with a senior who has been a frequent starter over his first 3 years.

I also wouldn't call him a poor man's Jamal Boykin. Remember that neither was much of an impact player in their first year at Duke. Boykin didn't really make an impact until his fifth year in college.

I won't write Hairston off this year, but he's going to have to leapfrog Kelly or one of the Plumlees in order to increase his minutes. Since those guys were ahead of him on the depth chart last year (and he played minimally as a result), it's reasonable to assume those guys will be ahead of him on the depth chart this year (and he'll play minimally as a result).

[gep]

I've been wondering and keep forgetting to ask. Will the games in China and Dubai be played under international rules or US basketball rules. I would imagine US rules, but I don't think I've heard either way...

[Greg_Newton]

He has the size to play inside. 6'8" is plenty big for a college 4. I think his problem is that he has two McDonald's All-Americans with more experience and better skills in front of him, along with a senior who has been a frequent starter over his first 3 years.

I also wouldn't call him a poor man's Jamal Boykin. Remember that neither was much of an impact player in their first year at Duke. Boykin didn't really make an impact until his fifth year in college.

I won't write Hairston off this year, but he's going to have to leapfrog Kelly or one of the Plumlees in order to increase his minutes. Since those guys were ahead of him on the depth chart last year (and he played minimally as a result), it's reasonable to assume those guys will be ahead of him on the depth chart this year (and he'll play minimally as a result).

I agree with this, but I wouldn't be shocked to see Josh log 10-15 mpg this year, though. K seems very willing to use a 4-man post rotation - especially when it's a Plumlee-ridden one - and Josh brings a dynamic our other four caucasian sticks don't; he looks really solidly built these days, especially in the hindquarters, and is really our only physical, powerful, mix-it-up guy down low.

I'd also like to see him become a factor just because he's a great personality. He's a guy I can really see emerging as a leader as a junior or senior, and I think once he gets his body and mental processing of the game up to speed, he'll be a reliable, net-positive role player and asset. Different game than Lance Thomas, but same role/mindset.

[CDu]

I agree with this, but I wouldn't be shocked to see Josh log 10-15 mpg this year, though. K seems very willing to use a 4-man post rotation - especially when it's a Plumlee-ridden one - and Josh brings a dynamic our other four caucasian sticks don't; he looks really solidly built these days, especially in the hindquarters, and is really our only physical, powerful, mix-it-up guy down low.

I'm not sure that I agree with the thought that he's more solidly built and our only physical, powerful, mix-it-up guy down low. I'd say that both of the elder Plumlees are more solidly built and have shown to be more than willing to mix it up inside.

That said, I wouldn't be shocked to see Hairston get 10-15 mpg. He got 6 mpg last year in games he played (although he only played in about 75% of the games, so that's really like 4-5 mpg over the course of a season). Singler played probably 5 mpg at PF last year, so it's not unreasonable for those minutes to go to Hairston.

[BD80]

I agree with this, but I wouldn't be shocked to see Josh log 10-15 mpg this year, though. K seems very willing to use a 4-man post rotation - especially when it's a Plumlee-ridden one - and Josh brings a dynamic our other four caucasian sticks don't; he looks really solidly built these days, especially in the hindquarters, and is really our only physical, powerful, mix-it-up guy down low. ...

I'm not sure that I agree with the thought that he's more solidly built and our only physical, powerful, mix-it-up guy down low. I'd say that both of the elder Plumlees are more solidly built and have shown to be more than willing to mix it up inside. ...

I think the distinction is that the Plumlees tend to play defense from the shoulders up (and out) instead of moving their feet and staying low. It is natural for taller players to patrol the air space near the basket. How often do you see them in the lane, on their toes with an arm cocked, ready to block a shot? (Hint, there is probably a significant correlation to fouls called on them).

The turning point for Zoubek was when was able to get and hold his position, similar to Lance's strides on defense. Josh is ahead (below?) in this aspect of the game. I hope that the Plumlees (particularly Mason) have Zoub-like metamorphoses (catharses?) and Josh is used primarily to defend opposing 4s who are really 3s.

[CDu]

I think the distinction is that the Plumlees tend to play defense from the shoulders up (and out) instead of moving their feet and staying low. It is natural for taller players to patrol the air space near the basket. How often do you see them in the lane, on their toes with an arm cocked, ready to block a shot? (Hint, there is probably a significant correlation to fouls called on them).

The turning point for Zoubek was when was able to get and hold his position, similar to Lance's strides on defense. Josh is ahead (below?) in this aspect of the game. I hope that the Plumlees (particularly Mason) have Zoub-like metamorphoses (catharses?) and Josh is used primarily to defend opposing 4s who are really 3s.

I agree that the Plumlees have some faults in terms of being consistent with their positioning. But I'm not sure that I agree that Hairston is ahead of the Plumlees in any aspect of the game. I don't think we've seen enough of him to say such a thing. Nothing I've seen to this point suggests that Hairston plays any more physically or is any better at holding his position on defense.

Also, the "fouls per game" argument doesn't really hold with Mason anymore. He averaged a foul every 10 mpg last year, which is actually pretty good for a big man. It's also better than Hairston's rate, despite having to play against better competition than Hairston. Hairston fouled slightly more frequently (per minute played) than Miles as well.

[Greg_Newton]

I'm not sure that I agree with the thought that he's more solidly built and our only physical, powerful, mix-it-up guy down low. I'd say that both of the elder Plumlees are more solidly built and have shown to be more than willing to mix it up inside.

That said, I wouldn't be shocked to see Hairston get 10-15 mpg. He got 6 mpg last year in games he played (although he only played in about 75% of the games, so that's really like 4-5 mpg over the course of a season). Singler played probably 5 mpg at PF last year, so it's not unreasonable for those minutes to go to Hairston.

As for the first thought - I don't think it's even close when it comes to their lower bodies. That's a major weakness the Plumlees have; they can't carve out any space 'cause they ain't got no back! Hairston looks like he's added a lot of mass since the season (reportedly up to 235), and has quite a prominent posterior. He still tended to get low and lead with his lower body last year (unlike the Plumls), just wasn't quite strong enough; hopefully he'll make that mini-leap this year.

But I mean, I wouldn't be shocked if he registers some DNPs down the stretch either, with Miles, Mason and Ryan each getting 25-30 minutes. So we'll see.

[roywhite]

As for the first thought - I don't think it's even close when it comes to their lower bodies. That's a major weakness the Plumlees have; they can't carve out any space 'cause they ain't got no back! Hairston looks like he's added a lot of mass since the season (reportedly up to 235), and has quite a prominent posterior. He still tended to get low and lead with his lower body last year (unlike the Plumls), just wasn't quite strong enough; hopefully he'll make that mini-leap this year.

But I mean, I wouldn't be shocked if he registers some DNPs down the stretch either, with Miles, Mason and Ryan each getting 25-30 minutes. So we'll see.

Won't Josh also have to compete with Robo-Cop Alex and Silent G for minutes in the frontcourt, or do you see him more in the low post? Seems like a great guy, but he's really going to have to scratch for playing time IMO.

[CDu]

Won't Josh also have to compete with Robo-Cop Alex and Silent G for minutes in the frontcourt, or do you see him more in the low post? Seems like a great guy, but he's really going to have to scratch for playing time IMO.

Hairston didn't play the 3 at all last year, and I don't think he has any part of the game to play the 3 this year. So I don't think he's in competition with Gbinije for minutes. I haven't seen enough of Murphy to know whether he'll compete for minutes (and if so whether they'd be at the 3 or 4). But if Murphy is viewed as a 3, then he and Hairston won't be battling for minutes, either.

[sagegrouse]

Hairston didn't play the 3 at all last year, and I don't think he has any part of the game to play the 3 this year. So I don't think he's in competition with Gbinije for minutes. I haven't seen enough of Murphy to know whether he'll compete for minutes (and if so whether they'd be at the 3 or 4). But if Murphy is viewed as a 3, then he and Hairston won't be battling for minutes, either.

I don't recognize the number. Isn't that a Dean Smith concept? K doesn't assign players by position, the exception being point guard, but even then, more than one player in a lineup will bring the ball up the court. If Hairston has game, then he will get minutes.

I have no idea about Hairston, but I would observe that the most overlooked Duke players in this Forum are rising sophomores who didn't play much as freshmen. Last year, Andre was projected for relatively few minutes heading into the season. I look forward to a meaningful contribution from Josh this season.

And, of course, this year there will be fewer mysteries going into the season, despite the loss of three stars from last year: the China-Dubai trip will show us some lieup iterations that reflect the staff's view of the team.

sagegrouse

[Dukehky]

I agree that Hairston has added some weight, and the guy definitely has some back on him, but people are grossly overestimating his height. If you've stood next to him, he is 6'7 with shoes on, and from watching him in practice last year he's not exactly the most explosive guy on the floor. Again, the deeper we are up front, the better, its always important to have solid depth up front (we all know this from the 2004 disaster that was the Final Four game against UCONN), so I'm hoping he's got a lot more in him than I've seen and expect, I just have no reason to think that he's going to register any significant amount of playing time once big games start to roll around.


On a separate note, I've been at work for the past week without anything to do, so I've been going back through old Duke games online (IF you haven't done this and have time to kill, especially if you're a younger guy like me and didn't get to see/don't remember any of the older championship teams, go to vault.ncaa.com and vault.theacc.com to get to watch some awesome college games that you may not remember). But when going through these games and enjoying them thoroughly, does it seem to anyone else that everytime Duke smacks the floor, the other team scores? Even from recent games, they always seem to score, and this is coming from possibly the biggest fan of the floor smack in my age bracket. I'm not even saying I want it to stop, it just kinda sucks when they score on "our thing" 80% of the time.