10 second violation

[diveonthefloor]

Can't find this posted elsewhere (mods please merge this if it is)

From the NCAA 2010-2011 rule book:

Section 10. (Men) 10-Second Violation
An inbounds player (and his team) shall not be in continuous control of a
ball that is in his back court for 10 consecutive seconds.

Before I found this, my previous impression was the same as Elmore's and Patrick's last night. (OMG, I can't believe I thought Elmore was right???)

From reading the rule book, it sounds as if the correct call WAS indeed made. Are there any officials out there who can provide further clarification?

[PADukeMom]

I didn't have an issue with this call since it was correct. Tyler has to be more aware of time. He came close to doing it a second time towards the end of the game.

[jv001]

This was another call that Elmore kept talking about as the game was going on. Like you, I would love to know if we 're both looking at this rule correctly. If so, I wish I had waited to e-mail my elmore complaint to ESPN. Go Duke!

[airowe]

I didn't have an issue with this call since it was correct. Tyler has to be more aware of time. He came close to doing it a second time towards the end of the game.

He lost control of the ball, not track of time.

[gus]

Can't find this posted elsewhere (mods please merge this if it is)

From the NCAA 2010-2011 rule book:

Section 10. (Men) 10-Second Violation
An inbounds player (and his team) shall not be in continuous control of a
ball that is in his back court for 10 consecutive seconds.

Before I found this, my previous impression was the same as Elmore's and Patrick's last night. (OMG, I can't believe I thought Elmore was right???)

From reading the rule book, it sounds as if the correct call WAS indeed made. Are there any officials out there who can provide further clarification?

I'm curious- what was Elmore's impression? What happened? (I unfortunately was not able to see the game)

[diveonthefloor]

I'm curious- what was Elmore's impression? What happened? (I unfortunately was not able to see the game)

TT had the ball in backcourt and made a long pass as the shot clock got to 26 second...the ball crossed half court and wasn't "Caught" by his Duke teammate until the clock had already reached 25 seconds.

The announcers and Clemson bench were surprised that a 10 sec violation wasn't called. So was I.

[jv001]

I'm curious- what was Elmore's impression? What happened? (I unfortunately was not able to see the game)

Elmore and Patrick both said the refs blew the call and Duke should have been called for the 10 second violation. Patrick even said that it wasn't close, when the replay indicated that if the announcers were correct it was touched in our front court in 11 seconds. Just another way of saying Duke get's all the calls. GoDuke!

[davekay1971]

TT had the ball in backcourt and made a long pass as the shot clock got to 26 second...the ball crossed half court and wasn't "Caught" by his Duke teammate until the clock had already reached 25 seconds.

The announcers and Clemson bench were surprised that a 10 sec violation wasn't called. So was I.

I was at the game and was surprised that it wasn't called. I was also surprised no foul was called on Nolan's drive to the basket early in the game when his head was nearly removed by a Clemson defender (Nolan was still working his neck around 30 seconds later at the other end of the court). Since I blessedly couldn't hear Elmore, could someone tell me exactly how much time Lenny spent discussing THAT missed call?

[HK Dukie]

They kept harping on this no call even though Clemson got possession right after this play.

How many other teams do you think they would have done repeated slow mo graphics to clamor that duke got a call.

Ridiculous.

Wouldn't it be nice just for once if we can listen to announcers who don't mention the refs a single time during the game?

[DukeUsul]

It is interesting to note that the officials count off the ten seconds themselves, using that same hand-slash motion they use to count off a 5-second inbounds timer or 5-seconds closely guarded. You can watch the official on that play count as the ball is coming upcourt. He had counted to 8 and was just counting 9 when the ball made it to the frontcourt. You can see he's counting slower than the game-clock, especially as he got near the end.

It seems to me that in the reality of the game, the officials frequently count a bit slower than "real" seconds on many of these types of situations. My hope is that if they do, that they are counting off consistently for both teams across all of these kinds of counts.

[jv001]

They kept harping on this no call even though Clemson got possession right after this play.

How many other teams do you think they would have done repeated slow mo graphics to clamor that duke got a call.

Ridiculous.

Wouldn't it be nice just for once if we can listen to announcers who don't mention the refs a single time during the game?

I agree it would be nice, but I can't think of another announcer that brings it up every Duke game that he announces. Now when Billy Packer was working the games he was just a bad as Elmore. One from twerpville and the other a Demon Deacon. Both so jealous it's almost funny. Go Duke!

[killerleft]

I was at the game and was surprised that it wasn't called. I was also surprised no foul was called on Nolan's drive to the basket early in the game when his head was nearly removed by a Clemson defender (Nolan was still working his neck around 30 seconds later at the other end of the court). Since I blessedly couldn't hear Elmore, could someone tell me exactly how much time Lenny spent discussing THAT missed call?

I don't know the rule, but saying the ball even passed the half-court line at the 25 sec. mark is being kind to Duke.

[DukeUsul]

Can't find this posted elsewhere (mods please merge this if it is)

From the NCAA 2010-2011 rule book:

Section 10. (Men) 10-Second Violation
An inbounds player (and his team) shall not be in continuous control of a
ball that is in his back court for 10 consecutive seconds.

Before I found this, my previous impression was the same as Elmore's and Patrick's last night. (OMG, I can't believe I thought Elmore was right???)

From reading the rule book, it sounds as if the correct call WAS indeed made. Are there any officials out there who can provide further clarification?

Let's follow your line of thinking and see if the rules say anything about what "in his back court" means. Here's the definition:

Rule 4. Section 3. Art 3.
a. A ball that is in contact with a player or with the playing court shall
be in the back court when either the ball or the player (either player
when the ball is touching more than one) is touching the back court.
It shall be in the front court when neither the ball nor the player is
touching the back court.
b. A ball that is not in contact with a player or the playing court retains
the same status as when it was last in contact with a player or the
playing court.
c. During a dribble from back court to front court, the ball shall be in
the front court when both feet of the dribbler and the ball touch the
playing court entirely in the front court.

So while the ball was in the air (even while it had passed the time line) it was still "in the back court" having retained its previous status. It's not "In the front court" until the player catches it and has both feet in the front court.

[Gewebe14]

Also, Nolan was called for an offensive foul with the next 2 seconds once they realized they might have screwed up the call.

[jv001]

Also, Nolan was called for an offensive foul with the next 2 seconds once they realized they might have screwed up the call.

This is a great point, as I said when Nolan was called for the foul. Make up call!!! Go Duke!

[wgl1228]

ESPN loves Duke for their ratings but thats it. Not all, but many of their on air commentators have an anti-Duke bias that is quite obvious. I know it has been discussed how Duke is the only team absent from Sports Center's introduction. (Aubern was immediately put up by the way.) Anyway I know I am not the only one noticing this.

[Wander]

They kept harping on this no call even though Clemson got possession right after this play.

Weirdly, we can make an even stronger statement here. The no-call on the 10 seconds was a bad call that benefit Clemson and hurt Duke. The reason is that Nolan Smith was called for an offensive foul immediately after - so instead of a Duke turnover, Clemson got both a Duke turnover and a Duke foul.

[Rudy]

Well, also they go by a hand count instead of watching the clock. Does the shot clock start only after the inbounds pass is made or does it start upon the made basket?

[dukee94]

Also, Nolan was called for an offensive foul with the next 2 seconds once they realized they might have screwed up the call.

Small correction, the offensive foul was on Tyler Thornton, not Nolan Smith.

[DukeUsul]

Well, also they go by a hand count instead of watching the clock. Does the shot clock start only after the inbounds pass is made or does it start upon the made basket?

The shot clock starts when the player on the court receiving the inbounds pass touches the ball.

Rule 2 Section 11 "Duties of Shot-clock Operator"
Art. 5. Start the timing device when a player inbounds legally touches or is
touched by the ball on a throw-in or when a team initially gains possession from
a jump ball, an unsuccessful try for goal or when possession is gained of a loose
ball after a jump ball or unsuccessful try for goal.