Page 11 of 15 FirstFirst ... 910111213 ... LastLast
Results 201 to 220 of 300
  1. #201
    Ok, here goes! Went into this afternoon both anxious and excited to watch the game, figuring it would be a battle. One that Duke would win or lose in the last couple of minutes. However, I came away as frustrated as I have been all year and probably the past few years. Maybe its because of the expectations I had of this team. I honestly thought this team was better than last years and had shot at the Final 4, maybe a championship. Did I or do I think they are favorites? No, but I thought they had a shot. I'm not going to sit here with "Duke glasses" on and make things seem ok and all is grand in Duke land nor am I about to say this team sucks, they're an embarrassment or anything like that. I will though make some critical observations.

    1. NBA talent - in general, NBA talent is prevelant on championship teams, usually 2 or 3 players that start and one or two off the bench that may be frosh or sophs. G'Town by virtue of having a lottery pick in Monroe made a huge difference. Duke 2001 had JWill, Batter, Dunleavy, Boozer, Duhon - Floride had Noah, Horford, Brewer - UNC each of their years had upwards of 4+ guys - UCONN had Okafor, Gordon, Villaneuva, Boone. I think you get the hint. When I look at this Duke team, do I see NBA talent? To me, it's questionable at best. I love Scheyer but I don't see a NBA rotation guy. Singler probably has no NBA position as he is NBA 3 1/2. Mason? Maybe but he isn't really being productive enough this year to help the cause. Nolan, maybe the best shot IMO, similar to a Rodney Stuckey IMO but more as a 3rd guard type. All the above are good players but not NBA types.

    2. Athleticism - lack thereof stands out against the top teams, especially on teh road and at true "neutral" sites that do not include MSG, Meadowlands or Chicage which are quasi-Duke home games. At games at Cameron, the lack thereof is mitigated by the overwhelming support of the Crazies which helps pump the team up not one but more than one level. Today I felt that Monroe, Wright and Freemand ran circles around their defenders and honestly felt there big 3 to be better than ours now, though slightly overall. I had thought otherwise initially.

    3. Post presence - yes we have more big man depth this year but none provides a consistent post presence. When the outside shots are falling, or when we are having trouble getting to the basket there is no one to say, go post up and lets drop it down there for a nice drop step, turn around jumper or baby hook. There is nothing there. And now that it appears over the last 5 games or so that the team is falling in love more with the 3 point shot, I this this lack of post presence becomes more apparant. Although Monroe is more a perimeter big man, he did at least provide a presence during certain sets.

    I think these are the main issues. Unfortunately, I don't this any of these can be fixed now but only over the next few years with recruiting. Do we need all 3 to win? No but one or two need to be addressed to be able to meet the expectations of everyone.

    Do I now temper my expectations? Probably a bit! I still see a Sweet 16 team but one that could as easily lose in the 2nd round as it could find itself in the Elite 8 depending on matchups. I do at this moment fear the 2nd round loss more so than think they can get to the Elite 8.

    At to my fellow posters, don't be embarrassed by team. That is harsh! Frustrated is fine but not embarrassed.

  2. #202
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO

    Wink Well...

    Quote Originally Posted by Genedoc View Post
    Why single out the interior play? The perimeter effort was no better.

    This is just flatly not a very good team right now. The defense is so bad we're capable of giving up 100 points to anyone we play, and it looks like there are 4-5 different agendas on the floor at any given time on offense.
    At the same time, the two games against Clemson and the WF beatdown were vintage performances by a very, very tough team.

    This edition ofthe Devils seems to be more up-and-down than any in memory.

    sagegrouse

  3. #203
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Steamboat Springs, CO

    Wink How about #10 in Gray?

    Quote Originally Posted by loldevilz View Post
    My thoughts: we need a real point guard... we need a big man...most of all we need some toughness
    I think we have a pretty good team, but I sure would like to have Greg Monroe suiting up for the Devils.

    sagegrouse

  4. #204
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    About 150 feet in front of the Duke Chapel doors.
    Quote Originally Posted by 77devil View Post
    I hope your not suggesting that this is a meaningful comparison.
    No, I'm not comparing this team to Duke's 1991 team. The OP stated that his theory was that no championship team gets blown out by 20 or more in their season, so I provided some historical context.
    JBDuke

    Andre Dawkins: “People ask me if I can still shoot, and I ask them if they can still breathe. That’s kind of the same thing.”

  5. #205
    kyrie irving will prove to be duke's most important recruit in a half dozen years. his ability to break down the defense will provide us with a dimension on offense we haven't seen in a long, long time. not sure we've had an easy basket in the half-court set since jason williams.

  6. #206
    Join Date
    Dec 2009

    Folks

    Our true depth and scoring left last year and earlier this year. Can you say Marty Pocius (5th year) and Olek Cyz? Both scorers with passion, energy, vocal potential and a tremendous capacity to score in a variety of ways/at the rim, from three, create own shot, and in Oleks case; tough. There's our depth.

  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by KyDevilinIL View Post
    I agree, but i've wanted to believe such a turnaround was possible the last three years. I want to believe now, but I'm being realistic.

    Past four games, it's alarming how far we have played under what I perceive our potential to be. And in two of those games, we never had a chance. I know some will argue that we were a stop or two or a shot or two from getting back into it. But the fact is that we didn't do those things, and we were never a threat to actually win today.

    I don't know where the turnaround is gonna come from. Our offense, once again, revolves entirely around jump shots. We know that doesn't work in March. Our defense seems to be gradually disappearing, at least in terms of something we can count on night in and night out.

    The teams that flip switches do so because they were losing while they are improving, working out kinks, etc. They are building toward something, then they start winning and everyone says a switch was flipped. But I don't know what we are building toward. I'd love to be enlightened by someone, but overall it sure seems like we're just a less efficient, less energetic and less confident version of what we were in November. And it's a bummer, because I really think we're capable of being so much better. We've seen it.
    Hang in...I feel you. It's been pretty choppy lately. My belief is that Coach K and the staff have the best feel for what needs to happen to make a serious run in the NCAA this year. Consistent, smothering Duke D is one thing, as you address...and our shots will fall again. Dre got a few more minutes today and Mason is progressing. If these guys continue to gain confidence and learn more about the mental and physical chops it takes to excell, we will get better. Our veterans will be fine, and am sure they realize what needs to be done. I'm confident in this team's present abilities...and even more so in what is to come!

  8. #208
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    The City of Brotherly Love except when it's cold.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildcat View Post
    Our true depth and scoring left last year and earlier this year. Can you say Marty Pocius (5th year) and Olek Cyz? Both scorers with passion, energy, vocal potential and a tremendous capacity to score in a variety of ways/at the rim, from three, create own shot, and in Oleks case; tough. There's our depth.
    I thought this thread had plumed the depths of what this team may be missing until I read the above. We all wish Marty and Olek had achieved the expectation they arrived with. But they are not the answer. Not even close.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by JBDuke View Post
    No, I'm not comparing this team to Duke's 1991 team. The OP stated that his theory was that no championship team gets blown out by 20 or more in their season, so I provided some historical context.
    You have to admit though it's quite rare for a championship team to get blown out by more than 20 points in their season. I see now that it happens, but I'm guessing it doesn't happen very often.

  10. #210
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by NYDukie View Post
    Ok, here goes! Went into this afternoon both anxious and excited to watch the game, figuring it would be a battle. One that Duke would win or lose in the last couple of minutes. However, I came away as frustrated as I have been all year and probably the past few years. Maybe its because of the expectations I had of this team. I honestly thought this team was better than last years and had shot at the Final 4, maybe a championship. Did I or do I think they are favorites? No, but I thought they had a shot. I'm not going to sit here with "Duke glasses" on and make things seem ok and all is grand in Duke land nor am I about to say this team sucks, they're an embarrassment or anything like that. I will though make some critical observations.

    1. NBA talent - in general, NBA talent is prevelant on championship teams, usually 2 or 3 players that start and one or two off the bench that may be frosh or sophs. G'Town by virtue of having a lottery pick in Monroe made a huge difference. Duke 2001 had JWill, Batter, Dunleavy, Boozer, Duhon - Floride had Noah, Horford, Brewer - UNC each of their years had upwards of 4+ guys - UCONN had Okafor, Gordon, Villaneuva, Boone. I think you get the hint. When I look at this Duke team, do I see NBA talent? To me, it's questionable at best. I love Scheyer but I don't see a NBA rotation guy. Singler probably has no NBA position as he is NBA 3 1/2. Mason? Maybe but he isn't really being productive enough this year to help the cause. Nolan, maybe the best shot IMO, similar to a Rodney Stuckey IMO but more as a 3rd guard type. All the above are good players but not NBA types.

    2. Athleticism - lack thereof stands out against the top teams, especially on teh road and at true "neutral" sites that do not include MSG, Meadowlands or Chicage which are quasi-Duke home games. At games at Cameron, the lack thereof is mitigated by the overwhelming support of the Crazies which helps pump the team up not one but more than one level. Today I felt that Monroe, Wright and Freemand ran circles around their defenders and honestly felt there big 3 to be better than ours now, though slightly overall. I had thought otherwise initially.

    3. Post presence - yes we have more big man depth this year but none provides a consistent post presence. When the outside shots are falling, or when we are having trouble getting to the basket there is no one to say, go post up and lets drop it down there for a nice drop step, turn around jumper or baby hook. There is nothing there. And now that it appears over the last 5 games or so that the team is falling in love more with the 3 point shot, I this this lack of post presence becomes more apparant. Although Monroe is more a perimeter big man, he did at least provide a presence during certain sets.

    I think these are the main issues. Unfortunately, I don't this any of these can be fixed now but only over the next few years with recruiting. Do we need all 3 to win? No but one or two need to be addressed to be able to meet the expectations of everyone.

    Do I now temper my expectations? Probably a bit! I still see a Sweet 16 team but one that could as easily lose in the 2nd round as it could find itself in the Elite 8 depending on matchups. I do at this moment fear the 2nd round loss more so than think they can get to the Elite 8.

    At to my fellow posters, don't be embarrassed by team. That is harsh! Frustrated is fine but not embarrassed.
    Good points and I agree with you. A Patterson or Monroe on this team would be nice(or Elliot and Gerald).

  11. #211
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildcat View Post
    Our true depth and scoring left last year and earlier this year. Can you say Marty Pocius (5th year) and Olek Cyz? Both scorers with passion, energy, vocal potential and a tremendous capacity to score in a variety of ways/at the rim, from three, create own shot, and in Oleks case; tough. There's our depth.
    Olek played 111 minutes at Duke. In that time, he had 23 points and 11 turnovers, and shot 10 for 25. I'm not sure he ever displayed a "tremendous capacity to score" during his time here.
    Just be you. You is enough. - K, 4/5/10, 0:13.8 to play, 60-59 Duke.

    You're all jealous hypocrites. - Titus on Laettner

    You see those guys? Animals. They're animals. - SIU Coach Chris Lowery, on Duke

  12. #212
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC

    too many threes

    I know this has been said ad nauseum, but we are too reliant on the three. We are simply not a great three-point shooting team and shouldn't be constructing our offense around it. Not only does shooting a lot of threes leave you vulnerable for a "cold" game, but it doesn't force the other team to work on defense at all. With each missed shot their confidence grows as they feel we're simply afraid to challenge them. On our end, the big guys are asked simply to screen and rebound, so it's tough for them to really feel involved.

    Even in the second half when we were down by around 10 or so, I didn't think we needed to panic and shoot so many threes. I do recognize that we did a good job working the ball and getting some open looks, and if those had gone it we'd have been in decent shape. Still, the big guys need to get more touches.

    Let me say that I'm not in the camp that believes you can shoot threes some games, but then when they're not falling you should stop and do other things. I think you need to define your identity. And this team's identity should NOT be one that hoists 29 threes a game.
    Last edited by UrinalCake; 01-31-2010 at 12:45 AM.

  13. #213
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    A few thoughts:

    1. Perhaps one or two teams could have beaten the Hoyas in that environment today with them playing at that level. Duke isn't one of them.
    The Hoyas wereelectric, and clearly they had been pointing to this game for a long time.

    2. The "not athletic" stuff to me is a cop-out. Miles and Mason can match almost anyone in that area. The problem isn't that Duke doesn't have athletic players. It certainly wasn't a problem against Clemson, Florida State or UConn. The problem is that today, several players didn't execute. Miles and Mason have to be excellent for Duke to beat teams like Georgetown. They fought hard but consistently got caught in bad positions at both ends of the floor.

    3. This team has advantages over many teams. However, they have problems with dribble penetration defensively, and it sure seems like a good zone defense could help. However, people wishing Duke could play Syracuse's 2-3 zone are being shortsighted. The zone Syracuse plays has multiple variations, and it's as much a way of life at Syracuse as the overplay man to man is at Duke. Expecting Duke to run a zone defense at that level if they don't commit to it as a program is simply unrealistic.

    I don't believe that mystical intangibles like leadership and desire are lacking with this team. The team does have structural flaws that can be exploited by teams who match up a certain way. That's what happened today. I don't think that's anything that can be switched up by having someone yell and scream at them (I believe the post that made a point saying that players yelling and screaming does not correlate to "leadership" was deleted, but I heartily second that point) or by Olek or Marty still being around. If they were the answers, they'd still be here.

    I'm backing this group, and I think they present problems for many, many teams. Today didn't change that.

    dukemsu

  14. #214
    Some of you need to relax. One game in January will not make or break this Duke team. Ever think of giving credit to JTIII and Georgetown? They played beautifully. They made Duke pay for mistakes(which they had a number of).. Still, They hit everything. This season is FAR from over! Is this a championship team? I personally dont think so, but they are a very good team that if they get hot.. You never know.

    For the posters that have given up and are looking towards next year, You could do us(or me) a favor and just disappear til after the season. Maybe im being too harsh by saying some of these things, but you guys act like this Duke team doesn't deserve to be ranked in the Top-25.

    I don't have alot of things to say about the game that haven't been said so Congrats to Georgetown.

  15. #215
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    Quote Originally Posted by ncexnyc View Post
    Stewart Mandel has already got a piece up on SI about today's game and he isn't being very kind to the team.
    Whatever. Mandel is a football writer who knows jack about basketball. He didn't even cover college basketball last year.

    dukemsu

  16. #216
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Quote Originally Posted by UrinalCake View Post
    I know this has been said ad nauseum, but we are too reliant on the three. We are simply not a great three-point shooting team and shouldn't be constructing our offense around it. Not only does shooting a lot of threes leave you vulnerable for a "cold" game, but it doesn't force the other team to work on defense at all. With each missed shot their confidence grows as they feel we're simply afraid to challenge them. On our end, the big guys are asked simply to screen and rebound, so it's tough for them to really feel involved.

    Even in the second half when we were down by around 10 or so, I didn't think we needed to panic and shoot so many threes. I do recognize that we did a good job working the ball and getting some open looks, and if those had gone it we'd have been in decent shape. Still, the big guys need to get more touches.

    Let me say that I'm not in the camp that believes you can shoot threes some games, but then when they're not falling you should stop and do other things. I think you need to define your identity. And this team's identity should NOT be one that hoists 29 threes a game.
    For what it's worth, this team's identity is not one that hoists 29 threes a game. Actually, we hoist just under 20 a game, and those 20 represent only 32% of our overall shot attempts. We actually take fewer threes in ACC play - 17 a game, and just 29.4% of our shots. Overreliance on the 3 isn't even a hallmark of our losses; yes, today we shot a lot from outside, but across our 4 losses we've only shot 36% of our attempts from 3, which still is not that highly reliant.

    This is not a team that lives and dies by the three. It does, however, do a lot of jump shooting. We need to get a lot more layups and dunks, and shoot a lot fewer 15 footers. If we want to reduce jump shots, it's the one's between the paint and the 3-point line that we should minimize, and not the 3s.
    Just be you. You is enough. - K, 4/5/10, 0:13.8 to play, 60-59 Duke.

    You're all jealous hypocrites. - Titus on Laettner

    You see those guys? Animals. They're animals. - SIU Coach Chris Lowery, on Duke

  17. #217
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington, D.C.
    1. Georgetown played terrifically. Flawlessly. Have to think that their focus was helped by two beatdowns, one at the hands of Syracuse which they might have been looking past because this was payback time, baby, and they were ready.

    2. I don't like how this offense moves the ball. Three men occupy it way too much. The ball needs to enter and exit the post a couple of times a possession most of the time, eith on dribble or pass penetration. I cannot understand how few catches are made by bigs, and how little the offense depends on such catches.

    3. Scheyer seemed to pull the string on his shots and, as one poster noticed last week, seems to make himself small after the catch which is a position to attack with force only he don't. He seems off balance in that position. They tried to post him some in the second half but no one seemed comfortable.

    My thought, if you don't worry, stress the other team with your offense, and actually give up easy ones off of give ups, it's hard to play good d.

    I think Duke was looking past Georgetown. I think that they really want Tech. I know that I would. I'm predicting a very different showing against Tech. I'm predicting Duke wins.

  18. #218
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Quote Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
    My thought, if you don't worry, stress the other team with your offense, and actually give up easy ones off of give ups, it's hard to play good d.
    This may not have been what you meant, but one thing I've noticed is that we don't do a good job on offense dictating what's going to happen. We too often let the defense decide what is available, and just take what the defense leaves open, rather than try to impose a certain result on the defense and make them react.
    Just be you. You is enough. - K, 4/5/10, 0:13.8 to play, 60-59 Duke.

    You're all jealous hypocrites. - Titus on Laettner

    You see those guys? Animals. They're animals. - SIU Coach Chris Lowery, on Duke

  19. #219
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Quote Originally Posted by pfrduke View Post
    This is not a team that lives and dies by the three. It does, however, do a lot of jump shooting.
    Well stated, and I agree with your points however I personally feel that shooting threes on 30% of our shots is still too much. I guess it's more of a mindset issue for me. It seems like our first goal is to shoot a three or, as you say, a 15-foot jump shot. We never look for the bigs, and they only get the ball if it's off an offensive rebound or a broken play. Whenever a guard does happen to get into the lane, the defense can play for the pass because it's usually going to be kicked out; or if a shot is taken it's an off-balance runner. Perhaps our coaching staff has decided that a 15-foot jump shot is a higher percentage play than posting up inside, and I'm not one to argue with them, but after a day like today it just feels like we need to try something different.

  20. #220
    Quote Originally Posted by dukemsu View Post
    A few thoughts:

    1. Perhaps one or two teams could have beaten the Hoyas in that environment today with them playing at that level. Duke isn't one of them.
    The Hoyas wereelectric, and clearly they had been pointing to this game for a long time.

    2. The "not athletic" stuff to me is a cop-out. Miles and Mason can match almost anyone in that area. The problem isn't that Duke doesn't have athletic players. It certainly wasn't a problem against Clemson, Florida State or UConn. The problem is that today, several players didn't execute. Miles and Mason have to be excellent for Duke to beat teams like Georgetown. They fought hard but consistently got caught in bad positions at both ends of the floor.

    3. This team has advantages over many teams. However, they have problems with dribble penetration defensively, and it sure seems like a good zone defense could help. However, people wishing Duke could play Syracuse's 2-3 zone are being shortsighted. The zone Syracuse plays has multiple variations, and it's as much a way of life at Syracuse as the overplay man to man is at Duke. Expecting Duke to run a zone defense at that level if they don't commit to it as a program is simply unrealistic.

    I don't believe that mystical intangibles like leadership and desire are lacking with this team. The team does have structural flaws that can be exploited by teams who match up a certain way. That's what happened today. I don't think that's anything that can be switched up by having someone yell and scream at them (I believe the post that made a point saying that players yelling and screaming does not correlate to "leadership" was deleted, but I heartily second that point) or by Olek or Marty still being around. If they were the answers, they'd still be here.

    I'm backing this group, and I think they present problems for many, many teams. Today didn't change that.

    dukemsu
    I agree. Duke has the pieces- but those pieces are young up front. Miles and Mason need to be a bigger focus of the offense to be sure. There needs to be more passing and patience. I agree that Duke cannot zone- but they can mix it in and be effective. But Duke struggles with big strong guards and I do not see that changing. Still, Duke needs to get more effective scoring up front and developing that is important not just for this year but for future years. This needs to be the point of emphasis for this team. My sense is that Duke tried to do this yesterday and it quickly fell apart when Georgetown got on a roll. Once down, they reverted to what was comfortable.

Similar Threads

  1. MBB: Duke-Georgetown Pre-Game Thread
    By sagegrouse in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 203
    Last Post: 01-30-2010, 03:15 PM
  2. MBB: Duke 76, Georgetown 67 Post-Game Thread
    By Bob Green in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 167
    Last Post: 01-20-2009, 03:26 AM
  3. MBB: Duke vs Georgetown Pregame/In-game Thread
    By Troublemaker in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 121
    Last Post: 01-17-2009, 03:41 PM
  4. Duke MBB v. Barton College - In-Game and Post-Game Thread
    By JBDuke in forum Elizabeth King Forum
    Replies: 74
    Last Post: 11-06-2007, 12:11 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •