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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Seattle, WA

    MBB: (ACCT Semifinals) Duke 77, Virginia Tech 63 Post-Game Thread

    Revenge tastes sweet!
    Just be you. You is enough. - K, 4/5/10, 0:13.8 to play, 60-59 Duke.

    You're all jealous hypocrites. - Titus on Laettner

    You see those guys? Animals. They're animals. - SIU Coach Chris Lowery, on Duke

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Decatur, GA
    Whew! Glad that's over, now on to obsessing about the championship game tomorrow.

  3. #3
    Learned a lot today:

    1) We should coach our guys to throw their face at the shooter's elbow so they can draw an offense techical foul

    2) Nolan is nails!

    3) Kyle is nails!

    4) Duke is nails!

  4. #4
    Worst officiating I've ever seen. Ever.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington DC
    Survive and advance, with a special emphasis on survive vs. VPI.

    I thought we had nice contributions from everyone today. Nice to see the balance two games in a row. Also, special hello and thank you to Nolan's 2nd toe for its contributions today. Thanks, guy.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Good win, glad to see Nolan back to himself. Thought as a whole we were inconsistent and it was frustrating to see some missed open shots (3's and close ones) and too many careless turnovers.

    So far we've won our 2 games by 16 and 14, considering the struggles of many other teams in conference tourneys, can't complain too much

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by diveonthefloor View Post
    Learned a lot today:

    1) We should coach our guys to throw their face at the shooter's elbow so they can draw an offense techical foul
    Won't work. Remember when Kyle's face hit that guys elbow as the VT player threw his arm into Kyle's face, and Kyle got called for the foul?

  8. #8

    Elbow Rule

    Someone in the in-game thread said Dawkins = Shav on that foul. I think Dawkins = Daniel Ewing might be more apt. In a quick search on the rule, I was only able to find this from the women's basketball manual:

    Rule 10-1 Personal fouls (live ball contact)
    When the action of the arm(s) and elbows resulting from total body movement, as in pivoting or movement of the ball incidental to feinting (faking) with it, releasing it, or moving it to prevent a held ball or loss of control, illegally contacts an opponent BELOW the shoulders during a live ball, that illegal contact may not be considered a flagrant foul for excessive swinging (Rule 4-36.7), but a personal foul, common or intentional, has been committed.
    When the action of the arm(s) and elbows resulting from total body movement, as in pivoting or movement of the ball incidental to feinting (faking) with it, releasing it, or moving it to prevent a held ball or loss of control, illegally contacts an opponent ABOVE the shoulders during a live ball, that illegal contact may not be considered a flagrant foul for excessive swinging (Rule 4-36.7), but a minimum of an intentional foul has been committed.
    Any foul involving excessive swinging of the arm(s) and elbow(s) (Rule 4-36.7), either above or below the shoulders during a live ball, or that otherwise meets the requirements of Rule 4-29.2.c and 4-29.3.f.1 shall be penalized by a flagrant personal foul.

  9. #9
    How could VT bounce the ball off Dawkins when Dawkins was standing out of bounds and retain the ball?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Great defense today. But 15 turnovers on 11 assists is a recipe for disaster tomorrow

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by grannyduke View Post
    How could VT bounce the ball off Dawkins when Dawkins was standing out of bounds and retain the ball?
    That was the correct call, but throwing off Andre's face was a little over the top

  12. #12
    Nolan was playing ANGRY all game. Man, is he tough. Glad to see Andre playing well again (esp on D) - even though the officials did their best effort to ruin it. Also loved the way Mason and Miles played inside. What a good effort.

    Gripes: Virginia Tech doesn't play physical basketball, they play violent basketball. Additionally, the players have no control of their emotions at all (Delaney and Allen were so frustrated by Nolan and Kyle, respectively); I dislike Greenberg with a passion. That was also probably the worst officiating I have seen this year, on both sides. K's laughing at the foul and T on Andre says it all - that was (no hyperbole) the single worst call I have ever seen in a Duke game. Ever. It would have been the worst overall if not for the St. Johns and Rutgers debacle.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Inman, SC & Fort Myers, FL
    The best revenge of all would be for the NCAA once again to leave VT out of the NCAAs. They won't, but maybe they will make them play on Tuesday. Take what we can get.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North Raleigh
    That felt good!

    Aside from our traditional rival, I dislike VT the 2nd most in the conference. These Nouveau Riche wannabes would not BE in the conference if not for the power play the Virginia State Legislature applied. These guys think they are the new Maryland.. take that and the horse you rode in on Uncle Fester..


    Re: the game.
    I see lots of balance and confidence re-emerging. Mason looking aggressive providing just enuff interior Offense to command some attention.

    Andre re asserting himself is good to see. (He was fouled on THAT drive. He had his hand on the ball taking a shot, not a wild swing. Allen MADE it the issue.. he prolly could have gotten away with BOTH of those elbows IF he had show some restraint and not beaned Dre in the Face)

    Seth continuing to shoe nice moves and decisions. He slithers and is deceptive witht he ball.

    Kelly taking and making a closer shot is good to see, instead of 6 missed 3s..

    Singler continues to DRIVE and not settle for the 3. This has been missing for a while and I'm glad to see it back. I hope he can manage to get some fouls go his way. He seems like a punching bag just taking it and taking it... Not say he doesn't give as good as he gets... but when his fouls are called they a ticky-tak holds and bumps. He doesn't get a favorable exchange rate on the contact vs: no calls

    Miles taking and making shots in an offensive flow.

    Nolan did not seem bothered one bit! this Dude is amazing we are privileged to have been watching his transformation over 4 yrs.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by mgtr View Post
    The best revenge of all would be for the NCAA once again to leave VT out of the NCAAs.
    I am going to enjoy pulling for whoever is playing VT in the first round. And I mean whoever! Typically, I pull for all ACC teams to win in the NCAAT in order to enhance conference reputation, but I will not pull for VT under any circumstances. I hope the (C)Hokies lose by 20+ points!
    Bob Green

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Greenville, SC
    I thought the elbow call on Dre was horrible, and likely wouldn't have been made had Allen not picked up the swinging elbow tech earlier. However a look at the rule book shows that maybe some clarification to the rulebook is in order. While I still don't think the foul on Dre met the spirit of the rule, the ambiguous language could justify at least a personal foul.

    Here's what the book says:

    {From the men's points of emphasis}
    Excessive Swinging of the Elbows
    Last year, there were increases in excessive swinging of the elbows. This
    action should not be ignored because of the associated danger to another
    player. Contact resulting from an illegally thrown elbow can cause serious
    injury. Consequently, excessive swinging of the elbow(s) is a point of
    emphasis.
    When the arm and elbow, with the shoulder as a base (pivot) are swung
    with a speed that exceeds the rest of the body as it rotates on the hips or on
    the pivot foot, that action is considered to be excessive. Contact, after such
    an action, shall not be ignored but shall be called a flagrant foul. When the
    player’s arm(s) and elbow(s) are swung excessively but without contact, a
    violation has been committed.
    When the arms and elbows and the rest of the body move with the same or
    similarly generated speed and contact occurs, that contact is not considered to
    be excessive. However, the contact is illegal, and a foul shall be assessed.


    {From rule 10 section 1}
    Art. 13. When the action of the elbow(s) resulting from total body movement
    contacts an opponent, that contact may not be considered excessive but a
    personal foul has been committed.

    I can't imagine that the rules committee collectively would think that was a foul if they saw the video tape. Allen's foul, however, swinging elbows at shoulder level without the ball, clearly met both the spirit and the letter of the rule.

  17. #17

    Lots of observations.

    Nolan played well despite having a foot which must have been sore. I like Nolan's scoring from a variety of angles. He wasn't totally sharp in his shooting but was under pressure. What I particulaly liked was his defense which was hardnosed and aggressive on DeLaney the entire game. He also made a couple of excellent passes inside for dunks and another that should have been.

    What I didn't like was the concept of stall using Nolan to hold the ball, and then drive with about 7 seconds left. There were numerous times it didn't work, either through a charge or a turnover. I much prefer working the ball for a good shot opportunity and taking it when it presents itself. No 3's early in the clock but if a dunk opportunity presents itself, why not take it?

    Kyle had an excellent game. His defensive presence and rebounding are excellent and he got the offense rolling a couple of times after it had stalled. He didn't get a lot of points but he also didn't take a lot of shots.

    Andre played very well. Hard for me to understand why Allen wasn't called for a premeditated fast ball to Andre's face while he was standing out of bounds. Also the call on Andre's drive made no sense as he didn't swing his arms, just went up for a normal shot. Glad to see that he is back.

    Mason has also grown a lot during the season, with shot blocking, rebounding and excellent passing. He made a couple of beauties, including a bounce pass to Ryan for a quick 2. He got some points as did the other bigs.

    Miles also played very well and we certainly seemed to have a rebounding advantage, Miles picked up a few points. He can score, but one has to be judicious on how a pass is made to him, since he isn't as fluid as Mason.

    What a great thing to have three bigs who can provide solide minutes. Ryan played very well again and is probably the best of the three in scoring around the basket.

    Seth again did his job well. He has minimized turnovers and is kind of a ball hawk when guarding. Nice to see Tyler and Josh get a few minutes as well.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Raleigh
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Ash View Post
    Worst officiating I've ever seen. Ever.
    Worse than the 2004 semi-final game vs uCONvicts?

  19. #19

    Happy for Curry

    Glad Seth had a solid game with 10 points after the rough night two weeks ago in Blacksburg ... speaking of things Curry: what were those t-shirts that his mom and dad had on? ... looked the Iron Duke "D" logo in the middle with "The One Behind" (?) in a circle around the "D" ... a play on the "One" poster? -- don't know if I read the shirt right ... in a side note, Sonya Curry won two state high school championships in b'ball, and today in Virginia her old girls team captured yet another state crown (its 6th (my niece is on the team) ...

  20. #20
    Apparently, Jon Scheyer thought the new rule applied to Andre's layup / phantom charge call was a bit over the top:

    Here's Jon's tweet:

    JonScheyer

    I've never seen a call like that before in my life @swallball... What is @dre_day20 supposed to do????

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