MBB: UNC 101 - Duke 87 Post-Game Thread

[JBDuke]

Discuss, if you will.

[91devil]

Well, a disappointing second half...but let's give some credit to UNC. The way they played in the second half...they don't lose to anyone.

We didn't shoot well in the second half, which we needed to do for the full game, but this is a game that UNC won, not that Duke lost.

[Huh?]

Duke, tell us what happened?

[edensquad]

More troubling to me than this loss (and, boy, do I hate all things UNC), is the fact that Duke has lost 4 of the last 6 Halves (vs. Clemson, Miami & UNC) by double digits. Maybe, as John Feinstein wrote... Duke just isn't all that good. Certainly tonight, UNC's relentlessly efficient offense trumped Duke's vaunted defense... and the Devils are so streaky on offense... hot & cold... *** sigh ***

[77devil]

More talent for the baby blues pure and simple as much as it pains me to write it. No player who can handle Lawson. Let's not over analyze this one.

[HDB]

Carolina would be such a different team without Lawson. Damn, I wish he'd gone pro.

[Ben63]

We gave it a run but just didn't have enough in the end. Carolina is clearly a National Title contender and while it sucks to lose to them, I don't think anyone can argue that they aren't a better team than Duke. Lawson is unstoppable, there is no one in the country who can guard him one v one.

The difference between this years loss and last years win at the Dean Dump is simple. We made our threes the whole game and Lawson didn't play.

Great game UNC, but ruining Tyler's senior night just like he did to JJ would be some pretty sweet revenge.

[RelativeWays]

Carolina would be such a different team without Lawson. Damn, I wish he'd gone pro.

Next season you get your wish, along with two, possibly 3 other players as an added bonus.

[ice-9]

At the beginning of the season, I thought Duke was an Elite Eight team. As we piled up wins in dominating fashion -- with incredibly efficient offense and defense -- I thought we were a Final Four team. Now, I can see how we could lose a Sweet Sixteen match-up. It's not just because we lost to UNC or Clemson...but it's the realization that we rely so much on the jumpshot

Relative to other top teams, we do not have a consistent, high percentage way of generating offense. Some ways of getting a consistent offense: fast breaks, forcing turnovers (e.g. via press), dominant post player, or a player who can penetrate at will. We don't really have any of those. Our pressure D is great against teams with poor guards, but in the NCAA tournament we'll see teams with good guards. We don't have a dominant post player. Henderson and Smith have the ability to penetrate, but they hardly do. Bottom line, when our jumpshot is not falling, we struggle. I understand that if you can maintain a top tier defense, you can minimize the ups and downs of the jumpshot; but in the lose-and-you're-done nature of the NCAA tournament, where we will be playing against other good teams, our defense may not carry us far enough when we shoot horribly.

If you think about why UNC is a consensus preseason #1 and still considered by most with the best chance to win the whole thing, they have a lot of those factors: they use the fast break often; they have a dominant post player in Hansbrough (Thompson and Davis are also quite good); and they have a guard that can penetrate at will in Lawson. On top of those things they have several capable shooters. It's no wonder their offense is one of the best in the nation...their defense just has to be adequate for them to win games, and it's not hard to make that extra effort to step up your defense in big games.

If our jumpshots are falling, we can beat any team in the nation. And while I expect us to get at least to the Sweet Sixteen, every game after is going to be a jumpshot coin toss.

[godukerocks]

Just ONE guy, please, give us an "inside presence".

[Cell-R]

I still love Duke. Goodnight.

[Sir Stealth]

I for one would like to not hear the usual "we lost because we rely on jump shots" thing for this one. North Carolina scored over 100 points. We missed some jumpers at bad times, but that's part of basketball. We still got 87. Ty Lawson is really good, Carolina is really good, but we can do better against them than giving up 57 points in the second half. That is not a goal that is too high for our talent or the expectations that this team has on defense. For whatever reason, the team did not bring it at a necessary level on the defensive end in the second half. We had a bad scoring drought, yes, but good defense weathers those. It hurts to lose to UNC but I think that the team is capable of more. Hopefully there will be highs to help forget these lows.

[JDev]

Looking at it from the Duke end (which is how I normally view things), Duke shot poorly in the second half, and gave up a ridiculous amount of lay-ups. That is all very clear. Tough to win with that going on. Duke definitely played hard. They just needed to shoot a lot better if they were going to give up so many lay-ups. Duke's biggest problem today was defense. 101 points is too many (said Captain Obvious).

[mapei]

Yes, if our jumpshots are falling, we can keep pace with anyone. But our percentage on jumpshots for the year isn't that good. So that doesn't mean that much that often against elite teams.

I totally agree that the turning point emotionally was the Singler elbow. Stupid move on his part. It wasn't all *that* flagrant, but the call was correct.

Lots of unforced turnovers as we tried to play on the edge to keep up. And Lawson was phenomenal, JWill-esque out there. UNC deserved it, no question.

[geraldsneighbor]

15 turnovers and Lawson playing as he did in the second half is tough. Our offense lost its flow in the second half. It is going to be ok. Duke is still improving. A win in February can only go so far. Time to not make anymore of this then it is. Its one game, BC sunday and its all different next week. Keep in mind we have had to play alot of really tough games in a short stretch. Hopefully we can rack up some wins here late in the season.

[bjornolf]

I thought a big factor in the last five minutes of the game was the floor itself. It seemed like EVERYBODY was slipping and falling for a while there, but when we did it, it turned out bad (open shots for them, turnover for us, etc.), while when they did it, something good seemed to happen for them (managed a pass to an open person, hit the shot, refs blow the whistle and stop play to prevent a runout, etc.). It was just one of those situations where all the bounces went to them in that short span. I'm not calling a conspiracy, or saying we win the game if not for the floor, but I think we'd be talking about a 5-8 point game going into the last minute instead of 12-14. And that's a HUGE difference. We might have had a shot in that situation. Ah, well, that's the way the cookie crumbles sometimes. I guess I'm just saying I could stomach an 5 point loss better than a 14 point one. I thought the game was a lot closer than that before everybody started slipping and sliding, and by that, I'm not talking about the score so much as the quality of play of both teams.

And I thought the elbow was unintentional. His hand had slipped off the ball twice already, and the third time, he was pulling harder, so it just came off harder and went farther. There was no bunching of the bicep muscle or acceleration through the blow like the one Paulus got against Miami. He was just pulling at the ball. It was stupid, as the whistle had already blown and he should have stopped, but it wasn't an intentional blow, IMHO.

The shots that were falling in the first half weren't in the second, and we weren't getting any offensive rebounds. It's as simple as that. I was encouraged by how much heart and fight the guys showed though. I think that will help us in the weeks to come. There was no give like against Clemson.

[jimmymax]

At the beginning of the season, I thought Duke was an Elite Eight team. As we piled up wins in dominating fashion -- with incredibly efficient offense and defense -- I thought we were a Final Four team. Now, I can see how we could lose a Sweet Sixteen match-up. It's not just because we lost to UNC or Clemson...but it's the realization that we rely so much on the jumpshot

Relative to other top teams, we do not have a consistent, high percentage way of generating offense. Some ways of getting a consistent offense: fast breaks, forcing turnovers (e.g. via press), dominant post player, or a player who can penetrate at will. We don't really have any of those. Our pressure D is great against teams with poor guards, but in the NCAA tournament we'll see teams with good guards. We don't have a dominant post player. Henderson and Smith have the ability to penetrate, but they hardly do. Bottom line, when our jumpshot is not falling, we struggle. I understand that if you can maintain a top tier defense, you can minimize the ups and downs of the jumpshot; but in the lose-and-you're-done nature of the NCAA tournament, where we will be playing against other good teams, our defense may not carry us far enough when we shoot horribly.

If you think about why UNC is a consensus preseason #1 and still considered by most with the best chance to win the whole thing, they have a lot of those factors: they use the fast break often; they have a dominant post player in Hansbrough (Thompson and Davis are also quite good); and they have a guard that can penetrate at will in Lawson. On top of those things they have several capable shooters. It's no wonder their offense is one of the best in the nation...their defense just has to be adequate for them to win games, and it's not hard to make that extra effort to step up your defense in big games.

If our jumpshots are falling, we can beat any team in the nation. And while I expect us to get at least to the Sweet Sixteen, every game after is going to be a jumpshot coin toss.

Bingo. Eerily familiar, like Groundhog Day.

[BlueintheFace]

Lawson blew by Paulus and almost faked Nolan out of his shoes a few times. Nobody was stopping him tonight.

For me, the game pretty much came down to a 4 minute stretch in the second half where everything seemed to go wrong. we missed like 5 open threes in a row, loose balls seemed to always go off of us out of bounds or land right in a tarheel lap, and some unfortunate calls were made. A 4 point game turned in to a huge deficit in that time period, and there was no coming back from it.

We just got beat by the frontrunner for the title... and I believe we can beat them with a little luck. I don't feel too bad.

ALSO: I hate to second guess K, but I would have liked to see Z in there a lot more. They were getting layup after layup (especially lawson) and a big man inside would at least make them think twice. This is rare for me, because I almost never second guess K on who did or didn't play, but I think that might have been a mistake on his part.

[bjornolf]

Someone said to stop harping on the reliance on jumpshooting thing. Well, let's look at foul shooting. Duke went 11-18 (62%), UNC went 27-31 (88%). We lost by 14. We lost the free throw battle by 16. There's your difference right there.

These are battles in years past we won every game, even when we weren't world beaters. We've GOT to get more aggressive on our drives and get to the line more.

[Oriole Way]

I want to see if Coach K can revamp this offense. He hasn't really done much at all since the Wake Forest game except for starting Paulus. We still take too many jumpshots and turn the ball over too much.

Paulus has made great strides towards returning to the accurate shooter he was last year, and he really put his imprint on the game in the first half. He was on fire shooting, and active on the court, making a couple of steals and leading the team. But I doubt this team can improve if he is our starting point guard because of his defensive issues. Nolan looked great in the first half as well, but inconsistency will probably continue to plague him. It's a difficult problem to solve, and we simply might not have the right players to make it work. It's very frustrating, because a staple of great Duke teams has been great point guard play, and we have lacked that for several years now.

It's becoming a broken record watching this team struggle like clockwork in February for 3 straight years. There's still plenty of season left, and so much talent to work with. But K needs to make actual adjustments offensively if we want to start improving and make a run in the tournament.