Page 4 of 179 FirstFirst ... 234561454104 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 80 of 3573
  1. #61
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Richmond, Va
    Quote Originally Posted by jjh1080 View Post
    Kind of new to posting here but viewing for a while. Many of these posts are the same.

    Because a guy is top 2 or 3 for his position people think he should be an automatic recruit. My question is don't you think a team, like Duke, should recruit a guy that fits Duke? I mean Wall was a top notch guy but do you really think he would have fit the Duke style?

    Duke won the championship this year because they played "team" basketball but no way does Wall appear to be a "team" player. I know that many teams were after him but it seems like Duke gave up on him because they sensed something a midst with him.

    Yet many posters here think because a guy is a top rated guy Duke should purse them. In all honesty, many posters appear to not have any confidence in the coaching staff in making the right recruiting decision. Do you all think you know more than the coaching staff when it comes to recruiting? Have you guys actually talked with the recruits to find out what they are thinking?

    Case in point, would Duke have been better off recruiting Love over Singler? Towards the end Duke gave up on Love and went after Singler, I think they saw somethings we fans didn't.
    Much like we will be doing with Irving, Duke would have fit Wall's playing style (up-tempo offense)...Duke fits their playing style to the players they have, not the other way around.

    Please don't make accusations of Wall not being a "team player" when, in all likelihood, you haven't seen enough of the kid play to evaluate that part of his game. Wall is a great player, and while things worked out without him, we certainly would have welcomed him with open arms.

  2. #62
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Isn't Thornton a 3 star recruit? Duke recruited him and signed him.

  3. #63

    pecking order

    Having seen Tokoto, Jefferson, Goodman, Muhammed and Murphy, i would say that Muhammed is by far the best player of the 5 and in my opinion i think Murphy would have to be # 2 on the list. From what i've seen of Tokoto, he is not assertive and his outside shot needs work, he is a great athlete but Muhammed is very close in that area and he (Shabazz) is not afraid to work hard inside. It looked to me that Tokoto was just trying to pass the ball and at no point did he try to take over the game. Murphy's skill set is very close to Dunleavy and Singler. He has great shooting mechanics and plays a lot like Kyle. I really like Goodman but he seemed to do all his work inside, he is a very tough guy and fights for everything, his outside shot needs a little work. Jefferson is very skilled but extremely thin, John Henson thin. All of these comparisons can and will change over the next 3 years, so we need to take my observations with a grain of salt. I would say if Duke were able to land Muhammed and Murphy, the coaching staff would be very happy indeed. In closing remember that Tokoto, Jefferson and Goodman are playing in the 16 & under group, while Muhammed & Murphy are playing in the 17 & over group.

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Richmond, Va
    Quote Originally Posted by jjh1080 View Post
    Isn't Thornton a 3 star recruit? Duke recruited him and signed him.
    The question is of who is priority, Justin Anderson, a hands-down 5-Star recruit with a huge interest in Duke, or Alex Murphy, a 3-Star. Like I said, I dont know much about Murphy but I would have to say that the former would be of more importance.

    I never said we shouldnt recruit him...

  5. #65
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Quote Originally Posted by MisterRoddy View Post
    Much like we will be doing with Irving, Duke would have fit Wall's playing style (up-tempo offense)...Duke fits their playing style to the players they have, not the other way around.

    Please don't make accusations of Wall not being a "team player" when, in all likelihood, you haven't seen enough of the kid play to evaluate that part of his game. Wall is a great player, and while things worked out without him, we certainly would have welcomed him with open arms.
    Fully understood, but how do think Coach K would have reacted to pulling Wall out of the game and saying something to him and Wall rolling his eyes. He did this on multiple occasions during the year. Does that fit the Duke style?

    I think he and Coach K would have been at odds all season long. I think that is why Duke gave up on him.

    Irving appears to be very aware of the "team" concept. He is quoted as saying he might not have had a good night but assisting his team mates helped win the game. Not sure there are any quotes of Wall saying that.

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by MisterRoddy View Post
    The question is of who is priority, Justin Anderson, a hands-down 5-Star recruit with a huge interest in Duke, or Alex Murphy, a 3-Star. Like I said, I dont know much about Murphy but I would have to say that the former would be of more importance.

    I never said we shouldnt recruit him...
    Please note the observations of posters like Verga and airowe who are actually watching some of these players in action.

    The ratings of Rivals, Scouts, etc. are a very limited way to get information about potential recruits, particularly players in the class of 2011 and 2012. Things change very quickly. The judgment and preferences of the Duke staff may vary considerably from current star-ratings.

    Edit to add: this very much applies to the post below by O-knarf. Don't get so hung up on ratings from recruiting services. I'll go with Coach K and his staff over the Rivals or Scouts evaluations.
    Last edited by roywhite; 05-30-2010 at 12:02 AM.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by airowe View Post
    For some reason you're leaving out the one '12 wing that will be visiting Duke on Monday, Alex Murphy. Anderson is absolutely very athletic, but his basketball skills are lacking. Go read DraftExpress' recent tweets about him and you will know what every scout I trust has ever said about Anderson.
    Here is what I got from Draft Express when I looked on that site:

    While obviously itís way too early to be talking about a player who just finished his freshman year of high school, it was tough not taking notice of the talent that Justin Anderson displays. Not only does the lefty bring great physical tools to the table, highlighted by a great frame, wingspan and athleticism, but he also looks to be a very smart, tough, active player with a pretty nice stroke. He competed non-stop, defended extremely well and also did a great job crashing the glass. Already ranked by ESPN as one of the top five players in the 2012 high school class, Anderson has quite a future ahead of him if he continues to work hard and doesnít let the hype go to his head.

    This is from the site you just sited. Sound like someone I just described... Someone with incredible upside but someone who is developing and working on some things, which prospect at this point is not? Also, where in here does it say he needs to improve his basketball skills? Seem like a guy who is raw and just needs to keep on working his skills like every other prospect in this class. This does not sound like a guy who has "lacking basketball skills".

    Alex Murphy is not one of the best SF in the 2012 class, nowhere close. He is not ranked on Scout, not ranked on Rivals, and is graded a 93 on the ESPN. He is a good player yes, but not in the same league as Tokoto, Jefferson, Andersen, or Shabazz Muhammad .

    Take a look what Scout INC has the top 3 SF'S as of right now:

    Shabazz Muhammad: 97

    Justin Andersen: 96

    J.P Tokoto: 96


    Here is what Scouts INC says about prospects in the 94-97 range:

    94-97: High-major prospect
    Player has the potential to significantly contribute as a freshman for most national programs. He could be a three- or four-year starter and have an opportunity for all-league honors.
    Here is where Alex Murphy is currently ranked:

    90-93: High-major minus prospect
    Player has the potential to significantly contribute to a national program as a freshman. He could be a four-year contributor with an opportunity to start over the course of his career.

    So my point is that Murphy maybe a good player, but he doesn't have the same potential as Andersen, Muhammad and Tokoto.

  8. #68
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by jjh1080 View Post
    Fully understood, but how do think Coach K would have reacted to pulling Wall out of the game and saying something to him and Wall rolling his eyes. He did this on multiple occasions during the year. Does that fit the Duke style?

    I think he and Coach K would have been at odds all season long. I think that is why Duke gave up on him.

    Irving appears to be very aware of the "team" concept. He is quoted as saying he might not have had a good night but assisting his team mates helped win the game. Not sure there are any quotes of Wall saying that.
    Seems to me that Duke and Coach K recruited John Wall pretty hard; they weren't in on him early, but certainly made a push last spring. It was the subject of great interest (and controversy) on this board.

    I can't say I'm sorry that John Wall went elsewhere, because Duke had a great season without him. However, Wall was a terrific player at Kentucky, a first team All-America who scored, but also involved his teammates.

    There's probably a better example than John Wall of highly ranked players that Duke doesn't pursue.

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Princeton, NJ

    Marin, Johnny D, Hurley for 3!

    Just because Wall behaved that way with Calipari does not mean that in a different environment, he would behave the same way. If Lebron, Carmelo, etal don't roll their eyes at K, I suspect that John Wall would not have either. Not that there have not been people who have not seen "eye to eye" with Coach K (Greg Newton, etc.)

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    Please note the observations of posters like Verga and airowe who are actually watching some of these players in action.

    The ratings of Rivals, Scouts, etc. are a very limited way to get information about potential recruits, particularly players in the class of 2011 and 2012. Things change very quickly. The judgment and preferences of the Duke staff may vary considerably from current star-ratings.
    I agree with this, but I pointed out this fact because people are trying to bring up NBA Scout grades when the kid is a Sophmore in High School. I had to use those grades to help me back this up. I have seen some of Murphy, and I think he could be a good starter on this team and sorta has a Singler type of game and has a great outside shot, but he isn't what Andersen is right now.

  11. #71
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Osiagledknarf View Post
    I agree with this, but I pointed out this fact because people are trying to bring up NBA Scout grades when the kid is a Sophmore in High School. I had to use those grades to help me back this up. I have seen some of Murphy, and I think he could be a good starter on this team and sorta has a Singler type of game and has a great outside shot, but he isn't what Andersen is right now.
    That's strictly your opinion. I don't find your support convincing at all.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    That's strictly your opinion. I don't find your support convincing at all.
    Why not? What have I done to not be convincing?

  13. #73
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    Seems to me that Duke and Coach K recruited John Wall pretty hard; they weren't in on him early, but certainly made a push last spring. It was the subject of great interest (and controversy) on this board.

    I can't say I'm sorry that John Wall went elsewhere, because Duke had a great season without him. However, Wall was a terrific player at Kentucky, a first team All-America who scored, but also involved his teammates.

    There's probably a better example than John Wall of highly ranked players that Duke doesn't pursue.
    Yes, but didn't he get into some trouble with entering a vacant house. I remember reading about how the Duke had gone warm on Wall about a week before he had an issue with entering a vacant house. I think the coaching staff has much more insight into recruits than anyone on this board.

  14. #74
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Osiagledknarf View Post
    Why not? What have I done to not be convincing?
    You are using outdated, incomplete, or possibly inaccurate sources to give a firm opinion on something that you don't personally know much about.

    I have read posts and scouting reports from some long-time contributors here like Verga and airowe. I pay attention to them because I know they do their homework, and see many of these guys in person.

    I don't value your opinion.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by jjh1080 View Post
    Fully understood, but how do think Coach K would have reacted to pulling Wall out of the game and saying something to him and Wall rolling his eyes. He did this on multiple occasions during the year. Does that fit the Duke style?

    I think he and Coach K would have been at odds all season long. I think that is why Duke gave up on him.
    It is also possible that surrounded by our Coaches and uppper classman leadership Wall would have follwed the example set for him. If you allow the inmates to run the asylum they will. I Think our guys generally understand that they are not bigger than the team or the program and buy into the team concept. I'm not sure Cal commands the same respect or that he even expects it.

    Also I wasn't aware that Duke gave up on Wall.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    You are using outdated, incomplete, or possibly inaccurate sources to give a firm opinion on something that you don't personally know much about.

    I have read posts and scouting reports from some long-time contributors here like Verga and airowe. I pay attention to them because I know they do their homework, and see many of these guys in person.

    I don't value your opinion.
    How is this outdated? I used the site that Airowe asked me to go too!!

    I have seen Murphy because he plays in a school in Southborough, MA, and I live in Maine. I have just shown you a very well thought out point and you are saying it is out of date and inaccurate. How is this? And how do you know I don't know about these guys?

  17. #77
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Richmond, Va
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    Please note the observations of posters like Verga and airowe who are actually watching some of these players in action.

    The ratings of Rivals, Scouts, etc. are a very limited way to get information about potential recruits, particularly players in the class of 2011 and 2012. Things change very quickly. The judgment and preferences of the Duke staff may vary considerably from current star-ratings.

    Edit to add: this very much applies to the post below by O-knarf. Don't get so hung up on ratings from recruiting services. I'll go with Coach K and his staff over the Rivals or Scouts evaluations.
    I'm pretty sure we can all agree with that.

    And for those who haven't seen much of this kid Murphys game, like myself, heres a video of him.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCVmcls-mfc

  18. #78
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lewisville, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by Osiagledknarf View Post
    How is this outdated? I used the site that Airowe asked me to go too!!

    I have seen Murphy because he plays in a school in Southborough, MA, and I live in Maine. I have just shown you a very well thought out point and you are saying it is out of date and inaccurate. How is this? And how do you know I don't know about these guys?
    You have quoted Scout and Rivals evaluations of players that are finishing their sophomore year or perhaps junior year in high school. We are just starting the summer period where the top players go against each other in tournaments. Ratings change very quickly.

    You might have told me a couple years ago that this Kyrie Irving kid wasn't rated very highly after his sophomore year, and that we should go after somebody else.

    I have read your posts here, and I don't think you add anything to the discussion about potential recruits. You read some Rivals, Scouts, ESPN pieces and believe them to be the final word.

    Good night.

  19. #79
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Richmond, Va
    Quote Originally Posted by Osiagledknarf View Post
    How is this outdated? I used the site that Airowe asked me to go too!!

    I have seen Murphy because he plays in a school in Southborough, MA, and I live in Maine. I have just shown you a very well thought out point and you are saying it is out of date and inaccurate. How is this? And how do you know I don't know about these guys?
    If its any consolation, I believe Airowe told you to refer to draftexpress' recent TWITTER updates about Anderson which are:


    . Justin Anderson (2012) didn't play great, but I absolutely love him as a prospect. Plays his I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this. off, defends, rebounds, is smart, unselfish

    Justin Anderson cnt'd: A top-10 recruit that regularly dives on floor for loose balls. Unheard of. Not skilled. Average shooter/ballhandler.

    Justin Anderson cnt'd- Young, so still has time to work on his skill-level (for now is poor). Looks like a hard worker, good guy. Smart.
    These updates are as recent as today whereas the scouting report you had was from August of last year.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by lotusland View Post
    It is also possible that surrounded by our Coaches and uppper classman leadership Wall would have follwed the example set for him. If you allow the inmates to run the asylum they will. I Think our guys generally understand that they are not bigger than the team or the program and buy into the team concept. I'm not sure Cal commands the same respect or that he even expects it.

    Also I wasn't aware that Duke gave up on Wall.
    Quote Originally Posted by roywhite View Post
    You have quoted Scout and Rivals evaluations of players that are finishing their sophomore year or perhaps junior year in high school. We are just starting the summer period where the top players go against each other in tournaments. Ratings change very quickly.

    You might have told me a couple years ago that this Kyrie Irving kid wasn't rated very highly after his sophomore year, and that we should go after somebody else.

    I have read your posts here, and I don't think you add anything to the discussion about potential recruits. You read some Rivals, Scouts, ESPN pieces and believe them to be the final word.

    Good night.

    I have said this many times on here... All players AT THIS TIME need to develop... When someone says something about NBA scout grades, I had to come back with that, not that I am judging them right now on there scout rating... I am just putting it out to this point right now.

    How do you know what I would have said about Kyrie Irving? I would have said he would be a good kid to go after because I know people who played against him in AAU, same thing with Murphy and the other prospects 2010-On. So I have some very good things to offer here..

Similar Threads

  1. Quincy Miller to Baylor
    By houstondukie in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 1137
    Last Post: 03-31-2011, 01:23 PM
  2. Michael Chandler Recruiting Thread
    By Big Pappa in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: 05-14-2010, 05:13 PM
  3. TaShawn Mabry recruiting thread
    By shoutingncu in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 39
    Last Post: 12-08-2009, 11:47 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •