2012 Basketball Recruiting Thread

[UrinalCake]

Yeah, style-wise, Michigan (more accurately, John Beilein's approach) seems like by far the worst fit of McGary's choices. They consistently play one of the slowest tempos in the country, and they consistently shoot more threes per possession than almost anyone in the country.

Yeah, plus their guys haven't learned that you're supposed to keep your feet on the ground when playing defense.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToEMyjPS2SQ

[dukemsu]

Michigan is a curious choice for McGary. His AAU coach, who is clearly trying to get a job at Michigan, said that JB has a tremendous record developing bigs. Not sure who those bigs are. Pittsnoggle? Joel Alexander? One year of Jordan Morgan dunking pick and roll feeds with Darius Morris? Sorry, record isn't there. The only thing that would seem to favor UM is that McGary seems to want to become a perimeter big rather than the human wrecking ball he has been to date. UM doesn't play a system for a true post. It's all ball screens and jump shots.

Personally, I think everyone is overthinking the McGary stuff. He is extremely likely to play only one year of college basketball. His parents would like to see him play. He has one very good friend (Glenn Robinson III) who would play with him and if Hardaway doesn't go pro, they could have a nice one-year run at a FF before he becomes a millionaire.

He will stay close to home. For one year. That is the biggest reason.

dukemsu

[Kedsy]

He has one very good friend (Glenn Robinson III) who would play with him and if Hardaway doesn't go pro, they could have a nice one-year run at a FF before he becomes a millionaire.

Really, you think adding one freshman big man to the current Michigan roster makes a Final Four team? I suppose anything is possible, but it would be an upset if it happened.

[dukeballboy88]

Carlos Boozer ..... 7/8/10 5 $75 million '15

Elton Brand ....... 7/9/08 5 $79.8 miilion '13


If im a big man looking for a program that can take me to the next level, I would look at what some of their players have made after school. Then I would think to myself, Man self, John and Roy's big men they have ever put in the NBA, added together, dont make that kind of money.

[CDu]

Carlos Boozer ..... 7/8/10 5 $75 million '15

Elton Brand ....... 7/9/08 5 $79.8 miilion '13


If im a big man looking for a program that can take me to the next level, I would look at what some of their players have made after school. Then I would think to myself, Man self, John and Roy's big men they have ever put in the NBA, added together, dont make that kind of money.

Well, I wouldn't go quite that far. Calipari has Marcus Camby and DeMarcus Cousins. Williams has Nick Collison, Drew Gooden, Raef LaFrentz, and Tyler Hansbrough. Camby, LaFrentz, Collison, and Gooden all made some pretty good paydays (none as big as Boozer or Brand of course), and Cousins and Hansbrough are likely to join their ranks once they qualify for their second NBA contracts.

[El_Diablo]

Well, I wouldn't go quite that far. Calipari has Marcus Camby and DeMarcus Cousins. Williams has Nick Collison, Drew Gooden, Raef LaFrentz, and Tyler Hansbrough. Camby, LaFrentz, Collison, and Gooden all made some pretty good paydays (none as big as Boozer or Brand of course), and Cousins and Hansbrough are likely to join their ranks once they qualify for their second NBA contracts.

Wrong John though.

[Kedsy]

Carlos Boozer ..... 7/8/10 5 $75 million '15

Elton Brand ....... 7/9/08 5 $79.8 miilion '13


If im a big man looking for a program that can take me to the next level, I would look at what some of their players have made after school. Then I would think to myself, Man self, John and Roy's big men they have ever put in the NBA, added together, dont make that kind of money.

It's also possible that a young big man might want to hear about a payday to a player who played college ball after the young big graduated the third grade. To a teenager, Boozer and Brand are ancient history. It's hard to imagine their success would be the deciding factor in a modern recruit's decision.

[SilkyJ]

Well, I wouldn't go quite that far. Calipari has Marcus Camby and DeMarcus Cousins. Williams has Nick Collison, Drew Gooden, Raef LaFrentz, and Tyler Hansbrough. Camby, LaFrentz, Collison, and Gooden all made some pretty good paydays (none as big as Boozer or Brand of course), and Cousins and Hansbrough are likely to join their ranks once they qualify for their second NBA contracts.

Wrong John though.

CDu- Beilein, not Calipari.

But yes, Williams has had some good big men. Ol Roy has plenty of good NBA players, as does K. Both are top notch programs.

Beilein- not as much. Great coach, love him. But the only thing I can think of for MM is that he wants to be an inside-out 4, aka euro-4, which Beilein's systems works well for.

Also, as much as we love to overanalyze, these are 17/18 year old kids so who knows whats really moving the needle. For all we know MM likes UM's co-eds the most and that's whats driving the issue. Afterall, he'll be a great player wherever he goes and probably makes millions in the L regardless of where he goes, so why not factor in other things if you're a teenager about to start college? Where will I have the best friends? Where will I have the most fun? Maybe, if I want to pursue something after college, where will I get the best education? Fortunately for him he's got all great options. Just hope he chooses the right one

[Huh?]

[QUOTE=SilkyJ;521645]
For all we know MM likes UM's co-eds the most and that's whats driving the issue.



Hahahaa Michigan co-eds. I know it was just a general example, but still.

Someone wrote something about his parents wanting to see him play, his parents have been quoted that they favor Duke. I think a good comparison for McGary is David Lee and he wasn't a "stretch 4," still isn't. Did the dirty work at UF and he developed that 15-18 ft. jumper while in the league. So again, Michigan is an odd choice. Sounds like this AAU coach really has a lot of pull in this situation. Hopefully McGary goes where he WANTS to go not where someone thinks he should go.

Do we have anyone else on our radar other than McGary and Parker as far as big men go?

[wilko]

Do we have anyone else on our radar other than McGary and Parker as far as big men go?

I heard the Nerlens Noel kid was looking to reclassify to the class of '12 (from '13) and that the Staff was checking him out yest.
No idea if there is more to it or how serious it might be...

[Faison1]

Afterall, he'll be a great player wherever he goes and probably makes millions in the L regardless of where he goes, so why not factor in other things if you're a teenager about to start college?

I'm not sure I agree with that. Look at Derrick Favors. I'd argue that he made a major mistake in staying close to home and playing for GTech. His one and only year was pretty underwhelming, if you ask me. He was a good player, and got drafted high, but I think he would have been better off playing for a better coach.

[loldevilz]

It's also possible that a young big man might want to hear about a payday to a player who played college ball after the young big graduated the third grade. To a teenager, Boozer and Brand are ancient history. It's hard to imagine their success would be the deciding factor in a modern recruit's decision.

McRoberts is the more relevant comparison and his difficulties in college probably are hurting rather than helping Duke. If McRoberts was a college superstar I think McGary would have committed already.

[SilkyJ]

I'm not sure I agree with that. Look at Derrick Favors. I'd argue that he made a major mistake in staying close to home and playing for GTech. His one and only year was pretty underwhelming, if you ask me. He was a good player, and got drafted high, but I think he would have been better off playing for a better coach.

you'd really argue that? dude went 3rd in the draft and will make $9.2m GUARANTEED his first two years, with options to make $13-14 over the next two. Doesn't smell like a mistake.

[CDu]

you'd really argue that? dude went 3rd in the draft and will make $9.2m GUARANTEED his first two years, with options to make $13-14 over the next two. Doesn't smell like a mistake.

I think the argument is that he'd have gotten that money regardless of which college he chose. The question is whether he lines up big money in his next contract, and whether his second contract would be better had he gotten his one year of college with coaching somewhere else.

[Starter]

For the record, my guess is Favors will be just fine for that next contract, assuming he gets better at the line. He averaged about 10 points, 7 boards and 1.6 blocked shots and shot 52% in April, when they started boosting his minutes a bit. (24 mpg) I saw Favors play live at Tech and thought he was very raw, but that's to be expected. The Nets had better re-sign Deron Williams, because I think Favors is going to be a strong asset at some point. I don't think Jermaine O'Neal is an unreasonable goal to shoot for.

Note: This is all contingent on them actually playing again.

[Billy Dat]

I think the argument is that he'd have gotten that money regardless of which college he chose. The question is whether he lines up big money in his next contract, and whether his second contract would be better had he gotten his one year of college with coaching somewhere else.

I think it's tough to draw "influence of coaching" arguments about anyone who stays in school for one year. Paul Hewitt had both Chris Bosh and Thad Young for one year who both are very solid, and he also had Javaris Crittendon who may be in jail for the rest of his life. Do we think Bosh, Young or Crittendon would have turned out any different had they been with K for a year? I think it's impossible to make that argument.

I also don't think Brand and Boozer are ancient history to current recruits. They are both still starters in the NBA and there's nothing ancient about their current per-year salaries.

Fact is, what matters to most elite recruits is, ultimately, collecting an NBA salary or making a living with basketball Duke's story in that respect is rock solid, from the current number of players in the league, to their average salaries. The expanded "making a living with basketball" story is even better. What school has a better overall lineage of NBA players, pro players in non-NBA leagues, college and pro coaches, GMs and owners (Arison), television personalities, agents (Melchionni) which doesn't even touch the USA Basketball connections. I am sure we tell that story in recruiting - at least I hope we do.

[SilkyJ]

I think the argument is that he'd have gotten that money regardless of which college he chose.

Well that's what I argued.

Afterall, he'll be a great player wherever he goes and probably makes millions in the L regardless of where he goes, so why not factor in other things if you're a teenager about to start college?

The question is whether he lines up big money in his next contract, and whether his second contract would be better had he gotten his one year of college with coaching somewhere else.

I think its a pretty big stretch to argue that a single year of coaching by one guy vs another is going to have a major impact on your 2nd NBA contract 4 years later. I think the 4 years of coaching and playing in the league are what's going to determine that.

[superdave]

I heard the Nerlens Noel kid was looking to reclassify to the class of '12 (from '13) and that the Staff was checking him out yest.
No idea if there is more to it or how serious it might be...

I do recall hearing discussion of this in the past, probably via Twitter. Can anyone confirm? That would be a good get for us. My understanding in Noel is a great shot blocker, but may not have the offensive game to match. Is that correct?

[CDu]

I think its a pretty big stretch to argue that a single year of coaching by one guy vs another is going to have a major impact on your 2nd NBA contract 4 years later. I think the 4 years of coaching and playing in the league are what's going to determine that.

I agree. I'd extend that even further, and say that I think the impact of college coaching on NBA stardom (whether one-and-done or not) is less than people think. Though I'd say it's especially true for the one-and-done types, for obvious reasons.

I don't think Coach K made Brand or Boozer NBA superstars, but rather those guys were awesome when they came to Duke and remained awesome. I think they'd have been NBA stars with or without Duke. Similarly, I don't think Roy Williams made Tyler Hansbrough a productive NBA player, either. And I definitely don't think Calipari turned any of his one-and-dones into NBA stars.

I don't think any of those coaches hurt the development of those players, but I don't think they're as responsible for those players' success as people often give them credit.

[Class of '94]

I agree. I'd extend that even further, and say that I think the impact of college coaching on NBA stardom (whether one-and-done or not) is less than people think. Though I'd say it's especially true for the one-and-done types, for obvious reasons.

I don't think Coach K made Brand or Boozer NBA superstars, but rather those guys were awesome when they came to Duke and remained awesome. I think they'd have been NBA stars with or without Duke. Similarly, I don't think Roy Williams made Tyler Hansbrough a productive NBA player, either. And I definitely don't think Calipari turned any of his one-and-dones into NBA stars.

I don't think any of those coaches hurt the development of those players, but I don't think they're as responsible for those players' success as people often give them credit.

Having watched both Brand and Boozer extensively at Duke, I think Coach K had a lot to do with them thriving the NBA. Brand played 2 years at Duke, and the his improvement from his freshman year to his sophmore year was very noticeable. Likewise with Boozer, I thought he improved tremendously from his freshman year to his junior year at Duke (Boozer became more physical, dealt with physcical contact better, and improved his post moves during that time). And I think the improvement they both made at Duke under the watchful eye of Coach K propelled them to stardom in the NBA imo.