NC State and Sidney Lowe

[loran16]

Tubby Smith is a name that I have heard a few times... He would be great for the conference.

Tubby's interesting, but it depends really...first, a move to NC State would put Tubby back at a school with a demanding fanbase who has high expectations, though not as bad as Kentucky. Meanwhile, Tubby wouldn't have as good of a recruiting advantage as UK did. Meanwhile at Minnesota, Tubby's gotten a good program on its way to the tourny, so it seems.

In other words, I'm not sure if NC State is an improvement in Tubby's mind. It would certainly be a good hire for NC State.

[wilson]

...I'm not sure if NC State is an improvement in Tubby's mind. It would certainly be a good hire for NC State.

Moreover, Tubby is currently making about three times Lowe's annual salary, with incentives that could potentially push it to four times higher in any given year (an upper limit of $3.3 million, compared to a ceiling of about $850K for Sidney). In fact, according to this, Tubby is the highest-paid employee in University of Minnesota history.
Presumably, the folks in Raleigh will understand that they'll need to bump compensation up if they want to lure a big name to follow Lowe, but I highly doubt if they'll bump it up that much. That may be part of the overall problem in and of itself, but that's tangential to this discussion IMO.

[loran16]

Moreover, Tubby is currently making about three times Lowe's annual salary, with incentives that could potentially push it to four times higher in any given year (an upper limit of $3.3 million, compared to a ceiling of about $850K for Sidney). In fact, according to this, Tubby is the highest-paid employee in University of Minnesota history.
Presumably, the folks in Raleigh will understand that they'll need to bump compensation up if they want to lure a big name to follow Lowe, but I highly doubt if they'll bump it up that much. That may be part of the overall problem in and of itself, but that's tangential to this discussion IMO.

I thought NC State had offered a huge contract to Calipari, and thus money wasn't an issue (they paid Lowe little because he was the last option).

[wilson]

I thought NC State had offered a huge contract to Calipari, and thus money wasn't an issue (they paid Lowe little because he was the last option).

Good call; I'd forgotten that, but according to this and this, they made offers in the neighborhood of $2 million to Calipari and one or two others (Rick Barnes included), which is still a couple of notches below Tubby's pay grade. They'd presumably be willing to go back to those numbers for the right candidate, but I wouldn't think they'd go another 50% higher.

[dukediv2011]

I think something has to be said about the competitiveness of major college basketball coaches and the appreciation of the fan base. Tubby is in a great place at Minnesota. He has a good program, he is making a large salary, and he has a decent fan base. However, if he were to come to NC State he would be in the heart of conference which has won 5 of 10 NCAA Championships, and he would have the chance to prove that he could recruit and coach against the best coaches in college basketball today (Roy and K).

I think Tubby wants to be seen on that same level and would be willing to take the challenge at NC State where Rick Barnes and Calipari were not willing to take the risk and lose their current status (even though neither has won a NCAA Championship).

I also think that NC State is going to be willing to pay whatever they want to get someone great.

[JasonEvans]

So, now that it appears the team has all but quit on El Sid, will Yow even wait until the season is over to get rid of him?

The total lack of effort on defense in the first half against Duke was absurd and embarrassing for State. I can't imagine the Administration wanting to watch a few more weeks of this Sidney Lowe Death March.

--Jason "Is there any reason to keep him after you have decided to get rid of him?" Evans

[sagegrouse]

I think something has to be said about the competitiveness of major college basketball coaches and the appreciation of the fan base. Tubby is in a great place at Minnesota. He has a good program, he is making a large salary, and he has a decent fan base. However, if he were to come to NC State he would be in the heart of conference which has won 5 of 10 NCAA Championships, and he would have the chance to prove that he could recruit and coach against the best coaches in college basketball today (Roy and K).

I think Tubby wants to be seen on that same level and would be willing to take the challenge at NC State where Rick Barnes and Calipari were not willing to take the risk and lose their current status (even though neither has won a NCAA Championship).

I also think that NC State is going to be willing to pay whatever they want to get someone great.

State should get a young coach for whom State is the ticket to the big time. For Tubby, etc., this would be a last series of big paychecks. Maybe he would do great; maybe he wouldn't need to do great because he will have made all the money he is iver going to make.

Better to go after a successful coach at a mid-tier school like -- ahem -- Brownell or Donahue than go for a big name. This would be someone who needs a job paying what State will pay with the potential to do even better.

sagegrouse

[DevilWearsPrada]

Sidney Lowe seems like a very nice person. The State basketball mens program has gone to pot or squat. Had a good program and recruits with Herb! And the Wolfies ran the Saint Herb out of town.

I would think that Sidney could coach and recruit, and Monte Towe had a good team, where he was, previous to State. The coaching staff seems articulate... Are the players just hard headed or what? They have good talent. Dang, beat Duke last year!!!!

I like Sidney, he was a part of the Cardiac pack that won the NCAA championship along time ago 1983. I would think this is either his last year, not unless, his team can make some kind of run Feb/March and win!

So how long will the Wolfies keep Sidney??? I love Monte Towe!!!!

[mcdukie]

State is an interesting coaching job. In the minds of their fans, they are on the same level as Duke and UNC. But recruits do not see it that way. I think they have some talent, but no chemistry whatsoever. Ryan Harrow, Tracey Smith to name a few are very talented but Lowe looks lost and they seem to have no confidence in him. CJ Leslie seems to do what he wants (when he is playing) and they really don't know how to incorporate the shooter, Wood, and the other point guard. I think the right coach could get that team to the tournament. They are going to have to pay for a top-flight coach. Tubby would be interesting.
Question: Better job- NC State or Maryland?

[DevilWearsPrada]

I have said all year, NC State mens basketball team has good players, Sidney just cant coach them for some unknown reason. Perhaps the boys are hard headed and think they know everything.

Sidney seems to be a nice man, and was a very good BB player in his day. Perhaps, he is more useful in the NBA program. Monte Towe was doing very well, where he was, before arriving at State for the asst coaching position.

State has gone from bad to worse, since conference play.

The game was over during the First half yesterday. There was NO LEADER for the PACK.

Think Debbie Yow is looking for a new Mens Basketball Coach?

[Acymetric]

So, now that it appears the team has all but quit on El Sid, will Yow even wait until the season is over to get rid of him?

The total lack of effort on defense in the first half against Duke was absurd and embarrassing for State. I can't imagine the Administration wanting to watch a few more weeks of this Sidney Lowe Death March.

--Jason "Is there any reason to keep him after you have decided to get rid of him?" Evans

Well, there is one downside. They won't be able to get any of their top candidates until the end of the season, so they'll have to make an assistant the interim coach. When that happens there is always pressure to keep the interim coach if he has some success, even if there are much better candidates out there...so it may be easier to wait until April and avoid any business with interim coaches.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Think Debbie Yow is looking for a new Mens Basketball Coach?

Does a wolf go in the woods?

[Cameron]

Think Debbie Yow is looking for a new Mens Basketball Coach?

At this particular point in Sid the Kid's career, Gordon Bombay has a better chance of coaching the Wolfpack next year.

To add to Ozzie's truth above, do timberwolves play basketball in Minnesota? Better even, did North Carolina win 8 games in 2002?

While I think the hiring of Orlando Smith would be a very good one for N.C. State, monumental even in terms of resurrecting a once proud basketball school, it is a highly unlikely scenario. At Minnesota -- and the allure of the Big Ten -- Tubby's coaching pedigree lends to an excellent chance of winning and contesting for NCAA appearances yearly (possibly even deep runs given the right experience and grouping of players), and all without the relentless and almost deranged expectations of the fan contingency that brought him down in the Commonwealth of Kentucky. Minnesota is a football school, first and last, and that bodes well for a coach who outwardly grew weary of the strains of high-stakes, win-at-all-costs ball at UK.

More importantly, from all accounts that I've read or seen concerning his tenure to this point in the far north of college basketball, Tubby has found a place in Minnesota surrounded by the kind of family atmosphere he himself admires and hungers for most. I think he's comfortable there and enjoys the liberty of coaching again for no other reason than being around the game he loves and leading young men to success.

I, of course, could be wholly wrong. But that's my take.

[Newton_14]

So, now that it appears the team has all but quit on El Sid, will Yow even wait until the season is over to get rid of him?

The total lack of effort on defense in the first half against Duke was absurd and embarrassing for State. I can't imagine the Administration wanting to watch a few more weeks of this Sidney Lowe Death March.

--Jason "Is there any reason to keep him after you have decided to get rid of him?" Evans

In regards to College Bball, I am normally against a coaching dismissal during the season. In this particular case, though, I believe State should do the deed now. They have simply stopped competing. With the talent on hand, State should be above .500 in conference and able to compete to the wire with any of the ACC teams. They took Syracuse to the wire on the road without Tracy Smith.

I feel they should allow Sidney to gracefully resign, and allow Monte Towe to become interim coach for the remainder of the season with the understanding that under no circumstances will he be named the full time coach. Yow would be able to form a team of folks including hiring one of the firms that assist schools with finding a coach. They could put a solid list together and be ready to start interviewing as soon as the season ends.

The UNC and Duke games were pathetic, and against Va Tech in the middle game State competed for all of about 10 minutes in the 2nd half. Sid for whatever reason, can no longer get them to compete. Time to go.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

I feel they should allow Sidney to gracefully resign, and allow Monte Towe to become interim coach for the remainder of the season with the understanding that under no circumstances will he be named the full time coach.

But Monte might be the right Munster for the job...

[Newton_14]

But Monte might be the right Munster for the job...

I am not very OpTOEmistic about that one Oz!

[shoutingncu]

...did North Carolina win 8 games in 2002?

Surely some of those came in 2001... Does that mean that Yow is not looking for a new coach?

[allenmurray]

So, now that it appears the team has all but quit on El Sid, will Yow even wait until the season is over to get rid of him?

The total lack of effort on defense in the first half against Duke was absurd and embarrassing for State. I can't imagine the Administration wanting to watch a few more weeks of this Sidney Lowe Death March.

--Jason "Is there any reason to keep him after you have decided to get rid of him?" Evans

What would there be to be gained by sacking him now? Yow can quietly look for a new coach whenever she wants. Towe brings nothing to the table in terms of turning the season around. No matter how bad the rest of the season looks, is there really anythng to be gained by firing him now? I think there is not.

However, there are things to be lost. Lowe led them to a national championship. He is a wolfie through and through. Firing him mid-season, unless the new permanant replacement is ready to step in right away, lacks dignity and class. Doing things "right" should still have a place in college athletics. March will be soon enough to give Lowe his walking papers.

[sagegrouse]

What would there be to be gained by sacking him now? Yow can quietly look for a new coach whenever she wants. Towe brings nothing to the table in terms of turning the season around. No matter how bad the rest of the season looks, is there really anythng to be gained by firing him now? I think there is not.

However, there are things to be lost. Lowe led them to a national championship. He is a wolfie through and through. Firing him mid-season, unless the new permanant replacement is ready to step in right away, lacks dignity and class. Doing things "right" should still have a place in college athletics. March will be soon enough to give Lowe his walking papers.

I tend to agree with you, and the only exception I would make is the reason Joe Alleva gave when Carl Franks was sacked after a particularly bad loss to Wake Forest: he said the players, who were working their butts off, deserved better coaching. Heck, Franks was fired at halftime, when Joe went to see Nan Keohane and told her -- Franks just didn't learn about it until the end of the game.

I can't answer the question of whether the State players would have a better rest of season with Sidney replaced by Monte or someone else.

sagegrouse

[Matches]

I would like to see Sid get a couple more years. I think he's finally got players in place, and would like to see him get a chance to coach them up. Obviously this season has been a huge disappointment, but there is talent on that roster, and they have a chance to be quite good in a year or two.

But at this point, he's almost certainly a goner. The failure to compete at UNC and Duke likely was the last straw. State's body language was awful on Saturday, and they do look like they've quit on Sid. The pressure from boosters etc. is going to grow to a fever pitch by season's end.

No need to do it mid-season, though. I really don't like the idea of college coaches being fired in midseason unless there's some issue as to misconduct (otherwise known as the Gillespie Corollary).