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Thread: Laettner...WHY?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
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    Atlanta, GA (Buckhead)

    Laettner...WHY?

    Was talking to a stranger from New York in a sports bar last night and the topic of our beloved Christian Laettner came up. The big question: With all that talent, fire and accolades he had in college, how did he not turn out to be a star in the NBA?

    Sure, he had his moments, and was a solid player, but it just seems like he could have been a real star. Our general consenses was that he became incredibly unselfish in the league and for whatever reason, didn't seem to want to "be the man" on the teams he played for. This seems to be a complete reversal of his nature at Duke.

    There are a lot of Duke Basketball experts on this board. If you were having the same conversation, what would be some of the insights you would have?

    -EarlJam

  2. #2
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    Raleigh, NC
    Laettner played for some really bad teams, so he tended to sit out the playoffs. He had career averages of around 18 points and 9 rebounds per game, with an all-star game appearance, when he suffered a major Achilles injury. He lost a good bit of mobility and lift and never got them back.

  3. #3
    i believe he did average about 18 and 8 over his first four years, and once he got traded to atlanta things kid of went downhill from there.

    i remember him having some sort of major injury that he never really recovered from (ruptured achilles?), and i think that was responsible for much of the decline in his pro career.

    but he was good, if not very good, before injuries got the better of him.

  4. #4
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    Watching carolina Go To HELL!

    Thumbs up Christian Laettner

    Quote Originally Posted by EarlJam View Post
    Was talking to a stranger from New York in a sports bar last night and the topic of our beloved Christian Laettner came up. The big question: With all that talent, fire and accolades he had in college, how did he not turn out to be a star in the NBA?

    Sure, he had his moments, and was a solid player, but it just seems like he could have been a real star. Our general consenses was that he became incredibly unselfish in the league and for whatever reason, didn't seem to want to "be the man" on the teams he played for. This seems to be a complete reversal of his nature at Duke.

    There are a lot of Duke Basketball experts on this board. If you were having the same conversation, what would be some of the insights you would have?

    -EarlJam
    If memory serves me correctly, as a top draft choice there was a distinct lack of surrounding talent on his early teams, and his gung ho attitude just wasn't appreciated by his teammates. By the time he had become an allstar, he tore his Achilles and lost some quickness on returning, relagating him to journeyman status. When he joined MJ on the Wizzards, I thought finally his leadership would come through and would be supported by Jordan, but that didn't happen either.

    It is still fun to walk up to a Kentucky fan and whisper "Laettner" into his or her ear and watch them turn red in the face and see steam come out of their ears
    Last edited by OZZIE4DUKE; 04-27-2007 at 12:51 PM.
    Ozzie, your paradigm of optimism!

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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by thrilainvanila View Post
    once he got traded to atlanta things kid of went downhill from there.
    Not really true. Christian made his one and only All-Star game during the 1996-97 season, his first full campaign with the Hawks (and one of only about 2 1/2 seasons he spent in Atlanta). He was there during the Mutombo era, when the Hawks actually weren't that bad. He went to the playoffs with the Hawks in 1996, 1997, and 1998 (all three seasons he finished in Atlanta), and the team won first-round series in 1996 and 1997.

  6. #6
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    Orange County, NC
    I believe Laettner's shortcomings in the league are similar to other Dukies with a stellar college career but not the pro career you would have expected. Alot of it has to do with K's coaching philosophies and style. He doest groom players for the NBA, he coaches them for college. If you look at most of the former Dukies that are doing well in the pros (Deng, Brand, Maggette, Dunleavy) you will find that they are early defections with a ton of atheletic ability and talent. While Hill is the exception, most players who stayed four years almost forgot how to be selfish - a trait necessary to put up big stats in the NBA. Simultaneously, I'll bet if you ask NBA coaches who coach Duke alum which of their players understands basketball better, works harder, and is an underrated and intergral part of their team they will answer Duhon, Laettner, Battier, Ferry, etc...

  7. #7
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    Feb 2007
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    MKE
    well, EA sports thinks he was pretty damn good around 1997. if you ever get a chance to play NBA Live '98, make sure you have Christian on your team. he does not miss.

  8. #8

    sigh ... the old myth

    Hmmm, "pamtar" as in tar heel?

    the same old tripe "K doesn't prepare players for the nba" or when confronted with evidence that some of his players DO do well, we get "If you look at most of the former Dukies that are doing well in the pros (Deng, Brand, Maggette, Dunleavy) you will find that they are early defections with a ton of atheletic ability and talent."

    How about Grant Hill -- a four year Duke player who was a five-time first or second-team All-NBA player before injuries shortened his career. You mention Dunleavy -- he "only" played three years at Duke -- so if K can't count him as a success, then UNC can't count Michael Jordan or James Worthy (three year players) or Jerry Stackhouse or Rasheed Wallace (two year players).

    There's Carlos Boozer (a three-year guy) who just scored 41 on Ming in the playoffs. There's Battier, a four-year Duke guy, who's a key component (usually regarded as the third-best player) on the Hawks team that is going to beat the Jazz. There's Duhon, a four-year Duke guy, who is a key component on the Bulls.

    Every school has its share of busts (how's Joe Forte doing these days?), but the last I saw, Duke had produced more NBA players than any other school and they were earning more money than any other school's alums.

    And that's with some incredible bad luck as far as off-the-court injuries -- I have no doubt Jason Williams would be an all-star today without his motorcycle injury ... Hurley would have had a long productive career had he not been nearly killed by a drunk driver (19 games into his NBA career!).

    Laettner was never a superstar, but he was a damn fine NBA player through his first six years (an 18 and 8 player), before a ruptured achilles tendon robbed him of his athleticsm. He was still good enough stick around for another 7-8 years as a spot player.

  9. #9
    This whole thread reminds me of conversations I have sometimes with my 12 year old son. Sometimes he will refer to an NBA player as "not being very good". When he does I remind him of a few things. There are 30 teams in the NBA with 15 players each. The NBA is still the pinnacle of professional basketball. Thus it isn't a great stretch to say that these are the 450 best basketball players in the world. Yet somwhow when someone is only one of the best 450 people in the world at what they do, instead of one of the best 200 in the world, we label them a dissapointment, or as not being successful. Wierd.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by allenmurray View Post
    This whole thread reminds me of conversations I have sometimes with my 12 year old son. Sometimes he will refer to an NBA player as "not being very good". When he does I remind him of a few things. There are 30 teams in the NBA with 15 players each. The NBA is still the pinnacle of professional basketball. Thus it isn't a great stretch to say that these are the 450 best basketball players in the world. Yet somwhow when someone is only one of the best 450 people in the world at what they do, instead of one of the best 200 in the world, we label them a dissapointment, or as not being successful. Wierd.
    That's a very good point, and furthermore, I wouldn't count Laettner among the "worst" players in the NBA. He averaged something like 13 PPG, 7 RPG for a 13-season career. Not only are those respectable numbers, but that's also above-average longevity. Plenty of "can't-miss stars" haven't even sniffed 13 NBA seasons.

  11. #11
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    Washington D.C.

    Laettner is the Greatest

    But for his achilles injury, Laettner would have been under consideration for the Hall of Fame. He was that good. It's too bad his teammates and coaches during his first few years in Minnesota didn't want to win as badly as Christian - they tarnished his image and reputation around the league with their griping and selfishness.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2007

    Laettner one of the 2 or 3 greatest college players ever

    I am not counting performance as a pro, because obviously that would not be the case, but I think that aside from Bill Walton and Lou Alcinder, Laettner might be the third best college player of all time. Two others who would be considered...Bill Bradley, Jerry West, ( although neither of them ever won a championship, they were terrific college players).

    As an aside, didn't Bradley commit to Duke and then later changed to Princeton because of his father's pressure.

  13. #13

    the best of all time

    1. Bill Bradley did commit to Duke and only changed his mind in August, just before enrolling. He took the Bubas' last available scholarship ... if he'd just picked Princeton in the beginning, Bubas would have signed Fred Hetzel, who very much wanted to play at Duke. Instead, he went to Davidson and bcame a first-team consensus All-America.

    2. Laettner's very near the top on any list of the greatest college players of all time ... although you left out my No.1 choice -- David Thompson of N.C. State. I agree that you can make a good case for Alcindor (three-time Final Four MVP) and for Walton (who won two titles, but lost as a senior to Thompson). And also don't forget Bill Russell, who won his last two years at San Francisco (he had KC Jones with him as a junior, but Jones was ineligible for the NCAAs as a senior). Laettner is somewhere in that group.

    After that bunch, you get some great players who never won anything -- Pete Maravich (a lot of points on bad teams), Oscar Robertson (whose Cincinnati teams started winning titles AFTER he left), Bradley, West, Jerry Lucas (like Laettner, a much greater college player than a pro), Tom Gola and the like.

  14. #14

    Duke in NBA

    How many Duke players are playing in the playoffs???

    And of those players I would say all of them except JJ have a significant role on that playoff team.


    I'm guessing there are more Duke players playing in the playoffs right now then any other College team.

    Duke = Winners

  15. #15

    Achilles injury was huge

    I had a chance to see Laettner play basketball last summer. One of his calves is visibly smaller than the other--it's not even close. I assume this is due to the achilles injury.

  16. #16
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    Mar 2007
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    Chicago, IL
    Living in Detroit during Laettner's brief tenure there, it was brought up all the time that his Achilles injury drastically reduced his effectiveness and mobility. I also recall hearing several times that he and Grant (with the Pistons at the same time) weren't all that close-one time in particular someone asked Grant about his college "buddy", and Grant said: "Who said he was my buddy?". That wouldn't be all that unusual-not all teammates are all that close.

    Laettner was a good pro-and who knows what he would have been in the proper situation without injury.

    dukemsu

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by EarlJam View Post
    Was talking to a stranger from New York in a sports bar last night and the topic of our beloved Christian Laettner came up. The big question: With all that talent, fire and accolades he had in college, how did he not turn out to be a star in the NBA?

    Sure, he had his moments, and was a solid player, but it just seems like he could have been a real star. Our general consenses was that he became incredibly unselfish in the league and for whatever reason, didn't seem to want to "be the man" on the teams he played for. This seems to be a complete reversal of his nature at Duke.

    There are a lot of Duke Basketball experts on this board. If you were having the same conversation, what would be some of the insights you would have?

    -EarlJam
    he scored over 11,000 points in 13 seasons. i don't know too many bench-warmers who eclipse the 10,000-point mark in their careers.

  18. #18
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    Feb 2007
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    Washington, D.C.
    FYI, there was a great article in the latest issue of Towerview (which they don't seem to have put online yet) about former Dukies in the NBA and how they're proving the stereotype wrong. It also talks about how they're sort of like a fraternity. It has a funny anecdote of when Shav was a rookie with the 76ers and was playing the Clippers, and he wasn't even sure if Elton Brand knew who he was, but as he went to guard him, Elton slapped him on the butt and said, "What's up, Dukie?"

    And about the Grant--Laettner thing, I can't remember where I saw this--maybe it was the "100 Years . . ." DVD?--but Grant was talking about Laettner and about how opposing fans hated him so much, and then he chuckled and said something like, "But you know, we hated Christian too." I assume he was kidding (or at least half-kidding).

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Durham
    Laettner was used to winning everywhere he played...high school, college, Olympics, etc and then goes to the Minnesota Timberwolves. None of them seemed to relish the idea of winning as much as he did and I think it wore on him. When he got to a better situation, he did fine until the injury. All in all, a solid career tinged with frustration.

  20. #20
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    I've often wondered if Laettner's marijuana use contributed to the decline of his NBA production.
    JBDuke

    Andre Dawkins: “People ask me if I can still shoot, and I ask them if they can still breathe. That’s kind of the same thing.”

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