Kentucky thread (recruiting/scholarship crunch/Cal and ethics)

[roywhite]

It will be interesting to see how Coach Calipari finesses that pesky scholarship limit. And whether we hear much about his "promises" to Eric Bledsoe about being a starter.

[tysi1521]

You can thank Worldwide Wes for this....makes me wonder WHAT WAS BLEDSOE THINKING?

[KenTankerous]

As a Kentucky fan, I have to say I am not exactly thrilled with all of this hype around the incoming recruits. Sure, it's a bumper crop but five severed fingers is not a hand. All this talk of national championship contention before these guys have even had a team meeting, much less played a game together, seems ludicrous and completely over the top. Big Blue Nation is setting itself up for a huge let down AGAIN because we cannot reasonably manage our expectations.

And even though the issue is being completely swept under the rug here in the bluegrass, the scholarship limit and how Cal handles that, I think, speaks volumes about his ethic, or lack thereof.

Strange as it may sound coming from a UofK fan, all these recruits and the wins they might bring are not worth the damage I foresee if Cal is given free rein to play fast and loose with the rules.

I want my Cats to win, be sure, but I want to be able to gloat on DBR about the wins and if they are tainted, that takes the wind right out of my sails.

[SushiChef]

As a Kentucky fan, I have to say I am not exactly thrilled with all of this hype around the incoming recruits. Sure, it's a bumper crop but five severed fingers is not a hand. All this talk of national championship contention before these guys have even had a team meeting, much less played a game together, seems ludicrous and completely over the top. Big Blue Nation is setting itself up for a huge let down AGAIN because we cannot reasonably manage our expectations.

And even though the issue is being completely swept under the rug here in the bluegrass, the scholarship limit and how Cal handles that, I think, speaks volumes about his ethic, or lack thereof.

Strange as it may sound coming from a UofK fan, all these recruits and the wins they might bring are not worth the damage I foresee if Cal is given free rein to play fast and loose with the rules.

I want my Cats to win, be sure, but I want to be able to gloat on DBR about the wins and if they are tainted, that takes the wind right out of my sails.

Are you sure you aren't a Duke fan?

[grossbus]

going to be VERY interesting to watch the scholly dance and see how cal runs off enough to make the limit.

[BlueintheFace]

Those poor kids on UK... I can't believe I am saying this, but I really feel bad for the ones that get run out of town.

[BlueinBlo]

Coach Cal is an absolute disgrace to College Basketball. When Meeks comes back 17 kids will be on scholarship. So now kids thinking they will be playing are left out to dry so close to the beginning of the season. Having one scholarship over is fine, four makes this process look like a joke.

[JasonEvans]

As a Kentucky fan, I have to say I am not exactly thrilled with all of this hype around the incoming recruits. Sure, it's a bumper crop but five severed fingers is not a hand. All this talk of national championship contention before these guys have even had a team meeting, much less played a game together, seems ludicrous and completely over the top. Big Blue Nation is setting itself up for a huge let down AGAIN because we cannot reasonably manage our expectations.

And even though the issue is being completely swept under the rug here in the bluegrass, the scholarship limit and how Cal handles that, I think, speaks volumes about his ethic, or lack thereof.

Strange as it may sound coming from a UofK fan, all these recruits and the wins they might bring are not worth the damage I foresee if Cal is given free rein to play fast and loose with the rules.

I want my Cats to win, be sure, but I want to be able to gloat on DBR about the wins and if they are tainted, that takes the wind right out of my sails.

Ken is one of my favorite posters. An honest and forthright Kentucky fan who is not afraid to call his program out if they don't act ethically. Mad props to you sir for not just wearing the win-at-all-costs blinders.

As for Cal and the scholarship limit-- lets see how he handles it and how the kids who do not have scholarships react before we judge things. I hope a stink is made by some kids because I would like to see more attention paid to this issue by the NCAA and the media.

I think the "option" of a school to renew a scholarship is appallingly bad NCAA legislation. If a kid maintains good grades and is not formally disciplined by the team, it is reprehensible to pull a scholarship merely for not being a good enough player. If the kid was not good enough, you should not have recruited him or her.

At a bare minimum, there should be a cut-off date in April or so after which schools cannot pull scholarships. That would at least give kids time to find a new school if they get their scholly yanked. It is mid-May right now. A kid who got his scholarship yanked at Kentucky would have a hard time locating a new school at this point.

--Jason "odds that the NCAA actually deals with an issue that is bad for the kids... almost zero" Evans

[chrisheery]

for UK may prove to a serious hinderance to their future. With the way the NCAA can remove scholarships now for poor academic performance, having 4 guys that seems to have very questionable academics in the same class may become an issue. Similarly, Calapari will have to start recruiting some guys that intend to graduate or the problem will get even worse.

Man, that kid would have looked good in Duke blue. Oh well.

[SupaDave]

As a Kentucky fan, I have to say I am not exactly thrilled with all of this hype around the incoming recruits. Sure, it's a bumper crop but five severed fingers is not a hand. All this talk of national championship contention before these guys have even had a team meeting, much less played a game together, seems ludicrous and completely over the top. Big Blue Nation is setting itself up for a huge let down AGAIN because we cannot reasonably manage our expectations.

And even though the issue is being completely swept under the rug here in the bluegrass, the scholarship limit and how Cal handles that, I think, speaks volumes about his ethic, or lack thereof.

Strange as it may sound coming from a UofK fan, all these recruits and the wins they might bring are not worth the damage I foresee if Cal is given free rein to play fast and loose with the rules.

I want my Cats to win, be sure, but I want to be able to gloat on DBR about the wins and if they are tainted, that takes the wind right out of my sails.

Excellent post but now a few things are certain and it's almost enough to close this thread a begin a new one called - "The new UK" b/c now they are MUST see TV and here's what you got...

-The Louisville-UK game just got as much hype as Duke-UNC
-The NCAA will be watching like a hawk
-A whole lot of adjustment from players, fans, and coaches alike
-What does Meeks do now?
-What if they play like Tubby's last few teams or worse - Gillespie's?
-and who knows what other sub-plots...

[BlueintheFace]

I'm normally NEVER upset about recruiting misses, but how the hell does Cal get BOTH Bledsoe and Wall. I'm not upset about losing one or the other. I'm actually not upset about losing both. I am, however, pretty upset that one Coach beat out K for... not one, but TWO top tier recruits... at the same position.

I certainly am not going to say that Coach K has lost his touch as some tend to do when overreacting to a recruiting miss. I will, however, say this...

1) K made it clear that we had no true PG
2) K made it clear that he was really going to try to remedy this
3) K recruited, not one, but two PG's
4) Both of those PG's joined a team that didn't make the NCAA tournament last year, doesn't have enough scholarships for all of the players already on the team, and has a new coach... while Duke is sitting here with ZERO PG's, guaranteed playing time, and a lot of pieces in place.

I mean come on, that stinks.

K must be getting really really tired of losing these recruits that come down to one or two top tier schools late. I hope he wins the next battle, because that win column is looking pretty static of late. You can do it K! Do what you do best... reevaluate, make adjustments, approach the problem in a new way. Go Get 'em.

[JasonEvans]

I know of very little evidence that Duke ever got all that involved with Beldsoe and I don't think K ever offered a scholarship. The grades and scores just never go to the point where Duke was a viable option for him, I think.

-Jason

[Kfanarmy]

With the way the NCAA can remove scholarships now for poor academic performance, having 4 guys that seems to have very questionable academics in the same class may become an issue. Similarly, Calapari will have to start recruiting some guys that intend to graduate or the problem will get even worse.

I don't think Calipari worries about grades much. His kids have seemed to get high enough grades to play no matter what their intellectual capabilities have been. Seems to always be a class for an athletically minded student to pass...at most universities

[JasonEvans]

Lets move the discussion of all things Kentucky to this thread instead of continuing to populate the John Wall thread.

Thanks...

--Jason "mod much?" Evans

[BlueintheFace]

I know of very little evidence that Duke ever got all that involved with Beldsoe and I don't think K ever offered a scholarship. The grades and scores just never go to the point where Duke was a viable option for him, I think.

-Jason

Duke had assistants speak with him/ watch him play on a number of occasions. Nate James ( I believe it was him) was quoted as telling Bledsoe to be more assertive offensively.

We do not know about the scores. Do you know about the scores?

[Exiled_Devil]

Excellent post but now a few things are certain and it's almost enough to close this thread a begin a new one called - "The new UK" b/c now they are MUST see TV and here's what you got...

-The Louisville-UK game just got as much hype as Duke-UNC

Some people argue that it is already better than Duke-UNC. They are full of it, and one thing will keep it from being true - not being a conference rival, and not having the game being meaningful in the final week of the year.

Sorry - just read that you wrote 'hype'. I'll buy that. It won't be as good, but it could get hyped up to the max. Of course, Pitino could go to Sacramento and that would throw a wrench in things.

[Matches]

Obviously I agree that it's reprehensible for schollys to be non-renewed for any reasons other than poor grades or misconduct detrimental to the team/ university - but I'm not really sure a rules change would help. You can see even from my language above that "misconduct" and "detrimental" are weasel words - an enterprising but unethical coach could still find some reason to boot the player, AND in that circumstance the coach would be likely to smear the player publicly to justify the decision.

Putting a deadline on non-renewal also causes a problem, because what if the player is caught with a kilo of coke on June 15th? The school ought to be able to take action in that case.

I don't know what the solution may be. What Cal is doing may technically be legal but violates just about every possible spirit of the rules - and he undoubtedly knows it and will do it anyway until someone makes him stop. It makes the college game look even more mercenary - unfortunate when it comes at the expense of kids.

[moonpie23]

how about how one-sided it is? why, should a school get to make a change in the athlete's scholarship and the student is punished (sit out a year) if THEY want to make a change..

what if you just hate the school, hate the coach's guts and want to play somewhere else?

the school can drop them, why can't they drop the school?

[jma4life]

Make no mistake, at the very least, this will be used in negative recruiting against UK. Maybe it won't stop the John Wall's from going, but if I'm a midlevel recruit, I'm thinking twice about playing for Cal.


I wonder why we haven't heard of this at all from the mainstream media, other than an article or two, here or there. Maybe people just don't care that much about UK, maybe people just assume Cal is dirty, maybe people don't find this nearly as reprehensible as I do, but I have to assume that if Coach K pulled this, it'd be a media firestorm. Same for Roy Williams too.

[grossbus]

"if I'm a midlevel recruit, I'm thinking twice about playing for Cal. "

if you're a midlevel recruit, cal is not interested in you. remember his words at his UK presser, "if you can't play, i can't hide you."

if a kid has his scholarship revoked for reasons other than academics or conduct, can he transfer without the year "penalty?"