NBA Playoffs

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Originally Posted by superdave

Howard may be the best athlete in the NBA. His skills are becoming more polished. The thing that would really concern me though if I were a Magic fan is his demeanor on the court. He has led the league in technicals over the past few years and always seems to be I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.ing at the refs and smiling like he knows the tv cameras are on him. He comes across to me as really immature and not very focused. He rarely sets out to destroy an opponent or to play like a possessed animal for 40 minutes. He coasts at times and makes dumb mistakes for a guy who came into the league in 2004.

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I don't watch a lot of NBA games, so please correct me if I'm wrong. In the games that I have seen Dwight play, he gets manhandled down low. And, I don't mean that the other guys are stronger or more tough than he is...I mean it's almost like the "Jordan Rules" when it comes to Dwight. They are extremely physical with him and I believe he gets very frustrated with the lack of non-calls. Does that justify his reaction? No, definitely not, but I'm not sure I could keep my cool night in and night out.

Watching the highlights from last night, I am amazed at his improvement with his offensive skill set. He could not make or finish some of those moves years ago.

If Dwight wants to be fouled less, he should try shooting over 60% from the line one of these years. They can't call everything, and the rest of his game is just so good.

Rondo getting 30 reminded me of Nash destroying the Mavs back in 2005 when they played him to pass. He had 48 in one game, then 39 in another to eliminate them. Rondo was taking what the Knicks were giving him by backing off his shot. Instead of just passing out of that, he was taking it right at them. I'm a Knicks fan, but I had to admit it was pretty awesome.

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Originally Posted by Starter

If Dwight wants to be fouled less, he should try shooting over 60% from the line one of these years. They can't call everything, and the rest of his game is just so good.

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Spot on. I agree with this assessment...they can't call everything, but they if are consistent with the calls from the beginning, that would perhaps limit the foul play and Dwight's frustration. And I don't know if the man-handling is a reason for Dwight's frustration or not. I have been told I over-analyze things a lot! :D

Honestly a better reaction than whining and drawing techs would be for Howard to pop some 2nd-stringer in the mouth, take the 3 game suspension, but serve notice to the rest of the league that he's The Man. Hitting FTs would help too. But it seems pretty clear that Dwight is not focused on dominating and winning the way he should be.

Barkley, Malone and Shaq all got hacked, but they came out swinging every once in a while and you knew not to mess with them. Crude but effective.

JJ's hustle play earned Top 10 Play on SportsCenter.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPDc6gjAex4

It was indeed a great play which shifted momentum in the game. Up until then, Orlando didn't seem to be playing with any urgency. It also got the crowd going.

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Originally Posted by Starter

If Dwight wants to be fouled less, he should try shooting over 60% from the line one of these years.

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The issue isn't the number of times he gets fouled, it's the percentage of the fouls that get called. DH is like the anti-Jordan or anti-Paul_Pierce...instead of getting the benefit of the doubt that most NBA stars get, he gets hammered with no or few calls. You can't hit your free throws when you aren't at the free throw line after getting hammered.

That said, I do think that DH would be wise to go live with JJ Redick this off season and learn how to shoot FT's ;) I also think that DH needs to handle his frustration a little better. How many times has SVG been fined for brining this up?

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Originally Posted by elvis14

The issue isn't the number of times he gets fouled, it's the percentage of the fouls that get called. DH is like the anti-Jordan or anti-Paul_Pierce...instead of getting the benefit of the doubt that most NBA stars get, he gets hammered with no or few calls. You can't hit your free throws when you aren't at the free throw line after getting hammered.

That said, I do think that DH would be wise to go live with JJ Redick this off season and learn how to shoot FT's ;) I also think that DH needs to handle his frustration a little better. How many times has SVG been fined for brining this up?

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Well, Howard has led the league in FTAs 3 of the last 4 years and has shot more than 10 free throws per game each of the last 4 years. It's not like he isn't getting any calls. He gets to the line about as much as Shaq did at his peak (and more often than Jordan or Pierce).

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Originally Posted by superdave

Honestly a better reaction than whining and drawing techs would be for Howard to pop some 2nd-stringer in the mouth, take the 3 game suspension, but serve notice to the rest of the league that he's The Man. Hitting FTs would help too. But it seems pretty clear that Dwight is not focused on dominating and winning the way he should be.

Barkley, Malone and Shaq all got hacked, but they came out swinging every once in a while and you knew not to mess with them. Crude but effective.

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Exactly. How do you think Wayne Gretzky went a whole career without getting body-checked? And Dwight doesn't need a sidekick to do the dirty work for him.

Your point about taking the suspension is especially true if he's going to be suspended for taking too many T's anyway.

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Originally Posted by DukeGirl4ever

Spot on. I agree with this assessment...they can't call everything, but they if are consistent with the calls from the beginning, that would perhaps limit the foul play and Dwight's frustration. And I don't know if the man-handling is a reason for Dwight's frustration or not. I have been told I over-analyze things a lot! :D

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The interesting element to all of this is that he will be a free agent in the not too distant future. Personally I feel part of his massive jump in technicals this year is that he sees the team he is on as not being elite. Earlier in his career he was just making the jump to All-star caliber player, then onto team success (NBA Finals trip), now he sees multiple teams overtaking his team and as his skills improve his teammates get worse. Therefore leading to a superstar coming into his prime realizing that unless he gets some help a team within his own division (Miami) will own the NBA championship for a few years, hence a grumpy and frustrated Dwight.

The Thunder rolled the Nuggets tonight. I still think that they are going to make a surprise run at the NBA Finals this year. Probably next year. A couple of years away. I hope they keep on playing this well. From the action that I saw tonight I was gone most of the day. I saw Paul play. Great point guard. And a juicy rumor??? Paul to the Bobcats??

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Originally Posted by darjum

The interesting element to all of this is that he will be a free agent in the not too distant future. Personally I feel part of his massive jump in technicals this year is that he sees the team he is on as not being elite. Earlier in his career he was just making the jump to All-star caliber player, then onto team success (NBA Finals trip), now he sees multiple teams overtaking his team and as his skills improve his teammates get worse. Therefore leading to a superstar coming into his prime realizing that unless he gets some help a team within his own division (Miami) will own the NBA championship for a few years, hence a grumpy and frustrated Dwight.

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It's interesting with Howard, because it's almost like he has to be his own enforcer. Other stars have had some goon who they know would go out and put someone on the deck if they get roughed up. Howard's the only really significant player on his team, and by far the only guy resembling an enforcer. I'm not seeing him staying there, and with the rumors that he has eyes for the Lakers, it could be like Shaquille all over again.

I wonder if he'd consider the Nets, if Deron stays there. It'd be an opportunity to play with a big-time playmaker on a team moving to an interesting market with cap space. I know the Nets are, well, the Nets, but they're going to have a shiny new building in an interesting sports market.

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Originally Posted by Starter

It's interesting with Howard, because it's almost like he has to be his own enforcer. Other stars have had some goon who they know would go out and put someone on the deck if they get roughed up. Howard's the only really significant player on his team, and by far the only guy resembling an enforcer. I'm not seeing him staying there, and with the rumors that he has eyes for the Lakers, it could be like Shaquille all over again.

I wonder if he'd consider the Nets, if Deron stays there. It'd be an opportunity to play with a big-time playmaker on a team moving to an interesting market with cap space. I know the Nets are, well, the Nets, but they're going to have a shiny new building in an interesting sports market.

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I agree with your point about an enforcer; earlier in this thread you said that you're a Knick fan, wouldn't a Charles Oakley type player be perfect for Dwight. In the same way Oak protected Ewing for all of those physical wars during the 90's, Dwight needs someone who will act as the same physical deterrent to all of the hard fouls he gets.

Great to see the Spurs bounce back today, should be a good series now. Do wish Rudy Gay was playing though.

Did the Nuggets just shut down today because they were flat about getting hosed in Game 1 or is this it for them? OKC looks a tad bit scary. If the Spurs have a 6-7 game series with Memphis and OKC rolls Denver in 4-5 games, Rnd 2 could get nasty for the Spurs real fast.

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Originally Posted by darjum

I agree with your point about an enforcer; earlier in this thread you said that you're a Knick fan, wouldn't a Charles Oakley type player be perfect for Dwight. In the same way Oak protected Ewing for all of those physical wars during the 90's, Dwight needs someone who will act as the same physical deterrent to all of the hard fouls he gets.

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Problem is its hard to do that in the 4 out 1 in offense...that 4th perimeter guy usually isn't someone that'll mix it up down low in a really physical manner.

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Originally Posted by Acymetric

Problem is its hard to do that in the 4 out 1 in offense...that 4th perimeter guy usually isn't someone that'll mix it up down low in a really physical manner.

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That offense won't work for Dwight moving forward; if his offense game becomes a prominent feature of his value then he needs defensive help down low, he can't do it all himself. Otherwise he'll have a Wilt Chamberlain career, great stats, very few titles.

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Originally Posted by darjum

I agree with your point about an enforcer; earlier in this thread you said that you're a Knick fan, wouldn't a Charles Oakley type player be perfect for Dwight. In the same way Oak protected Ewing for all of those physical wars during the 90's, Dwight needs someone who will act as the same physical deterrent to all of the hard fouls he gets.

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Absolutely, that's exactly who I had in mind. In fact, I think Oak's picture is next to the word "enforcer" in the dictionary. When the Bulls traded Oakley, Jordan was furious about it because he thought the Pistons, etc., would just rough him up with nobody to get his back. But Bill Cartwright, who they got back, used to give Ewing fits.

Sidebar -- for a guy who was certainly the best player I've ever seen, Jordan was not then, and isn't now, a personnel expert. I mean, the guy wanted Joe Wolf over Pippen. Of course, if he had one thing right, he also wanted Johnny Dawkins over colossal bust Brad Sellers. Not that JD was an amazing pro, but that would have been a far better pick, and a guy who could have contributed to those teams.

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Originally Posted by Starter

Absolutely, that's exactly who I had in mind. In fact, I think Oak's picture is next to the word "enforcer" in the dictionary. When the Bulls traded Oakley, Jordan was furious about it because he thought the Pistons, etc., would just rough him up with nobody to get his back. But Bill Cartwright, who they got back, used to give Ewing fits.

Sidebar -- for a guy who was certainly the best player I've ever seen, Jordan was not then, and isn't now, a personnel expert. I mean, the guy wanted Joe Wolf over Pippen. Of course, if he had one thing right, he also wanted Johnny Dawkins over colossal bust Brad Sellers. Not that JD was an amazing pro, but that would have been a far better pick, and a guy who could have contributed to those teams.

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I'm not a huge Isiah Thomas fan as GM, but at least he has a better eye for talent than MJ. Everybody rips Isiah (deservedly) for his contract choices but MJ doesn't receive the same venom for his atrocious GM record. Poor draft picks (except Gerald Henderson of course :cool:) and terrible trades have left two organizations licking their wounds. Of course he didn't ruin the Knicks, which is a major -ve for Isiah.

As someone who appreciated and could analyze hoops in the 90's, MJ is also the best player I have ever seen. But that cuts out about 40 years of watching. I guess he's the GOAT, but maybe there has been better, Russell does have 11 rings after all. Sucks that MJ went to UNC, but nobodies perfect.

As with many players, injuries took away much of what Dawkins could have been. In the thread about Duke's #2 greatest NBA player after G.Hill, I believe had Dawkin's body not betrayed him he would have been a special talent. Maybe not number 2, but right up there.

Because someone brought up Isiah, those interested in an extremely interesting interview with him should check out Jason Whitlock's new recurring podcast, "Real Talk with Jason Whitlock". The 4/6 episode featured an interview with Zeke where he states his claim as being as good as Magic and Bird and that he never gets that kind of credit, addresses the rumor that he substantiated the "Magic got AIDS from gay sex" rumors, and addresses the "Larry Bird would be considered just another player if he were black" comments he made back in the 80s.

Back on the playoffs, based on what I've seen, and I haven't seen Miami, I think this year is more wide open then it has ever been. I see no reason why the Thunder or Bulls can't make the jump to title winner because I think the Celtics are over the hill and the Lakers have lost a step.

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Originally Posted by Billy Dat

Because someone brought up Isiah, those interested in an extremely interesting interview with him should check out Jason Whitlock's new recurring podcast, "Real Talk with Jason Whitlock". The 4/6 episode featured an interview with Zeke where he states his claim as being as good as Magic and Bird and that he never gets that kind of credit, addresses the rumor that he substantiated the "Magic got AIDS from gay sex" rumors, and addresses the "Larry Bird would be considered just another player if he were black" comments he made back in the 80s.

Back on the playoffs, based on what I've seen, and I haven't seen Miami, I think this year is more wide open then it has ever been. I see no reason why the Thunder or Bulls can't make the jump to title winner because I think the Celtics are over the hill and the Lakers have lost a step.

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I brought up Isiah and realistically I can't speak to his nature as a player, as I only started watching American basketball at the beginning of the 90's when he was passed his prime and MJ and the Bulls had just started their run. From what I read and a few old games I have seen he did seem dynamic, but Magic and Bird were half a foot taller and in Magic's case almost a full foot taller. Sometimes you just can't beat height. Certainly a HOF player though.

Indeed, back to the playoffs. I agree with your assessment of both the Bulls and Thunder, but I feel with both teams this is their year to 'learn a hard lesson'. I feel the Thunder are more likely than the Bulls, something about Durant just screams winner. I have a feeling over a 7 game playoff war some of Rose's teammates may not come through for him (none who previously wore Duke uniform obviously :p) and the hole at shooting guard will become an issue.

Like most of the basketball watching public I wasn't in love with how Miami came together last off season, but if I were every other team I would be very scared. Basically every game they played this year was like the opposing teams playoff game and a regular season full of that scrutiny and criticism may bring them together so they can just play basketball in the playoffs. To be honest I hope they don't win it all, but any team with that much talent can't be held down forever.

Isiah was truly an amazing player, one of the greatest ever to play point guard, and probably the greatest of his physical stature. It is too bad the rest of the package was so far from ideal, from the odd and cutting comments that come from his mouth, to his horrendous tenure as a front office executive (although he did well in the NBA drafts), to his less than stellar coaching gigs, to his various legal issues. BUT, his bad rep punches heavier than its weight -he has no felonies on record, etc. He never fails to put his foot in his mouth.

I hear you about the Bulls and Thunder - I have just been so unimpressed by the Celtics and Lakers that I feel like the time is ripe for any of these teams to get hot and grab the brass ring. I agree that the Bulls seem to do a lot of Derrick Rose watching, but the guys is so unstoppable right now that it may be an ok offensive strategy.

Fellow Knicks fans - where do you stand on D'Antoni's coaching this series? I have been defending him, but am starting to lean toward the "he has stunk" camp. Critics are pointing to the fact that he has no timeouts left at the end of the game, his team was not ready to foul with 4 seconds left being down 1, and that he had a bad offensive line-up on the floor for the last possession. What say you?