wilbon disses wally wade

[grossbus]

on PTI just now, wilbon called kenan the most beautiful place to watch college football in america and then called wallace wade a "dump" and a high school dump at that.

i recall a lot of talk about renovations. but have not heard much more than talk.

have not been there since 65. how bad is it?

[Oriole Way]

What was the context of the discussion? Why did he bring up Wallace Wade?

[juise]

What was the context of the discussion? Why did he bring up Wallace Wade?

I have to assume that any national conversation about Kenan/Wade would be related to the parachute mishap on Saturday.

[Oriole Way]

I have to assume that any national conversation about Kenan/Wade would be related to the parachute mishap on Saturday.

Ah yes, stupid me for not figuring that out.

[grossbus]

"I have to assume that any national conversation about Kenan/Wade would be related to the parachute mishap on Saturday."

correct, wilbon's point was how could someone mistake one for the other.

[Ignatius07]

on PTI just now, wilbon called kenan the most beautiful place to watch college football in america and then called wallace wade a "dump" and a high school dump at that.

i recall a lot of talk about renovations. but have not heard much more than talk.

have not been there since 65. how bad is it?

I don't really mind this because Wilbon is certainly not a stereotypical Duke hater. Neither is Kornheiser for that matter. Actually, considering all the hatred for Duke in the DC area, the biggest sports journalists have always been neutral-to-slightly-positive about Duke.

[Edouble]

I don't really mind this because Wilbon is certainly not a stereotypical Duke hater. Neither is Kornheiser for that matter. Actually, considering all the hatred for Duke in the DC area, the biggest sports journalists have always been neutral-to-slightly-positive about Duke.

I agree. Both have shown respect for Duke and Coach K in the past.

As far as the DC media, I agree there too. The Post really loved Duke for years in the 80s/90s. They're not as enamored anymore, but they're nothing like that ... from the AJC (I know his name, I'm just not mentioning it because he stinks ).

[CameronCrazy'11]

I don't know. Wallace Wade certainly isn't a great stadium, but it's not really unpleasant. Calling it a "dump" is a bit of an overreach.

[Devilsfan]

Finally something honest about Duke from an Espn commentator. Duke is such a fine school. We should be ashamed of ourselves to have such a facility.

[Scorp4me]

I've been to quite a few Duke games at Wallace Wade so I definately feel qualified to say this. I agree that Duke needs to do some work there, the bathrooms are quite frankly ridiculous. How they have let this go for so long is beyond me. And they could certainly do some work, but I hate the train of thought that new is always better. Thank goodness we have K to look over Cameron, but there is nothing wrong with Wallace Wade that can't be fixed.

So if you're saying it needs some work I agree completely. But if you're saying we need a new facility completely I'd have to disagree.

[arnie]

I've been to quite a few Duke games at Wallace Wade so I definately feel qualified to say this. I agree that Duke needs to do some work there, the bathrooms are quite frankly ridiculous. How they have let this go for so long is beyond me. And they could certainly do some work, but I hate the train of thought that new is always better. Thank goodness we have K to look over Cameron, but there is nothing wrong with Wallace Wade that can't be fixed.

So if you're saying it needs some work I agree completely. But if you're saying we need a new facility completely I'd have to disagree.

How Duke could let the bathrooms could go for so long is a great question for our previous AD of 10+ years. And of course, the admin at Duke couldn't figure out how to renovate without screwing it up - so nothing has happened except for yellow tape across the cess pool in the woods behind the far end section (30?).

Anyway, I think our new AD is on the right track and the above post is right on. Simple things (at least to most admins) including a new concession system and stands will make a huge difference. However, I was amused that the stand nearest the taped off cess pool was out of bottled water in the third quarter last Saturday - seems they would have plenty of a high profit item that doesn't require any prep. Go figure.

[grossbus]

what is the cess pool? is it sewage, runoff from the stadium?

sounds bad.

[Acymetric]

what is the cess pool? is it sewage, runoff from the stadium?

sounds bad.

I'm pretty sure he's referring to the set of restrooms that were in the worst condition, sort of off behind the home side past the end of the shoe.

[formerdukeathlete]

I've been to quite a few Duke games at Wallace Wade so I definately feel qualified to say this. I agree that Duke needs to do some work there, the bathrooms are quite frankly ridiculous. How they have let this go for so long is beyond me. And they could certainly do some work, but I hate the train of thought that new is always better. Thank goodness we have K to look over Cameron, but there is nothing wrong with Wallace Wade that can't be fixed.

So if you're saying it needs some work I agree completely. But if you're saying we need a new facility completely I'd have to disagree.

What can be done with Wade is precisely what Kevin White is studying. Focus on bathrooms and concessions is simply superficial - much more determines whether a stadium is a good venue for Football. Among the more important factors:

pitch of the stands and sightlines;

proximity of seats to the playing field;

raw seating capacity;

premium seating.

Wade's stands are pitched relatively softly, which is less than ideal. This means that as seats go up, seats move away further from the action than say at a Wake Forest, Clemson.

The running track compounds the effect of softly pitched seats.

Wade is one of the quietest stadiums, if not the quietest, in 1-A because of the soft pitch, separation of fans by the running track and open end.

Raw seating capacity is too small at Wade, unless we plan on struggling in Football. As recently as 1994 we drew 40k for a home game (even though official attendance was 37k) with many standing along the concourse. When RDU had no people and 4 big 4 football teams we drew 50k for home games. 50 k is about what you need to be able to offer guarantees without losing your shirt on home games.

Premium seating could be addressed by the proposed new President's Box / Iron Dukes Building.

The question for the architects, is it cheaper to build new, or can Wade be renovated to be a sufficiently good d-1 stadium?

My guess is that it probably can be renovated in this fashion and capacity eventually brought up to about 50k (tops) with removing he running track and doing something with the open end at some point.

I trust our new AD is focusing on the raw capabilities of the structure, rather than accepting a bandaid approach such as the RATIO proposal.

[CathyCA]

I've been to quite a few Duke games at Wallace Wade so I definately feel qualified to say this. I agree that Duke needs to do some work there, the bathrooms are quite frankly ridiculous. How they have let this go for so long is beyond me. And they could certainly do some work, but I hate the train of thought that new is always better. Thank goodness we have K to look over Cameron, but there is nothing wrong with Wallace Wade that can't be fixed.

So if you're saying it needs some work I agree completely. But if you're saying we need a new facility completely I'd have to disagree.

Regarding the bathrooms: I went to the portable bathrooms prior to the game, before the rain. Although the facilities were quite cramped, it was heavily air-conditioned, and that part was nice. Not so nice was that the flushing mechanism (a pedal to the right of the base of the toilet) wasn't marked, and some of the women had a hard time figuring that out because some of the toilets hadn't been flushed when I got there. Another woman and I went through the stalls and flushed the toilets for those women before us who couldn't quite figure it out.

At halftime, I went to another of the port-a-potties. This one was marked for women, and it was air-conditioned, but it only had 2 stalls with doors and the rest were urinals. It was as cramped as the first tinkle trailer I visited.

These potties weren't as nice as the ones they bring out by the soccer fields for the Big Dance at the Duke reunions.

[Atldukie79]

I love Wallace Wade Stadium. There...I have said it. And there is my personal torment. I am a traditionalist in many things, and the CIS and WW are two of my favorites. Yet I recognize the need to move forward with WW, but not move on.

I think WW is a pretty venue...the curves of the stadium are quite pleasing and the sight of trees (albeit fewer all the time) nice too. The natural bowl and proximity to campus (you can still see the chapel) are irreplacable at any other location. It ain't moving any where else folks!

Yet I am reminded that this very stadium was once the fresh and new thing that helped contribute to attracting a different coach with ties to Alabama.
(If you think attracting Cutcliff was a coup, consider the success and profile Wallace Wade had when he left Alabama for Duke). SO clearly DUke has played the enhanced facilities game in the past (nearly 80 years ago!)

I think we need a plan to keep WW and modernize the stadium in 3 steps.

1) Fix the modernization problems: Scoreboards, bathrooms, concessions. This is a no brainer. I know this is planned.
2) Prepare to extend seating with temporary bleachers. I think with a more competitive team and continued marketing, we can cycle into 50k crowds without dropping the playing field and adding luxury suites. Temporary bleachers used to be a permanent feature around the top of the stadium. And they also fit nicely in the open end of the stadium.
3) Then, and only then, when the demand is there, drop the field and extend seating down. Also add luxury boxes...why not.


I think I can swallow my traditionalist tendancies and support such a plan.

[Classof06]

For a college stadium, Wallace Wade is not that nice, guys. As an alum, it's where I had my graduation ceremony and I actually like the stadium. But for a BCS conference football program, it's at or near the bottom of the list. There's no way around it.

What does it hold, like 35,000 people? Granted, Duke only has 6,600 undergrads but if we want to take the program to that next level, the stadium has to hold more.

That being said, I am looking forward to the renovations. As Duke's program returns to respectability, the Stadium should as well.

[killerleft]

I love Wallace Wade Stadium. There...I have said it. And there is my personal torment. I am a traditionalist in many things, and the CIS and WW are two of my favorites. Yet I recognize the need to move forward with WW, but not move on.

I think WW is a pretty venue...the curves of the stadium are quite pleasing and the sight of trees (albeit fewer all the time) nice too. The natural bowl and proximity to campus (you can still see the chapel) are irreplacable at any other location. It ain't moving any where else folks!

Yet I am reminded that this very stadium was once the fresh and new thing that helped contribute to attracting a different coach with ties to Alabama.
(If you think attracting Cutcliff was a coup, consider the success and profile Wallace Wade had when he left Alabama for Duke). SO clearly DUke has played the enhanced facilities game in the past (nearly 80 years ago!)

I think we need a plan to keep WW and modernize the stadium in 3 steps.

1) Fix the modernization problems: Scoreboards, bathrooms, concessions. This is a no brainer. I know this is planned.
2) Prepare to extend seating with temporary bleachers. I think with a more competitive team and continued marketing, we can cycle into 50k crowds without dropping the playing field and adding luxury suites. Temporary bleachers used to be a permanent feature around the top of the stadium. And they also fit nicely in the open end of the stadium.
3) Then, and only then, when the demand is there, drop the field and extend seating down. Also add luxury boxes...why not.


I think I can swallow my traditionalist tendancies and support such a plan.

I can agree with that 100%. The restrooms look like something from a county fair from yesteryear. The concessions not only need to be upgraded, a line-control feature needs to be implemented to keep the customers from clogging up the concourse.

Once that is done, Wade is just concrete and seats like any other stadium, but with a charm and historical significance that can't be replaced. I sure hope the powers that be don't lose that during renovations. Although our winning heritage may be ancient to most of us, the work should be done with as much care as was shown during the Cameron renovations.

[Jarhead]

I am surprised that there has been no mention of lowering the field. That, I believe, will be necessary, eventually. It is the only way to expand and/or improve seating comfort. New/improved bathroom facilities would be part of that. All that other stuff is fluff. Making us more comfortable, and preparing for increased attendance at football games should be top priority. The only concession I would make to fluff is... uh, the concessions. They need improvement, and are related to the comfort factor. Closing the open end of Wade is for the future, if needed. Save it for later.

Why in heaven do we need an Iron Duke building, or luxury seating. Building a needed building and naming it with the Iron Duke label is okay, though, but luxury boxes? The only luxury seats I go for are seats of the same type as in Cameron, upstairs. If a building an Iron Duke building turns out to be needed, maybe building it in the open end, and attaching some seats to it would do. If we really need to build a new stadium, and I doubt that, then we should do it. Forget Wade and get on with it. If we are realistic, that won't be necessary. Oh, yeah, whatever is done, it has to be done between seasons, and in stages. There should be no interference during the seasons, or with spring and pre-season practice.

[Jarhead]

I second your motion. That pretty much implements the kind of staged renovations I have been thinking about. I am not much in favor of luxury boxes, though. The people in them seem to rarely watch the game.