The Kyrie Irving Toe Rehab Vigil

[meloveduke]

"I agree with Uh_no on this, but I'm curious to know: on what do you base your assertion that Kyrie would fix our slow starts? The numbers don't support your view.

In the 8 games in which Kyrie played in the first half (through Butler), our overall 1st half shooting percentage was .4475, including a 3-point shooting percentage of .3229. In the 21 games since Kyrie, our first half shooting percentage has been .4476 (ever so slightly better than when we had Kyrie, though admittedly negligibly so), including a 3-point percentage of .3389 (also better than when Kyrie was playing). Furthermore, the average Pomeroy ranking of teams we played when Kyrie was in the lineup is 107.0. Since Kyrie went out, the average Pomeroy ranking of our opponents is 96.5. So, we've achieved higher shooting percentages in first halves without Kyrie AND against stiffer competition."


I have not looked it up, but I bet you will see that in the 8 games we had KI we took a few more shots then without KI. Taking that into acount, KI would infact cure or at least help cure the slow starts. One other thing that would help out is Singler. He was doing good when KI was playing, but the past two weeks he has been off. Him being off makes it that much harder to score for the team too.

[gam7]

I have not looked it up, but I bet you will see that in the 8 games we had KI we took a few more shots then without KI. Taking that into acount, KI would infact cure or at least help cure the slow starts. One other thing that would help out is Singler. He was doing good when KI was playing, but the past two weeks he has been off. Him being off makes it that much harder to score for the team too.

In the first halves of games with Kyrie, we took an average of 32.1 shots. After Kyrie, we averaged 31.4 shots per 1st half. So, less than 1 shot per game more with Kyrie than without. In the grand scheme of things, that difference is negligible.

I think you're right that we did play at a faster tempo with Kyrie (although I haven't run those numbers to confirm). But that means that even if we score slightly more because of the faster pace and slightly greater number of shots per game, our opponents would have more possessions (and presumably take more shots) as well.

[bjornolf]

Were we scoring more/shooting more FTs with him? It seems his penetration abilities would have created more of those opportunities too. We've had some games lately where we've hardly gotten to the line at all. His ability to slash the defense seems like it would naturally help with the slow starts. Nolan's really been working on that since KI went down. Imagining the two of them doing that is just scary...

[papa whiskey]

You can cite any numbers you want. Shooting percentage, 3 point percentage, possessions per 40 minutes..... Whatever. At the end of the day, when I watched this team the first 8 games with Kyrie, whether it was against K-State, Michigan State, or East Cupcake A&M, it looked and seemed to me like we were playing a brand of basketball where if we played our best game we were 10+ points better than anybody else in the country on a neutral court on any given night. Now, without Kyrie, we are still a very good team but it seem as though the discussion and I would say the reality about our team has shifted. Now it's a question of how we stack up against the best teams in the country and what we have to do to beat them in the tournament. Where as before, at least in my opinion, the question was what does team-x or team-y have to do to hang with Duke for 40 minutes. JMHO.

[-jk]

If Kyrie manages to come back, he won't be the same player and Duke won't be the same team. It'll be Duke 2011 v3.

I have faith that K is capable of managing that transition, though, if Kyrie is able to contribute. K has a track record in shuffling a team to make it better.

-jk

[papa whiskey]

If Kyrie manages to come back, he won't be the same player and Duke won't be the same team. It'll be Duke 2011 v3.

I have faith that K is capable of managing that transition, though, if Kyrie is able to contribute. K has a track record in shuffling a team to make it better.

-jk

I agree to an extent. A much lesser coach than K could figure out how to integrate a point guard who can break peoples ankles. I do feel however that we can be at least close to that team from earlier this year. Kyrie from all accounts has been completely involved with the team in all aspects except for actually playing. If he is going to come back I believe it has been known for a while among the players and coaching staff. If that is the case, he should be able to step back in to the point guard roll in at least a similar fashion to earlier this season. Again, he is just too good a player and way too good a human being, as seen from his continued participation and enthusiasm for this team to not be able to come back and contribute immediately.

[dukebluesincebirth]

This is so confusing to me... There is absolutely nothing to lead me to believe Kyrie is coming back except for these tweets. There was another one last night about Seth Davis' sons sprinkling magic dust on kyrie's toe, and kyrie tweeted that it was definitely working, so tell em thanks! (listed earlier on this thread)
I mean, all these tweets seem to have a strong tone of at least Kyrie thinking he's coming back. Also, I just can't see Coach K allowing these tones of messages to continue to be released to the public by Kyrie if he didn't think Kyrie was coming back.
I can't believe it but I'm beginning to think that the way we're going to get the first official word on Kyrie's season, is from TWITTER!

[Newton_14]

They only make a couple jerseys a year and they come without names (NCAA rules) this year they have 2 and 12. It was rumored though that Dick's was selling #1 jerseys a couple of months ago, not sure if they still are.

Actually the Duke store on Campus is loaded with Kyrie jersey's. They have his along with Nolan and Kyle's. No names on the back of course. Dick's Sporting Goods also have them.

[MIKESJ73]

This is so confusing to me... There is absolutely nothing to lead me to believe Kyrie is coming back except for these tweets. There was another one last night about Seth Davis' sons sprinkling magic dust on kyrie's toe, and kyrie tweeted that it was definitely working, so tell em thanks! (listed earlier on this thread)
I mean, all these tweets seem to have a strong tone of at least Kyrie thinking he's coming back. Also, I just can't see Coach K allowing these tones of messages to continue to be released to the public by Kyrie if he didn't think Kyrie was coming back.
I can't believe it but I'm beginning to think that the way we're going to get the first official word on Kyrie's season, is from TWITTER!

I don't know much about twitter but it looks like about the same time Seth Davis said that he would be shocked if Kyrie ever plays for Duke again, I may be misinterpretting it though...

I'll be shocked if he ever plays for Duke again RT @JessIsBest4You: Rumor has it Kyrie Irving may make his return this week. Is he 1 & done?
about 21 hours ago via TweetDeck

[UrinalCake]

Whatever. At the end of the day, when I watched this team the first 8 games with Kyrie, whether it was against K-State, Michigan State, or East Cupcake A&M, it looked and seemed to me like we were playing a brand of basketball where if we played our best game we were 10+ points better than anybody else in the country on a neutral court on any given night.

I don't agree with this. We beat Michigan State by five points at home. We beat Marquette by five on a neutral court. We struggled mightily against Butler. None of these teams are likely to make the tournament. We were a better team with Kyrie, but by no means unbeatable.

[uh_no]

I don't agree with this. We beat Michigan State by five points at home. We beat Marquette by five on a neutral court. We struggled mightily against Butler. None of these teams are likely to make the tournament. We were a better team with Kyrie, but by no means unbeatable.

Until we lose with him, we're unbeatable :P or at least that's how I see it.

[Kedsy]

I don't agree with this. We beat Michigan State by five points at home. We beat Marquette by five on a neutral court. We struggled mightily against Butler. None of these teams are likely to make the tournament. We were a better team with Kyrie, but by no means unbeatable.

I could end up being wrong, but I expect all three of those teams to be in the NCAAT. But I agree with your sentiment that the "legend of Kyrie" paints our squad as better with Kyrie than we actually were. Having said that, with Kyrie I think we were clearly the best team in the country, and now we're just one of the best five. Personally, I'm OK with being one of the best five, though. We have a good shot at the Final Four, and that's all you can ask at this time of year.

[dukefan75]

If kyrie never ends up coming back, then all this mess will have been one long and meaningless distraction to the coaches/team/fans. The compnay line has always been "we dont expect him back" while at the same time we have tweets, rehab videos, speculated columns, etc. But please explain to me the downside of earlier on coming out and definitively just saying---He is OUT for the year. I mean, this isnt the NFL where an athlete goes on injured reserve and he cant come back. In that instance, at least everyone could have really moved on and rooted/appreciated the team we have, instead of trying to or pretending to. If the day came where he could actually play, then they can announce a major change in plans and go thru the revisionist history of whether he was really declared out.

[dukebluesincebirth]

If kyrie never ends up coming back, then all this mess will have been one long and meaningless distraction to the coaches/team/fans. The compnay line has always been "we dont expect him back" while at the same time we have tweets, rehab videos, speculated columns, etc. But please explain to me the downside of earlier on coming out and definitively just saying---He is OUT for the year. I mean, this isnt the NFL where an athlete goes on injured reserve and he cant come back. In that instance, at least everyone could have really moved on and rooted/appreciated the team we have, instead of trying to or pretending to. If the day came where he could actually play, then they can announce a major change in plans and go thru the revisionist history of whether he was really declared out.

I can relate to you on this one...I guess I'll feel a little letdown if he never plays for Duke again after all the encouraging tweets. I'm a little surprised that he's allowed to continue tweeting such encouraging messages if they know he's out for the season. Like I stated in an earlier post, the tweets have been the most encouraging signs of info thus far and have kind of kept me from totally giving up.

I've gotten no other info besides tweets that leads me to believe he's coming back. So if that is the case, I wish he would just go ahead and tweet something like:
"it's not looking good for this year, but thanks for all the support"

Then we could all officially move on. I know the obsessiveness is mostly my own doing, but it's very difficult to remain in this limbo when it's such a high caliber player.

[Marcus]

If Kyrie was going to be out for the rest of the season... then why in the hell would'nt they just say it. He's going to return guys... It's not because they don't know if he will come back, it's just they dont know the EXACT date. Why would Coach K just say, "he's done for the season, if he's actually done for the season?"

[moonpie23]

aarrrggghhh....it doesn't matter....we were all deprived of watching some real history....maybe... MAYBE the greatest freshman season EVER....


arggh...it's soooooo frustrating....


ok, i'm better now...no more coffee for me...

[Jackson]

I keep checking this thread with the hope that somehow, some way there will be new information here, but to no avail! I quit! I'm not looking anymore until I see something meaningful on the front page!!

[jimrowe0]

If Kyrie was going to be out for the rest of the season... then why in the hell would'nt they just say it. He's going to return guys... It's not because they don't know if he will come back, it's just they dont know the EXACT date. Why would Coach K just say, "he's done for the season, if he's actually done for the season?"

My sentiments exactly. Kyrie will likely be back, but the exact date isn't known.

[CDu]

If Kyrie was going to be out for the rest of the season... then why in the hell would'nt they just say it. He's going to return guys... It's not because they don't know if he will come back, it's just they dont know the EXACT date. Why would Coach K just say, "he's done for the season, if he's actually done for the season?"

As I said before: you don't say he's done for the season unless you know FOR SURE that he's done for the season. If (purely for example) there's a 10% chance he comes back, you don't say he's done for the season. You just say you don't expect him to return.

The fact that no one has said "he's done for the season" isn't proof that he's coming back. It is just proof that they don't know for sure if he's done for the season or not. The probability that he returns could be (roughly) anywhere between 1% and 99% (since they've also not said he's definitely coming back). All we know is that:
1. he's not definitely done for the season; and
2. he's not definitely coming back this season.

Nothing else can be logically gleaned from the absence of a statement that "he's done for the season" or that "he's coming back."

[Indoor66]

My sentiments exactly. Kyrie will likely be back, but the exact date isn't known.

And the place and the team.