UNC Hate Coming On

[Mike Corey]

Steve Kirschner, UNC's Associate Director of Athletics for Communications:

"First, Coach Williams did not instruct security to throw him out the building. He told security to find out if the fan had a ticket for that seat because Coach wanted to know how he got a seat in the section behind our bench. Second, security ejected the fan because they believed him to be intoxicated, something that our security and security staffs at arenas all over the country due regularly."

Steve Kirschner's a very nice person, and a very good SID, based on my limited interactions with him.

But this strikes me as someone being given a difficult task.

Kirschner's entire statement is, largely, irrelevant.

Roy-Will stated after the game that he didn't want people saying negative things about his players when in the Dean Dome. If those negative things were personal attacks, vulgarities, etc,. I would surely join him in cleaning up the stands. But the negative statement--reported widely by unaffiliated sources--was merely wishing that one of Roy's players would miss a free throw.

That's the story, IMO.

[_Gary]

Come on, Wheat. You're better than this. I can't believe you are turning a blind eye to something so obvious. The guy was NOT drunk and Roy most assuredly asked for the guy to be removed. I'll believe my own eyes before I believe a director that has a stake in making something pathetic look ok!

[Duvall]

I tend to believe the UNC director of communications...

The reporters that observed the events did not note any obvious drunkenness or belligerence from the fan. But you choose to believe the individual whose job it is to make this mildly embarrassing incident go away as quickly as possible.

Interesting.

[WiJoe]

All I see is an obviously angry Roy pointing the guy out in the crowd to his staff.
I don't see him telling anyone to "kick the guy out".

I tend to believe the UNC director of communications, and will until somebody shows some evidence that it didn't happen just as he said.

In the PC, Roy said something to the effect that people shouldn't yell out negative things about players "on our tickets". Which seems to support the idea that Roy thought the guy was heckling players from the players family ticket section or something similar, which I have read elsewhere.

That the guy was heckling from a special section, courtesey of tickets that Roy probably thought he provided, seems to be what set Roy off here, not that he was an every game heckler Roy decided to pick on like some want to make the case out to be.

But I don't know any details, it all seems like a manufactured controversy to me.

Drunk guy gets kicked out of sporting event, big deal.

How old is roy?

Guess his hearing is pretty good.

He should start acting his age.

he is a major F R A U D !

[jipops]

All I see is an obviously angry Roy pointing the guy out in the crowd to his staff.
I don't see him telling anyone to "kick the guy out".

I tend to believe the UNC director of communications, and will until somebody shows some evidence that it didn't happen just as he said.

In the PC, Roy said something to the effect that people shouldn't yell out negative things about players "on our tickets". Which seems to support the idea that Roy thought the guy was heckling players from the players family ticket section or something similar, which I have read elsewhere.

That the guy was heckling from a special section, courtesey of tickets that Roy probably thought he provided, seems to be what set Roy off here, not that he was an every game heckler Roy decided to pick on like some want to make the case out to be.


Drunk guy gets kicked out of sporting event, big deal.

Yet other Tarheel witness accounts do not support the notion of the guy being intoxicated. No matter the ticket situation, it is odd that Roy made so much noise about this. If Roy doesn't want to hear anything remotely negative towards his players during a home game, maybe he should have them turn up the fake crowd noise?

I've seen Maryland fans sitting right next to K's family at a game in Cameron. No tiff from K in this situation.

I'm not on this bandwagon that Roy has horns coming out of his head but the guy obviously has issues with his sensitivity. This is just another example of it. And again I just can't help but imagine how dictatorial this would be viewed if it had gone down in Cameron.

But I don't know any details, it all seems like a manufactured controversy to me.

You mean like the temper tantrum concerning injury reports?

[airowe]

The biggest question is, why would Roy care? All accounts from press row and even surrounding Tarheel fans apparently is that this was the only taunt heard the entire game and let's face it - it was very much G-rated. Roy's boys were up by 40, why would he make something so meaningless - "bigger than it is"?

Weiderer puts it best asking "What if K had done this? What would the reaction be?". We all know it would be a much much bigger deal. But since it's folksy Roy in a meaningless game, it's only small local news.

There is heckling at every single Duke game to some degree. By and large the rest of the fans/students either don't acknowledge it or have some fun with it. I actually know for a fact there is atleast one "fan" who has access to tickets via a legacy and attends every Duke home game just to root and heckle against them. If K acted like Roy every single home game would suffer multiple delays. Heck, if K was as hypersensitive as Roy he would have left Duke a long, long time ago.

You know what's funny, this is actually now big news. MSNBC, Deadspin, ESPN, Rivals, etc, etc. This is why I put this story in the UNC Hate Coming On thread, because I had a feeling (wink @ Greg_Newton) that this would blow up...

[Wheat/"/"/"]

...by the home team coach, while making a scene and screaming "You need to shut up, yea I'm talking to you"

If someone comes into his house, (Dean Dome), as an invited guest, (which Roy seemed to think he was), and then proceeds to become an unbearable, obnoxious, drunken, slug (accounts suggest there were more taunts than just that one instance), why are we surprised when the homeowner finally has enough and gets testy resulting in guest departure as the outcome?

Coaches have tempers too...and that sentence took longer to write than this "story" deserves

[Duvall]

If someone comes into his house, (Dean Dome), as an invited guest, (which Roy seemed to think he was), and then proceeds to become an unbearable, obnoxious, drunken, slug (accounts suggest there were more taunts than just that one instance)...

Unconfirmed anonymous accounts?

Another successful Roy Williams smear job.

[jipops]

You know what's funny, this is actually now big news. MSNBC, Deadspin, ESPN, Rivals, etc, etc. This is why I put this story in the UNC Hate Coming On thread, because I had a feeling (wink @ Greg_Newton) that this would blow up...

Wow, impressive. I guess there isn't much else to cover with the holidays coming up. I wonder how much the local talk radio will devote to it.

Even still, I'm betting none of the seemingly 8 bazillion tarheel fans I work with will have any knowledge of it on Monday.

[Mike Corey]

If someone comes into his house, (Dean Dome), as an invited guest, (which Roy seemed to think he was), and then proceeds to become an unbearable, obnoxious, drunken, slug (accounts suggest there were more taunts than just that one instance), why are we surprised when the homeowner finally has enough and gets testy resulting in guest departure as the outcome?

Coaches have tempers too...and that sentence took longer to write than this "story" deserves

Roy Will only called for him to be removed--or, to be (extremely) generous, assessed--by security when he yelled, "Don't miss!" More importantly, afterward, Roy affirmed his stance that UNC's players shouldn't have to hear any negativity, no matter how innocuous (apparently) while in the Dean Dome.

Will Roy-Will now champion such consideration when his team's fans enter opposing arenas?

Aw shucks, I'm not holding my breath.

[jipops]

If someone comes into his house, (Dean Dome), as an invited guest, (which Roy seemed to think he was), and then proceeds to become an unbearable, obnoxious, drunken, slug (accounts suggest there were more taunts than just that one instance), why are we surprised when the homeowner finally has enough and gets testy resulting in guest departure as the outcome?

Coaches have tempers too...and that sentence took longer to write than this "story" deserves

What were his other unbearable, obnoxious taunts?

"Your Sprite is flat!"
"Only 12 shopping days left until Christmas!"
"Where do the students sit?"
"Why didn't you recruit ME?"
"Would you like some distraction from the Tiger Woods fiasco?"

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Your facts are wrong - therefore they are not facts. But then, you were not there, you were fishing, so what do you know?

I'm the first to admit I don't know squat other than what I read about this.

Which facts do I have wrong, and can you provide some facts I am not aware of?

[Wheat/"/"/"]

What were his other unbearable, obnoxious taunts?

"Your Sprite is flat!"
"Only 12 shopping days left until Christmas!"
"Where do the students sit?"
"Why didn't you recruit ME?"
"Would you like some distraction from the Tiger Woods fiasco?"

You guys seem to be missing the point of the controversy.

It doesn't appear to be that there were taunts, of any nature, that were the issue.

What set Roy off was that he thought the taunts were coming from a seat and a ticket that he had provided.

He didn't like that.

That's how I see it.

[Mike Corey]

You guys seem to be missing the point of the controversy.

It doesn't appear to be that there were taunts, of any nature, that were the issue.

What set Roy off was that he thought the taunts were coming from a seat and a ticket that he had provided.

He didn't like that.

That's how I see it.

Roy Williams said this after the game:

"I don't think anybody should be yelling anything negative at our players period. Let's don't make it a bigger thing than it is. I just don't think anybody should say yell negative things toward our players who come in on our tickets to watch our game. If it were a playground I'd have a few ideas. But I'm from the mountains.

I respect your right to have an opinion, but am wondering how you could deduce from the above quote that Roy-Will was set off by the geographical location of the fan rather than the content of that fan's innocuous speech. Indeed, Roy-Will would appear to make it quite clear as to why he was voicing an objection: He doesn't "think anybody should be yelling anything negative at" his players. Period.

[Acymetric]

You guys seem to be missing the point of the controversy.

It doesn't appear to be that there were taunts, of any nature, that were the issue.

What set Roy off was that he thought the taunts were coming from a seat and a ticket that he had provided.

He didn't like that.

That's how I see it.

I'm not sure thats the reason Roy kicked the guy out, but even if it was, do you really think its appropriate for the head coach to interrupt the game for something that trivial?

[Duvall]

You guys seem to be missing the point of the controversy.

It doesn't appear to be that there were taunts, of any nature, that were the issue.

What set Roy off was that he thought the taunts were coming from a seat and a ticket that he had provided.

He didn't like that.

That's how I see it.

I haven't been to the SAC in a while. Do they now have a special marking for the tickets that, even after purchase, are still controlled by Roy?

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Roy Williams said this after the game:

I respect your right to have an opinion, but am wondering how you could deduce from the above quote that Roy-Will was set off by the location of the words rather than the fact that they were coming at all. Roy-Will would appear to make it quite clear as to why he was voicing an objection.

Key statement to me from afar...Roy said..."who come in on our tickets...".

He seems to be refering to people he invites to sit in that special section, which the obnoxious fan somehow found his way into.

[dougc33]

I'm the first to admit I don't know squat other than what I read about this.

Which facts do I have wrong, and can you provide some facts I am not aware of?

OK, try this on for size:

If someone comes into his house, (Dean Dome),
- The Dean Dome is NOT Roy's house...it is the taxpayers of North Carolina's house and Roy simply coaches in it
as an invited guest, (which Roy seemed to think he was),
- Invited guest of the state university, NOT of Roy's
and then proceeds to become an unbearable, obnoxious, drunken, slug (accounts suggest there were more taunts than just that one instance),
- Accounts vary as to whether the person was intoxicated
why are we surprised when the homeowner
- again, not his house, so he has NO ownership
finally has enough and gets testy resulting in guest departure as the outcome?
- Because he has NO right to violate this person's First Amendment rights

Coaches have tempers too...and that sentence took longer to write than this "story" deserves
- And coaches have egos and arrogance too...methinks Roy's was showing!

[jipops]

You guys seem to be missing the point of the controversy.

It doesn't appear to be that there were taunts, of any nature, that were the issue.

What set Roy off was that he thought the taunts were coming from a seat and a ticket that he had provided.

He didn't like that.

That's how I see it.

Are the ownership of the seats fact or speculation? Nonetheless, the point does appear to be the fact that there was atleast one very G-rated taunt which has been made into a bit of spectacle.

Let's say this was in fact Roy's seat that someone mistakenly gave up to an opposing fan or was taken by an opposing fan. The fact we know is that this fan said A non-vulgar, very simple taunt with 6:25 left in the game which had long been decided. Roy points back up and very clearly in the video tells him to "shut up, I'm talking to you". Given what we all know to be fact and what you have stated about the possible ticket situation, it still appears very odd. It is difficult to see how he couldn't possibly deserve some heat for this.

So if a Duke fan receives a ticket purchased by K for a Duke/UNC game at the Dean Dome, and that fan loses his seat to a UNC fan who likes to inform the Duke team that they suck, shouldn't Roy dismiss that UNC fan too? Does K get to? Now that we have the precedent that no negativity is allowed in the Dean Dome, especially from privileged seats, this just seems fair.

Yes, now I feel like I've spent way too much on this subject... but dad-gummit it sure is fun.

[Mike Corey]

Key statement to me from afar...Roy said..."who come in on our tickets...".

He seems to be refering to people he invites to sit in that special section, which the obnoxious fan somehow found his way into.

With all due respect, that's a very generous analysis of his phrase, one that seems to shrug off the implications of Roy's statements that bookmark this qualifier: no one should be saying anything negative at his players in the Dean Dome. If Roy holds his own fans to this same standard in venues where he and UNC fans are guests, then that's one thing. So hopefully, Roy will carry the flag on that issue.

As to characterizing the fan as "obnoxious," that seems like a baseless slam on someone who suggested as countless fans do that a player against whom his team was playing that he should miss a free throw.

Is that an expulsion-worthy offense? Or more precisely, one that merits the appellation of "obnoxious"?