CNNSi - Duke #1 backcourt...

[SupaDave]

A quick snippet on what's expected this year...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/mul...ontent.16.html

[sleepybear]

No UK in the top 16?

Watch out for Memphis' backcourt. Will Barton and Jackson are nasty.

[juise]

I think Ohio State may be a little underrated here. Those guys have experience and I remember doing some research about how they match up with Duke last year and those guys are pretty talented.

[airowe]

So this puts Singler in the front court then. Does the preseason Player of the Year add enough to the two Plumlees, Ryan Kelly, and Josh Hairston to make that unit one of the best front courts in the country as well?

[OldPhiKap]

"Smith, a senior who passed on the NBA Draft, is a star in his own right who looked phenomenal in this past summer-camp circuit."

Hard to believe that he can play better than last year. Yet I know he will.



Remember some of our past teams that couldn't really break down the defending guards and get into the paint? Shouldn't be a problem this year. Wow.

[OldPhiKap]

So this puts Singler in the front court then. Does the preseason Player of the Year add enough to the two Plumlees, Ryan Kelly, and Josh Hairston to make that unit one of the best front courts in the country as well?

You, me, and Singler would make a top five front line.

[gumbomoop]

So this puts Singler in the front court then. Does the preseason Player of the Year add enough to the two Plumlees, Ryan Kelly, and Josh Hairston to make that unit one of the best front courts in the country as well?

The answer has to be "yes."

Sometimes the traditional designations, backcourt/frontcourt, don't do justice to the practical configuration employed by many teams, which is perimeter/interior. Many teams employ a 3-guard lineup, so the perimeter is a PG and 2 wings. If one of the wings is a bit taller than the other, that wing would traditionally be the SF. And since SF includes F, and since F is traditionally thought of as "frontcourt," then Kyle is still going to be thought of as frontcourt by some. And that is particularly true for sports writers, who look at all those other Duke guys who are shorter than Kyle and who seem to be guards. So if in the traditional designation, a team has a "backcourt" consisting of 2 guards, and Duke has 5 other guys who appear to be good-to-excellent guards, then Kyle is likely to be thought a forward.

Without reviving the Kyle-is-a-3, no-he's-a-4 debate, DBR posters know he moves around a lot, usually spends a good bit of time on the wing on both O and D. What is Kyle? K says [about Kyle and many others], he's a player. He's a forward who shoots a fair number of 3s, a perimeter wing who drives, a combo wing/SF-interior/PF defender.

Kyle may be close to the perfect example of why the traditional backcourt/frontcourt designation no longer quite fits the game as played.

[greybeard]

The answer has to be "yes."

Sometimes the traditional designations, backcourt/frontcourt, don't do justice to the practical configuration employed by many teams, which is perimeter/interior. Many teams employ a 3-guard lineup, so the perimeter is a PG and 2 wings. If one of the wings is a bit taller than the other, that wing would traditionally be the SF. And since SF includes F, and since F is traditionally thought of as "frontcourt," then Kyle is still going to be thought of as frontcourt by some. And that is particularly true for sports writers, who look at all those other Duke guys who are shorter than Kyle and who seem to be guards. So if in the traditional designation, a team has a "backcourt" consisting of 2 guards, and Duke has 5 other guys who appear to be good-to-excellent guards, then Kyle is likely to be thought a forward.

Without reviving the Kyle-is-a-3, no-he's-a-4 debate, DBR posters know he moves around a lot, usually spends a good bit of time on the wing on both O and D. What is Kyle? K says [about Kyle and many others], he's a player. He's a forward who shoots a fair number of 3s, a perimeter wing who drives, a combo wing/SF-interior/PF defender.

Kyle may be close to the perfect example of why the traditional backcourt/frontcourt designation no longer quite fits the game as played.

I do not see Kyle as having a backcourt/guard game, at least he struggled last year early on when Duke tried to deploy him playing outside in. Kyle's feel, understanding, vision for the game seems oriented for an inside-out perspective. To the extent that one would call Rip Hamilton a "guard," then, yes, Kyle definitely plays similar to Hamilton, although Hamilton seems much more comfortable in catching it outside without having begun inside along the baseline and using his speed, cleverness, and uncanny ability to be running away from the basket, curl of a screen or catch at the line, turn, and be completely ready to shoot.

This, to me, is Kyle's strongest asset with regard to his exterior offense--that same ability that defenders cannot match to sprint out, curl or catch and turn and be ready to fire.

To me, Kyle is a modern day Dave Debusshire--capable of rebounding with giants, decent off the bounce and able to finish, very good mid and long range jump shooter, maybe off the bounce, great runner of the court, and great defender.

I think that the aspect of Kyle's game that could improve the most is his ability to penetrate the defense with the pass, to use his ability to see the game one or more steps ahead to catch and pass in ways that invite receptions that make the pivot player dangerous.

How, does Kyle develop this? He starts imaging it as he walks to class, as he is riding in a car, and starts thinking in such terms during practice. Developing the ability to multi-vision before the catch requires practicing with the idea of catching with having prepared oneself to make such interior passes a priority. Then, one can feel whether to catch and look for oneself, or catch and look to pass penetrate, multi-vision I shall call it, aka a Larry Bird. Fantacy play, imagining, is where it begins.

Few players have this ability to see the game as they move from both perspectives, instead of thinking only about one. Most scorer types are taught, self teach, to see as they move how they will set themselves up for a catch and score possibility and will always as a first reaction to examine shoot or dribble penetration option first.

I would like to see Kyle develop the ability to move with the intention of creating a catch that will present a great penetrating pass reception for an interior player, while at the same time thinking of creating a scoring opportunity for himself and to make deciisions on the fly as to which is most available.

I think Duke would benefit tremendously from Kyle's being really good at creating good interior receptions for the bigs, even for no other purpose of making the defense to work and react, only to have Duke's bigs kick it out, you know, like real PIVOT players. I also think that Kyle's attractiveness to the pros would go way up.

[SilkyJ]

The answer has to be "yes."

Sometimes the traditional designations, backcourt/frontcourt, don't do justice to the practical configuration employed by many teams, which is perimeter/interior. Many teams employ a 3-guard lineup, so the perimeter is a PG and 2 wings. If one of the wings is a bit taller than the other, that wing would traditionally be the SF. And since SF includes F, and since F is traditionally thought of as "frontcourt," then Kyle is still going to be thought of as frontcourt by some. And that is particularly true for sports writers, who look at all those other Duke guys who are shorter than Kyle and who seem to be guards. So if in the traditional designation, a team has a "backcourt" consisting of 2 guards, and Duke has 5 other guys who appear to be good-to-excellent guards, then Kyle is likely to be thought a forward.

Without reviving the Kyle-is-a-3, no-he's-a-4 debate, DBR posters know he moves around a lot, usually spends a good bit of time on the wing on both O and D. What is Kyle? K says [about Kyle and many others], he's a player. He's a forward who shoots a fair number of 3s, a perimeter wing who drives, a combo wing/SF-interior/PF defender.

Kyle may be close to the perfect example of why the traditional backcourt/frontcourt designation no longer quite fits the game as played.

Well, Kyle also spent significant time in the post his first 2 years and will likely play some minutes defending the opponents PF this year as well, so I understand the designation. Not to mention he averaged 7rpg last year...not many "backcourt" players do that.

[johnb]

So this puts Singler in the front court then. Does the preseason Player of the Year add enough to the two Plumlees, Ryan Kelly, and Josh Hairston to make that unit one of the best front courts in the country as well?

SI ranked the front court #2.

[Kedsy]

SI ranked the front court #2.

So, we have the #1 backcourt in the nation and the #2 frontcourt? I guess we have a pretty good team.

[OldPhiKap]

So, we have the #1 backcourt in the nation and the #2 frontcourt? I guess we have a pretty good team.

If only we had the #1 coach to meld them all together into one cohesive team . . . .




Can't wait for the games to begin!

[JasonEvans]

So, we have the #1 backcourt in the nation and the #2 frontcourt? I guess we have a pretty good team.

Others who were ranked in both courts...

Purdue has the #1 frontcourt and the #12 backcourt.
Michigan St has the #15 frontcourt and the #2 backcourt.
Syracuse has the #7 frontcourt and the #10 backcourt.
Ohio State has the #9 frontcourt and the #9 backcourt.
Kansas has the #5 frontcourt and the #6 backcourt.

Also of note, NC State has the #16 frontcourt and that pale blue team down the road comes in with the #3 frontcourt in the land.

--Jason "of course, there can be big gaps in there... like I think there is a big gap from the #2 to #1 backcourts" Evans

[flyingdutchdevil]

#1 backcourt (by a long shot)
#2 frontcourt
#1 Coach (number of NCs, number of wins, number of basically everything)
2 Top 5 seniors
1 Top 5 freshman
Top 5 bench (that could start on the vast majority of ACC teams)

How can you not get excited! And how can CTC not come fast enough? What is going on here?

[gumbomoop]

Well, Kyle also spent significant time in the post his first 2 years and will likely play some minutes defending the opponents PF this year as well, so I understand the designation. Not to mention he averaged 7rpg last year...not many "backcourt" players do that.

Yes, I too understand the designation, but my more general point was that backcourt/frontcourt doesn't these days accurately reflect the proliferation of 3-perimeter/2-interior arrangements. Maybe I'm overstating the number of teams that for substantial portions of games use this; not sure. Anyhow, yes, if Kyle must be labeled either front- or backcourt, I guess he seems more front. In my preferred designation, he's a cross between perimeter and interior. How much of a cross gets us back into the roughly 2-years-running debate over whether Kyle is a 3 or 4. I'm avoiding that.

As for Kyle's defending opposing PFs at times, yes, I agree, having described him in my post as "a combo wing/SF-interior/PF defender."

I do not see Kyle as having a backcourt/guard game... I would like to see Kyle develop the ability to move with the intention of creating a catch that will present a great penetrating pass reception for an interior player...I think Duke would benefit tremendously from Kyle's being really good at creating good interior receptions for the bigs...

I agree with you that Kyle doesn't exactly have a backcourt/guard game, but I also agree with your reference to Kyle passing to interior players, which seems to agree with me that Kyle may fairly, and probably more than intermittently, be described as a perimeter player. This doesn't mean that interior players can't pass to other interior players, but your phrase, "penetrating pass," seems most likely to come from a perimeter player.

So while I'm thrilled to see Duke have such highly rated front- and backcourts, I'm trying to make a broader point about why these designations are, maybe, becoming outmoded.

Having quoted only a small portion of your post in order to offer some clarification, I do want to add that I realize your post raises several other interesting issues about what we might see from Kyle.

[Duke: A Dynasty]

Looks like we will have a top backcourt again next year as well even if KI leaves and if he doesnt leave then well it should be preety much guranteed.

[jipops]

Also of note, NC State has the #16 frontcourt and that pale blue team down the road comes in with the #3 frontcourt in the land.

--Jason "of course, there can be big gaps in there... like I think there is a big gap from the #2 to #1 backcourts" Evans

UNC has 3 front court players who will be earning NBA paychecks some day so the #3 ranking may be about right. I actually think we may be rated a tad too high in this department. Is anyone besides Singler going to be a reliable scorer in the post? How well are we going to be able to defend the paint with Thomas and Zoubek gone?

I wonder, what are the criteria for being a top rated front court anyways?

[Jderf]

I don't know if anyone else noticed this, but the photo on UNC's page perfectly encapsulates how dysfunctional they were last season. Henson seems to have an easy block from behind, except Zeller is actually blindly grabbing Henson's arm and keeping his hand away from the ball. Classic.

[Bob Green]

Is anyone besides Singler going to be a reliable scorer in the post? How well are we going to be able to defend the paint with Thomas and Zoubek gone?

The answers to your two very important questions will go a long way toward determining how good we are this year. This is why I've repeatedly stated the performance of the Brothers Plumlee is critical. I believe, and many others have posted it as well, Miles and Mason will benefit from the uptempo offense so the main question is how improved they are on defense. Interior defense and rebounding are not glory duties, and they will not normally earn a player video clip time at ESPN but they are vital duties for a team to be successful.

[ACCBBallFan]

Duke back court continues to rack up awards.

Nolan first team on SI All American list

http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-bas...ters-at-a-time