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  1. #741
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
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    20 Minutes From The Heaven That Is Cameron Indoor
    Quote Originally Posted by SupaDave View Post
    All the good stuff in that article and you still found a way to be negative? Sigh. Maybe you guys aren't paying attention.

    Remember how I've been telling folks to relax. Do any of you honestly believe he hasn't talked to Coach K about his concerns as vocal as he is?

    Distance: Duke is perfect. A short flight or an easy drive from GA. I've done it probably a million times.

    Atmosphere: We have what they like in a "crazy" atmosphere.

    Education: They respect it.

    Coach: They respect him.

    Fandom: Mom is a fan (and this actually goes back to the bizarro recruiting comment I highlighted earlier)

    Need: There's an exclamation beside Duke's name.
    For the uninformed, Supa lives in the area, and has many connections down there in the hoops scene. I would suggest putting more than a grain of salt in his current take on the Parker situation.

    Doesn't mean Parker chooses Duke, but at this point I am now comfortable believing Duke is still very much in the running here. Don't put so much emphasis on the negatives Parker listed for Duke. There were more positives there than negatives imo. My outlook on his recruitment changed quite a bit after reading that. He was touted as "Anti-Duke" and I don't believe that is the case at all.

    Perspective.


    And FWIW, earlier this season, K moved Wojo to coaching the point guards, and moved Capel to coaching the bigs (along with Coach Badass). I imagine that information has been shared with Parker. (Not that it matters, but I remain in the camp that Wojo is a fine big man coach, and will always believe that. I am also perfectly fine with Capel and Nate coaching the bigs. All 4 of Wojo, Collins, Capel, and Nate are excellent instructors of hoops no matter the positions they instruct in on any given day)

    "[T]he tarnished Tar Heels that bear little resemblance to the revered program built by Dean Smith."- Ashville Times
    "UNC and the NCAA are trying to conceal that the fraud was specifically designed to pad the transcripts of varsity athletes" - Bloomberg

  2. #742
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Mount Kisco, NY
    Quote Originally Posted by El_Diablo View Post
    It really shows how much systematic negative recruiting he has been getting if he can "reel off" a list of Duke forwards and centers who did not live up to their high school rankings. I mean, references to Shavlik Randolph and Chris Burgess? Really?
    Per the diary, one of his close advisers is Dion Glover, of Georgia Tech fame and HS-Class-of-'97 with Chris Burgess fame. After getting whupped on by Duke for his whole career, I am sure he's not a big fan. Plus, those quotes made good copy.

  3. #743
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Jacksonville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    For the uninformed, Supa lives in the area, and has many connections down there in the hoops scene. I would suggest putting more than a grain of salt in his current take on the Parker situation.

    Doesn't mean Parker chooses Duke, but at this point I am now comfortable believing Duke is still very much in the running here. Don't put so much emphasis on the negatives Parker listed for Duke. There were more positives there than negatives imo. My outlook on his recruitment changed quite a bit after reading that. He was touted as "Anti-Duke" and I don't believe that is the case at all.

    Perspective.


    And FWIW, earlier this season, K moved Wojo to coaching the point guards, and moved Capel to coaching the bigs (along with Coach Badass). I imagine that information has been shared with Parker. (Not that it matters, but I remain in the camp that Wojo is a fine big man coach, and will always believe that. I am also perfectly fine with Capel and Nate coaching the bigs. All 4 of Wojo, Collins, Capel, and Nate are excellent instructors of hoops no matter the positions they instruct in on any given day)

    Thanks to both of you gentlemen for this. I would have likely been in the crowd who figured Duke was out of the picture but this give a new perspective on his recruitment. Nicely done to give a different perspective.
    http://www.dukesportsblog.com/

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  4. #744
    Quote Originally Posted by SupaDave View Post
    All the good stuff in that article and you still found a way to be negative? Sigh. Maybe you guys aren't paying attention.
    Um, I'm paying attention...hence my reference to the other factors we have going for us. But here those other factors were largely raised by others in this inner circle, to which he merely "concedes, but seems a bit frustrated. He doesn't think they're putting enough stock into the lack of development in the paint at Duke."

    I'm sorry if I chose to focus more on what appears to be the most critical factor with respect to Duke (or at least the one given the most focus in this article) rather than just repeat the generally upbeat vibes of the several posters before me. I too am a little more optimistic about our chances now, so perhaps I should have conveyed that more clearly. But I can't help but notice those positives (location, education, fandom, need, etc) seem to be more important to those around him than to Parker himself, so my enthusiasm will be at least somewhat muted until I hear him emphasizing those other factors more than, say, his concern about Wojo's height.

    But yes, I agree that there are plenty of positives here too.

  5. #745
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Atlanta, GA/Durham, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    For the uninformed, Supa lives in the area, and has many connections down there in the hoops scene. I would suggest putting more than a grain of salt in his current take on the Parker situation.

    Doesn't mean Parker chooses Duke, but at this point I am now comfortable believing Duke is still very much in the running here. Don't put so much emphasis on the negatives Parker listed for Duke. There were more positives there than negatives imo. My outlook on his recruitment changed quite a bit after reading that. He was touted as "Anti-Duke" and I don't believe that is the case at all.

    Perspective.


    And FWIW, earlier this season, K moved Wojo to coaching the point guards, and moved Capel to coaching the bigs (along with Coach Badass). I imagine that information has been shared with Parker. (Not that it matters, but I remain in the camp that Wojo is a fine big man coach, and will always believe that. I am also perfectly fine with Capel and Nate coaching the bigs. All 4 of Wojo, Collins, Capel, and Nate are excellent instructors of hoops no matter the positions they instruct in on any given day)
    Sometimes we wring our hands so much that we forget what we are worried about. It's kinda like Kenny Boynton's dad coming to the door in Florida shorts. Remember how enamored the FAMILY was with Donovan? And dear Lord don't make me remind you of the Shirley Barnes Jordan obsession. There's more people than Coach K recruiting Parker to Duke - THIS I can promise you.

  6. #746
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Durham
    Was this "roundtable" done before or after our tourney exit? Just curious because most seemed to have pinned the "whoa, a loss to Lehigh doesn't look good to me!" tweet (or something like that) on Tony. Just curious about the timing of this conversation.

  7. #747
    Quote Originally Posted by SupaDave View Post
    All the good stuff in that article and you still found a way to be negative? Sigh. Maybe you guys aren't paying attention.

    Remember how I've been telling folks to relax. Do any of you honestly believe he hasn't talked to Coach K about his concerns as vocal as he is?

    Distance: Duke is perfect. A short flight or an easy drive from GA. I've done it probably a million times.

    Atmosphere: We have what they like in a "crazy" atmosphere.

    Education: They respect it.

    Coach: They respect him.

    Fandom: Mom is a fan (and this actually goes back to the bizarro recruiting comment I highlighted earlier)

    Need: There's an exclamation beside Duke's name.
    Supa, I think the thing is... this is maybe the first time we've seen the exact worries some people have had clearly and directly addressed by a big need recruit. The idea of our bigs not developing, and the idea that Wojo is not a good enough coach for the bigs, is not necessarily TRUE. However, it is somewhat interesting to see it stated so blatantly by a recruit, so taking that as a negative out of the article (while assuming that having respect for K and the value of a Duke education is a given) is not that big a deal, I don't think.

  8. #748
    "Names like Shavlik Randolph, Lance Thomas, Josh McRoberts..."

    All those guys have played or are playing in the NBA. How can that be a negative against Duke?

  9. #749
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    New Bern, NC unless it's a home football game then I'm grilling on Devil's Alley
    Quote Originally Posted by Kdogg View Post
    "Names like Shavlik Randolph, Lance Thomas, Josh McRoberts..."

    All those guys have played or are playing in the NBA. How can that be a negative against Duke?
    When you are dreaming of draft night, you want to be in the green room, not waiting at home to hear your name called. Nothing against our guys, but that's reality.
    Mmmm, BBQ!

  10. #750
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Fayetteville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Kdogg View Post
    "Names like Shavlik Randolph, Lance Thomas, Josh McRoberts..."

    All those guys have played or are playing in the NBA. How can that be a negative against Duke?
    I doubt many kids Parker's age consider being a journeyman NBA player a sucess, despite the fact the last player on a pro bench is making a good living.

    I'm sure most of these kids envision themselves as the next big thing.

  11. #751
    Quote Originally Posted by Kdogg View Post
    "Names like Shavlik Randolph, Lance Thomas, Josh McRoberts..."

    All those guys have played or are playing in the NBA. How can that be a negative against Duke?
    I think the knock is that those guys didn't "reach their potential in college" and that it took a year or two of being in the d-league or the pros to make them effective players. They weren't super productive in college with the exception of McRoberts who was our leading scorer and rebounder I believe in 07, but I always thought that he was too unselfish that year. I don't know what happened with Lance in the league, I did not expect this at all. I see his point, highly touted recruits who didn't put up numbers in college, and in Lance's case, just gave everything he had for the good of the team. Not saying Parker wouldn't do that, but he and his camp certainly think that doing all he can consists predominately of him getting the rock. Shav showed flashes. Depending on who else if anyone comes and who stays, I think Parker certainly would have a problem with the attention he's paid on offense. He's not starting if Mason stays and if Bazz comes, there goes a lot more shots regardless of if Austin stays or not. Duke has made it abundantly clear that they want him and he would be a big building block regardless and I don't see K not following through with that, but it's certainly something Parker needs to think about. I don't see Parker or Jefferson making a commitment until after people say they're leaving or not because they want to play and be focal points right away.

    I don't see Parker becoming Elton, Sheldon, or Boozer, but he and everybody around him appear to believe that he's already at that level, maybe he is and maybe he will be, but he would be a huge boost to the program and recruiting morale, it's a concern of a lot of people including me even if its not accurate that we're in a bit of a slump.

    His comments about Mason dominating in high school were a little surprising. Christ School doesn't exactly play a rigorous schedule, and it's a lot easier when you have another Plumlee on the court, which he always had.

  12. #752
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    raleigh
    so, what are tony's schools down to...? "officially"
    "Either we're going down, or they are....... Kirk out!"

  13. #753
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Durham
    Quote Originally Posted by moonpie23 View Post
    so, what are tony's schools down to...? "officially"
    UCLA, Memphis, Duke, Ohio State, Kansas, Georgetown and Georgia. Although, based on the roundtable it seems they're focusing on Duke, Kansas, tOSU, and UCLA.

  14. #754
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    raleigh
    Quote Originally Posted by dukedoc View Post
    UCLA, Memphis, Duke, Ohio State, Kansas, Georgetown and Georgia. Although, based on the roundtable it seems they're focusing on Duke, Kansas, tOSU, and UCLA.
    Georgia? what "big man lineage" do they point to?
    "Either we're going down, or they are....... Kirk out!"

  15. #755
    Quote Originally Posted by moonpie23 View Post
    Georgia? what "big man lineage" do they point to?
    None. It is the home state school.

  16. #756
    Quote Originally Posted by dukedoc View Post
    Was this "roundtable" done before or after our tourney exit? Just curious because most seemed to have pinned the "whoa, a loss to Lehigh doesn't look good to me!" tweet (or something like that) on Tony. Just curious about the timing of this conversation.
    Jordan had tweeted about being down in Atlanta with Parker and company earlier in the week, right before Duke's tournament loss.

  17. #757
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Is it just me or do Shav, Thomas, and McRoberts have almost NOTHING in common with Parker in terms of playing style, except for being around the same height?

  18. #758
    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    And FWIW, earlier this season, K moved Wojo to coaching the point guards, and moved Capel to coaching the bigs (along with Coach Badass). I imagine that information has been shared with Parker. (Not that it matters, but I remain in the camp that Wojo is a fine big man coach, and will always believe that. I am also perfectly fine with Capel and Nate coaching the bigs. All 4 of Wojo, Collins, Capel, and Nate are excellent instructors of hoops no matter the positions they instruct in on any given day)
    Wait just a minute here, Newton_14. Are you saying that Wojo is no longer the big man coach? I was looking forward to another 10,000 posts of wailing and gnashing of teeth regarding the Duke big man coach, and now it seems you're telling me that a change was made several months ago. Who will we skewer if [insert big man recruit name here] goes elsewhere?? I feel lost.

  19. #759
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Northern VA

    The Glass is Half Full Guys!!

    Quote Originally Posted by dukedoc View Post
    UCLA, Memphis, Duke, Ohio State, Kansas, Georgetown and Georgia. Although, based on the roundtable it seems they're focusing on Duke, Kansas, tOSU, and UCLA.
    GA's inclusion could well have been a "courtesy," but to be fair KA does have some positive history with bigs (and a few disappointments too), and OSU has had a handful of stellar bigs in the last few years (but not much before that that I was aware of), and I have to think the stink about the UCLA problems would scare TP (and his family) away. Here's the Devil's advocate point though (sorry for the pun): If one were previously inclined to spin the story negatively against Duke - not that HS kids' advisors ever have ulterior motives... - they might present it as a "percentage thing" against the Devils. In other words, YES, they have had some big men make the show and strike it rich, BUT they've brought in X number of McD AA bigs in the last 20 years, and only Y number of them eventually became lottery picks, or just Z% of them (very small percentage." Now we all know there's more than one hole that can be punched in this story/spin, but a HS kid looking to hear "all sides" and do a full analysis might be receptive to that sort of packaging. It effect, it uses Duke's relative recruiting success over the years against us.

    For example, pointing to Burgess, Shav and Thomas (why pull those three out of the air in particular anyway??) is very decptive b/c: (1) None of them are remotely similar to TP in body type or physical potential (Brand would be the closest physical similarity out of HS); (2) Theirs were three very divergent paths -- Shav's career was marked by recurruing illness and injury, but he still ultimately made it to the NBA, Thomas was NOT a top-10 recruit and was never a slam-dunk for the NBA out of HS (though he is there now following his Nat'l Championship at Duke), and Burgess had "family issues" and was grossly mis-evaluated by the recruiting services out of HS (hard to blame K for him not bearing fruit when the kid left after just a couple years - kinda hard to develop a kid who's 2,000 miles away... ; (3) There is a big difference between "McD AA" and "top-10" for HS recruits. Top-10 might have legit expectations of pro prospects, but sliding down into the 30's and beyond, there may be HOPES of the Association... but the numbers don't lie -- there's only about 14 lottery picks each year. Kyrie Irving, Austin Rivers and Harrison Barnes, all top-5 HS recruits, could legitimately EXPECT to get to the NBA.... but you can't say that about all of the other Duke recruits who maybe came out as top 20-40 guys, though several of those actuially DID make the show after Duke.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Ash View Post
    Supa, I think the thing is... this is maybe the first time we've seen the exact worries some people have had clearly and directly addressed by a big need recruit. The idea of our bigs not developing, and the idea that Wojo is not a good enough coach for the bigs, is not necessarily TRUE. However, it is somewhat interesting to see it stated so blatantly by a recruit, so taking that as a negative out of the article (while assuming that having respect for K and the value of a Duke education is a given) is not that big a deal, I don't think.
    Yes. There have been posters on these very boards for several years hand-wringing over our 6' "Big Man" Coach. (BTW, funniest retort I ever saw was someone naming all of the other coaches in the ACC and pointing out that none of the other big-man coaches were 6'10" either!) This issue is one of perception, and absolutely not one of truth. But, as the man says, perception is everything... And for that perception reason alone, I was glad to see Nate and Coach Capel take over the bigs. Maybe time to bring in Laettner or a retiring Hill soon?? (if Coaches Collins or Wojo ever move on)

    Quote Originally Posted by mkline09 View Post
    Thanks to both of you gentlemen for this. I would have likely been in the crowd who figured Duke was out of the picture but this give a new perspective on his recruitment. Nicely done to give a different perspective.
    Count me in there too. I mean, I figgured there was at least a glimmer of hope, otherwise why keep keeping us on the list, but, I say let's look at this glass as "half full!" Especially since most around here, as recent as a few weeks ago, thought the glass was 95% empty!!! In fact, many posters around the time of the ACCT were saying that this may just end up being a 1-man-class. Now suddenly we seem to have decent shots at THREE kids in the top 20 or so, plus at least one very intriguing transfer possibility. I don't know about you, but for me the post-NCAA timeframe just got a lot more interesting that I thought it would after Fri night....

    Quote Originally Posted by FireOgilvie View Post
    Coach K is the "best coach in the country" and Duke needs Parker and would use him more than any other team recruiting him, yet he's still hesitant because of big man development and Wojo's height. Seriously? Ugh. I guess perception is reality.
    There have been many dozens of posters on these boards saying the same things over the years. And you're spot on re. perception!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by SupaDave View Post
    All the good stuff in that article and you still found a way to be negative? Sigh. Maybe you guys aren't paying attention.

    Remember how I've been telling folks to relax. Do any of you honestly believe he hasn't talked to Coach K about his concerns as vocal as he is?

    Distance: Duke is perfect. A short flight or an easy drive from GA. I've done it probably a million times.

    Atmosphere: We have what they like in a "crazy" atmosphere.

    Education: They respect it.

    Coach: They respect him.

    Fandom: Mom is a fan (and this actually goes back to the bizarro recruiting comment I highlighted earlier)

    Need: There's an exclamation beside Duke's name.
    Quote Originally Posted by Newton_14 View Post
    For the uninformed, Supa lives in the area, and has many connections down there in the hoops scene. I would suggest putting more than a grain of salt in his current take on the Parker situation.

    Doesn't mean Parker chooses Duke, but at this point I am now comfortable believing Duke is still very much in the running here. Don't put so much emphasis on the negatives Parker listed for Duke. There were more positives there than negatives imo. My outlook on his recruitment changed quite a bit after reading that. He was touted as "Anti-Duke" and I don't believe that is the case at all.

    Perspective.
    Thanks Supa and Newton. Good sense of perspective that I hope others here will seek to emulate. Lots of positives in there. And this kid seems earnest and dutiful in going about this process. Though we may poke fun at a few of the things he rationalizes/says, I think kids who take this process so seriously more often than not choose Duke. I like him, and will root for TP regardless. But boy can I see him being truly great in K's hands. He has such great potential and, frankly, this could be the one who calls out that false perception and disproves it forever. Clearly K and staff expect great things from Tony over the next few years.
    Last edited by -bdbd; 03-23-2012 at 01:45 AM.
    -BDBD

  20. #760
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Los Angeles

    Not to throw cold water or anything, but . . .

    This little article http://www.c2crecruiting.com/ says that UCLA had an in-home with Parker last night, with their representative being Parker's AAU coach-turned UCLA assistant. Further, the "source" for the article indicates that Memphis, UCLA, Kansas, and Ohio State are all "in play" for him, Duke is "on the outside" and "most feel Duke isn't a real player" in this.

    I don't know how good this guy's sources are. Maybe not good at all, who knows? But if he is credible, this is not encouraging, obviously,

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