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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO

    Talking MBB S16: Duke v. Arizona Pre-game and In-Game Thread

    First a big positive: Is it really true that since 1986 (26 years) Duke has gone at least as far as the Sweet Sixteen 20 times -- all but 1993, '95, '96, '97, 2007, '08?

    This year Duke draws 5th seeded Arizona, the PAC-10 regular season champ, who just beat Texas in a miracle finish. Zona, trailing by two at the 0:12 second mark with Texas having the ball, won by (a) a Texas five-second violation, (b) a brilliant inbounds pass, (c) a feed to star Derrick Williams, who was fouled and threw up a prayer -- which was answered. and (d) a made free throw for the one-point margin. Texas failed to get off a good shot in the scrum at the other end.

    Questions for the game (my thoughts, at least):

    1. How does Duke guard Derrick Williams, who is the only double-digit scorer on the Cats (19.2) and the tallest starter at 6-8? I guess we may see if the Plumlees can handle him. Zona is about the size of Michigan but seemed very athletic. Seven -footers Natyazhka and Jacobson play fewer than ten minutes and five minutes, respectively.

    2. Will Kyrie merge better into the offense? I thought there was a lot of hesitation when both Nolan and Kyrie were on the floor.

    3. Will Duke show the speed and energy needed to control the high-speed Cats? These kinds of teams have caused trouble in the past, and it may take better defense than against Michigan.

    4. Will Duke continue to have 5-6 scorers on the court Thursday (four in double figures today)? It is a really positive development of the last two weeks.

    sagegrouse

  2. #2
    The one thign about Williams is allot of times hes unselfish almost to a fault,hes not the type of player who will impose his will on the game for 40 minutes..

  3. #3
    I'm glad we play Arizona. I feel like we match up a lot better with them, rather Texas.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    My biggest concern against AZ is their lack of size/speed. Lack of size because Williams is their tallest starter and the Plums can't guard him, he shoots it from 3 and drives it too well. Therefore, who does that leave the Plums to guard??? AZ will spread us out and drive it.

    I would expect to see a lot of Kelly and Singler on Williams. The Plums might not get many minutes in this game based on matchups.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Randolph View Post
    Lack of size because Williams is their tallest starter and the Plums can't guard him, he shoots it from 3 and drives it too well.
    Match-ups work both ways. When dealing with a quality player such as Williams it is best to go right at him. We should dump the ball inside to Miles and/or Mason and force Williams to defend the Plumlees. It wouldn't hurt my feelings to see the Arizona All America pick up a couple of early fouls.

    There are multiples strategies available to employ. I expect we will frequently double team Williams when he has the ball. Of course it will all start with ball pressure on Arizona's point guard who has to deal with Nolan Smith's incessant defensive presence.
    Bob Green

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Green View Post
    Match-ups work both ways. When dealing with a quality player such as Williams it is best to go right at him. We should dump the ball inside to Miles and/or Mason and force Williams to defend the Plumlees. It wouldn't hurt my feelings to see the Arizona All America pick up a couple of early fouls.

    There are multiples strategies available to employ. I expect we will frequently double team Williams when he has the ball. Of course it will all start with ball pressure on Arizona's point guard who has to deal with Nolan Smith's incessant defensive presence.
    Bob, while I agree that the match-up could work both ways (and I'd love for us to get him in foul trouble), I can't see the Plums doing much against him offensively in the post. I mean we couldn't do anything against an even smaller, not as talented Michigan frontcourt. The Plums are way to inconsistent in the post and have a limited repetoire of moves. Nobody fears Duke when we throw it into the post

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Green View Post
    Match-ups work both ways. When dealing with a quality player such as Williams it is best to go right at him. We should dump the ball inside to Miles and/or Mason and force Williams to defend the Plumlees. It wouldn't hurt my feelings to see the Arizona All America pick up a couple of early fouls.

    There are multiples strategies available to employ. I expect we will frequently double team Williams when he has the ball. Of course it will all start with ball pressure on Arizona's point guard who has to deal with Nolan Smith's incessant defensive presence.
    I am increasingly hesitant about the idea of dumping it down low to either Plumlee to let them operate b/c they turn it over too much. If they have an open shot (Miles has a nice little jumper) or can go to work on that jump hook right away (Mason) or pass from the key to an open perimeter player, that's fine, but Mason in particular is turning the ball over trying to dribble across the lane and is also a terrible FT shooter and the the D can essentially cause a turn by fouling him in the 1-n-1 bonus.
    The MPs are rebounding well and playing pretty good D, and they've been providing enough offense, but looking to them specifically to generate O is not what I would do with our offense.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington DC

    Passive?

    Several people have posted that Derrick Williams can be too passive at times. If he's as good as they say and "only" averaged 19 ppg that may be true. I remember two years ago when Blake Griffin played vs. Unc in the Elite 8 and spent the whole first half trying to get his teammates involved, but failed to put pressure on the D. They dug themselves a hole they could not crawl out of. So I'd love it if Derrick Williams defers a lot early on. I like our chances of defending Arizona in that scenario.

    Also, Nolan's on-ball defense has been incredible of late - Marshall in the ACCT final and on Morris vs. Michigan yesterday. If he can keep that up for the bulk of the game, our defense leaps to another level. He's incredibly disruptive.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Durham, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Randolph View Post
    My biggest concern against AZ is their lack of size/speed. Lack of size because Williams is their tallest starter and the Plums can't guard him, he shoots it from 3 and drives it too well. Therefore, who does that leave the Plums to guard??? AZ will spread us out and drive it.

    I would expect to see a lot of Kelly and Singler on Williams. The Plums might not get many minutes in this game based on matchups.
    I'm worried about the same exact thing. I much prefer when Duke goes big, but against Arizona we may see a lot of Dawkins. I think Mason and Singler will be out there on Williams. They are the only ones that have anywhere near his Athleticism.

    Of course Coach K put Kelly on VPI's Allen so who knows?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington DC
    The big guys will have to communicate a lot and help each other out on Williams. Double downs and help side D will be necessary to slow him. I think Kyle could be the designated helper in many situations. We saw him play that role vs. Jordan Williams. I'm most concerned with Williams abilities on the perimeter because it could pull all our defenders out of the paint. We'll need the guards to help crash the boards and cover the backside on D.

    Most importantly, Duke needs to control the pace and maintain their focus, energy and intensity for 40 minutes. All tough games the rest of the way.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Charlotte
    I've checked the CBS site and couldn't find the time of the game. I am assuming it is Thursday, and the early game. Does anyone know for sure?

    My wife bought tickets to go see Prince. I hate to put everything on hold this time of year, and feel like if I plan to do something on the weekend it will turn out to be when Duke plays. Not bad, considering the alternative is Duke not playing.

    Any help is appreciated. We got through, look forward to playing another team we have a history with.

  12. #12
    Why can't the Plums guard Williams? He seems like a much more refined Mason. He shoots it much better from the perimeter and he can actually finish on his dribble drives. But luckily,we don't need Mason to outscore him, we just need him to play solid defense on him. I don't think this game will be like the one today where the Plumlees couldn't guard anyone as Thompson held Williams in check until he got into foul trouble.

    Singler will have his hands full with Hill and Duke could go to Singler at the 4 quite a bit but that puts KI and Nolan on the court at the same time after another week of practice. So that leaves about 15 fouls to put on Williams and it'd be nice to see KI draw a few fouls on Williams.

    But my main concern is their 3 point shooting. They won't spread the floor as much as Michigan and hopefully, K uses his extra days to prepare a nice game plan.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by sporthenry View Post
    Why can't the Plums guard Williams? He seems like a much more refined Mason.

    This is like saying Tim Duncan is a "much more refined" Casey Sanders.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by KandG View Post
    This is like saying Tim Duncan is a "much more refined" Casey Sanders.
    Well I don't think the gap is that far. And again, Mason isn't expected to score, he just has to play defense on him and Williams was really bothered by Thompson's length today. If Mason can stay in front but contest his outside shot, Williams is ripe for some offensive fouls when he barrels to the basket.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington DC
    Quote Originally Posted by sporthenry View Post
    Well I don't think the gap is that far. And again, Mason isn't expected to score, he just has to play defense on him and Williams was really bothered by Thompson's length today. If Mason can stay in front but contest his outside shot, Williams is ripe for some offensive fouls when he barrels to the basket.
    I expect Mason to score. We cant win playing 4 on 5 or 3 on 5. He and Miles have gotten some nice looks inside the last 4-5 games. They've also really gone after offensive rebounds with relish too.

    We do need to use out mass on the inside though. Punish anyone who comes into the paint. We've got the bodies to do so, and it would be nice to make Arizona a perimeter team.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by superdave View Post
    I expect Mason to score. We cant win playing 4 on 5 or 3 on 5. He and Miles have gotten some nice looks inside the last 4-5 games. They've also really gone after offensive rebounds with relish too.

    We do need to use out mass on the inside though. Punish anyone who comes into the paint. We've got the bodies to do so, and it would be nice to make Arizona a perimeter team.
    Well he will probably get some easy buckets but I'm saying we won't be dropping it down to the Plumlees in the post 20 times a game. I expect to see some oops and easy back door cuts and baskets but I doubt he is posting up on Williams too much unless we are trying to draw some fouls.

  17. #17
    Vegas opened with Duke as a 10 point favorite.

  18. #18

    Prince Concert??

    I thought Prince. got knocked out in the 2nd round by Kentucky...

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lexington, SC
    Will we be the early or late game on Thursday?

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Columbus, OH
    Quote Originally Posted by dbd4ever View Post
    Will we be the early or late game on Thursday?
    I don't think it has been announced yet but I would be shocked if Duke/Zona wasn't the 2nd game.

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